Alaska... smoke 'em if you got 'em

[av8tor4239]

Check out these minimums from Alaska Airlines web site...

What is this world coming to?
Minimum Qualifications:
Experience: Minimum of 3000 hours total pilot time in fixed wing aircraft. Minimum 1000 PIC hours in multi-engine (turbojet/ turboprop) aircraft or single-engine high performance military jet or 750 hours PIC in multi-engine (turbojet/ turboprop) and 2000 hours SIC in multi-engine (turbojet/ turboprop) aircraft or single-engine high performance military jet. Minimum 50 hours flown within the last 12 months.

Education:Four year degree required from an accredited institution.

Licenses and Certificates: Airline Transport Pilot (ATP)

Health: Applicant must hold current First Class FAA Medical Certificate. Vision must be correctable to 20/20 in both eyes. Non user of nicotine products.

Legal Status: Applicants must be able to prove legal right to work in the United States. A background check will be completed for each applicant.

Candidates must possess:
-Excellent judgment and leadership skills
-Demonstrated command ability and maturity
-Ability to communicate effectively and learn rapidly
-Sound analytical ability and high tolerance to stress
-Professional demeanor and appearance

***Please note that these are minimum requirements and the majority of our applicants considerably exceed these standards.

Equal Opportunity Employer

 

[av8tor4239]

Dont forget.. these mins are as stringent if not more than FedEx, UPS, and many others that pay significatly more than ALaska.. and they are going to tell an applicant they cant smoke..... What a JOKE

I dont even smoke.. and that makes me mad>....

 

[HA25]

I smoke a pipe (no puns please!) between long trips or on breaks.. I'll be danged if I'm gonna quit that for any airline.

 

[jws717]

This is old news, it has been their policy for a number of years now.

 

[Carl_Spackler]

Requiring that new employees be nicotine free is their choice. After the screening I don't think they can keep you from smoking. I'm sure it keeps their cost for health care lower.

 

[Falconjet]

Just think of it as a kind of intelligence test.

FJ

 

[Captain Overs]

I smoke a pipe (no puns please!) between long trips or on breaks.. I'll be danged if I'm gonna quit that for any airline.

But you'll work for $30 dollars an hour first year? How about no medical for 6 months? I can go on. I think smoking is a small thing to get bent over.

 

[frog_flyer]

I had my first cigar in over a year last night.

Anyone had Onyx? Good $5 cigar.

 

[Scrapdog]

Check out these minimums from Alaska Airlines web site...

What is this world coming to?
Minimum Qualifications:
Experience: Minimum of 3000 hours total pilot time in fixed wing aircraft. Minimum 1000 PIC hours in multi-engine (turbojet/ turboprop) aircraft or single-engine high performance military jet or 750 hours PIC in multi-engine (turbojet/ turboprop) and 2000 hours SIC in multi-engine (turbojet/ turboprop) aircraft or single-engine high performance military jet. Minimum 50 hours flown within the last 12 months.

Education:Four year degree required from an accredited institution.

Licenses and Certificates: Airline Transport Pilot (ATP)

Health: Applicant must hold current First Class FAA Medical Certificate. Vision must be correctable to 20/20 in both eyes. Non user of nicotine products.

Legal Status: Applicants must be able to prove legal right to work in the United States. A background check will be completed for each applicant.

Candidates must possess:
-Excellent judgment and leadership skills
-Demonstrated command ability and maturity
-Ability to communicate effectively and learn rapidly
-Sound analytical ability and high tolerance to stress
-Professional demeanor and appearance

***Please note that these are minimum requirements and the majority of our applicants considerably exceed these standards.

Equal Opportunity Employer

Good for them - they want highly qualified candidates with some solid jet PIC time. How exactly is that bad again?

The no nicotine thing is a great deal - they don't want their folks to get lung cancer at 50 or stink everytime they have to go run outside for 5 min to get their nasty habit taken care of.

And most importantly don't mention the 4 year degree thing to pilotyip. For heaven's sakes a major airline actually wants a college grad flying for them.

 

[Scrapdog]

But you'll work for $30 dollars an hour first year? How about no medical for 6 months? I can go on. I think smoking is a small thing to get bent over.

Captain - since you love to throw stones at CAL and you mentioned the no insurance thing for the 1st 6 months, I'll assume you're talking directly about CAL even though you're too coward to actually say it. And if I remember correctly you work for CoEx right?

1st year F/O pay at CAL is indeed 30 dollars/hour...and 5th year pay on a widebody as an F/O is 105 dollars/hour. 10 year capt pay on an LN is 160 dollars/hour. Just curious, how does your airline equate at the same times?

 

[Midnight Flyer]

Dont forget.. these mins are as stringent if not more than FedEx, UPS, and many others that pay significatly more than ALaska.. and they are going to tell an applicant they cant smoke..... What a JOKE

I dont even smoke.. and that makes me mad>....

Have you ever had to fly a month with a Captain that smokes?

1. pi$$ed off and disgruntled on flights in excess of 2 1/2 hours.
2. breath smells like an a$$, with a side of $hit.
3. Taxing like hell to get to the gate to go find a place to smoke.


Telling an applicant they can't smoke is the best thing in the world. It even makes our insurance rates lower since we're not wasting insurance money on treating the smokers who suffer from lung cancer and emphysema.

 

[737 Pylt]

av8tor4239 vbmenu_register("postmenu_1210536", true);
Ohplease! SUX



Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 321
Civ/Mil: Civi
A/C Flown: ATR 72, EMB 145
Ratings: comm
Curr Position: FIDO
Total Time: 0 TPIC
Posts: 321

I like the highlighted part......ohplease is a real tool! He's also in management training as well!

737

 

[Captain Overs]

Captain - since you love to throw stones at CAL and you mentioned the no insurance thing for the 1st 6 months, I'll assume you're talking directly about CAL even though you're too coward to actually say it. And if I remember correctly you work for CoEx right?

1st year F/O pay at CAL is indeed 30 dollars/hour...and 5th year pay on a widebody as an F/O is 105 dollars/hour. 10 year capt pay on an LN is 160 dollars/hour. Just curious, how does your airline equate at the same times?

Coward? Not really, just making a comment without bringing innocent bystanders into it. Who said anything about CAL? Are you starting to get a complex over your career choices?

Let me break it down into a simpler format for you since you seem to be paranoid.

Guy (A) complans because company (A) doesn't allow it's employees to use nicotine. Guy (B) says "I'll do what I want and they can kiss my a##!" Although he doesn't realize that by getting myopic on the nicotine issue he's taken a job at company (B) that has more issues affecting his quality of life other than the use or non use of nicotine.

Follow?

 

[Ty Webb]

Guys. . . . get a grip.

We fly airplanes for a living . . . safely, efficiently, and professionally- period.

The more you let management dictate their little perversions to you, the more you erode our abilities to live our lives as we choose. Some of you really need to get a grip. If you think working with a smoker is so tough, I'm sure that smoker has developed some ideas about what it's like to work with a candy-ass like yourself. . . . and, no, I don't smoke.


.

 

[rod farva]

Other side of the coin. Do pax think when they see a pilot smoke, "He's not even taking care of his own life, and I'm trusting him with mine?" No flame, serious question.

 

[Hagar17]

Have you ever had to fly a month with a Captain that smokes?

1. pi$$ed off and disgruntled on flights in excess of 2 1/2 hours.
2. breath smells like an a$$, with a side of $hit.
3. Taxing like hell to get to the gate to go find a place to smoke.

I flew with a LCA at AA who smoked and drank coffee all day. His breath could have knocked a buzzard off a sh!t wagon.

Like a Tic Tac, Captain?

 

[VABB]

Requiring that new employees be nicotine free is their choice. After the screening I don't think they can keep you from smoking. I'm sure it keeps their cost for health care lower.

Think of the bright side - if they pass age 60 to 65, you can bet most if not all of the smokers will medical out before then. If you are senior to me the cigs are on me.

 

[maru657]

Those requirements are not what I'd call high experience. In fact I would say their requirements relegate experience and qualifications to the trash bin in favor of cosmetic appearance. For years Delta had an excellent record with a bunch of old crop duster pilots who probably smoked and drank to excess on occasion and were lucky to have even a high school diploma. Then some brain trust decided it all be OK if they just required a different sort of pilot. After all, given enough bananas you could teach a monkey to fly. In theory. You could walk down an Atlanta concourse in the 80's and note that they were all starting to look alike. The new Aryan Airmen. Of course it all came apart with smoking hole after hole, landing at wrong airports etc. American went through the same process and re-discovered the need for pilots who actually knew what it was all about during the 90's. I suspect that Alaskan will re-discover that a degree does not garuntee that the wings will stay on at some point in the future and that there is no substitute for actual experience. Till then, happy landings, where-ever they wind up.

P.S. Yes I know that I could have used spell checker. Must be that lack of education, but then I've never bent any sheet metal. I think I'll have a shot of booze and a smoke and comtemplate the error of my ways.

 

[Carl_Spackler]

AK pilots correct me if I'm wrong, but the way I understand it is that you are screened for nicotine once when you are interviewed/hired. After that you can smoke if want and there is nothing they can do. They just figure if you get hired as a non smoker, you will stay a non smoker.

 

[Fins Up]

Other side of the coin. Do pax think when they see a pilot smoke, "He's not even taking care of his own life, and I'm trusting him with mine?" No flame, serious question.

I don't think whether or not a pilot smokes has any impact whatsoever on his/her ability to operate the aircraft safely.

I don't smoke and think it's a disgusting waste of time and money, but again I wouldn't just anyone's piloting skills by their smoking habit.

 

[Jeepman]

Whats as bad as a smoker. Someone who chews. I had the pleasure of getting on a plane one time & the previous Capt. left his spit bottle. Real nice. I even heard of someone chewing and sneezed their nastiness all over the flight deck.

Look guys, if you want to smoke & chew then you must decide whats more important, lung cancer, or a chance to work for Alaska. Yes, the pay isn't as great as it should be but there are other reasons to go there.

 

[Tarquinn]

I was given both a drug test and a nicotine test when I was hired. If you want to use tobacco after that it's up to you. I guess they figure adults don't take up smoking for the fun of it. It usually happens when we're dumb kids...

 

[FNG_that's me]

there is no substitute for actual experience.

Well, education + intelligence + experience is better than just luck and experience.

Also, variety of experience is huge as well. What's that old saying, 5000 hours is quite different than 1 hour 5000 times.

 

[Ty Webb]

Other side of the coin. Do pax think when they see a pilot smoke, "He's not even taking care of his own life, and I'm trusting him with mine?" No flame, serious question.

You've got to be kidding me . . . . . Someone who makes judgements about people based upon whether or not they smoke has got an awful lot of growing up to do.

Let's cross off the smokers, and certainly anyone who has a motorcycle. A 35 year old with a head injury costs a lot more to take care of than a smoker, who dies relatively quickly. How about the fatties- what's your cholesterol score? Over 190 = Forget it.

Let's get them off the list, too. and the females- they could get pregnant, and be out for quite a while . . . . certainly all of the general aviation types that are out flying around in their own airplanes. . . . skiers, boaters, rock climbing, skydiving . . . . anything that I decide is too risky or might impact our health insurance costs or simply doesn't look good to me to have a pilot doing is grounds to not be hired.

Enough is enough . . . . This a j-o-b. It's a good job, but it is still a job. Show up on time, do your job in a competent and professional manner, and go home. Letting them dictate to you what you do on your time off? Are you kidding?

 

[blzr]

Three things that make an airplane fly:

Caffine, Kerosine, and Nicotine... not necessarily in that order.

There should be a no farting policy in place too.. I hate the PC Police.

 

[Whine Lover]

f2r35

 

[embdrvr]

It's too bad they don't make a distinction between regular and occasional nicotine users. Someone who enjoys a cigar 3 or 4 times a year for special occasions is not the same thing as a chain smoker.
I wish my airline would quit hiring FA's that need a smoke break so often they end up making us late. I've gotten stuck with FA's that take a smoke break and don't make it back in time to get an ontime departure.
I don't care if people smoke but if it interferes with job performance that's a different story.

 

[mach none]

Ty:

Don't worry, when we merge you will be grandfathered in and we only nicotine screen new hires.

 

[michael707767]

You've got to be kidding me . . . . . Someone who makes judgements about people based upon whether or not they smoke has got an awful lot of growing up to do.

I disagree. I would not use a doctor who smoked. I don't think its a stretch to say if someone is stupid enough to smoke I don't want my life in thier hands.

I support Alaska and thier decision to not hire smokers. Bottom line, if you want to smoke go work somewhere else.

 

[VABB]

I'm real surprised TWADude hasn't chimed in yet with his typical pro-ACLU rhetoric regarding this topic.