Aircraft certified for known icing??

[jetdriven]

To the person who stated that aircraft before 1974 aren't certified for known icing?
Is that just for light twins?
What about DC-3's Beech 18's and Convair's, I've seen lots of those with de-icing equipment and flogging through the ice in winter??
Or were you just refering to light twins?
Do the manufat. publish a list of serial numbers that are certified?


Im not sure. as far as my knowedge about this matter is private small planes, single and twin. Certainly airliners are known icing.

 

[Timebuilder]

I'm sure avbug will have a more definitive opinion, but from what I been able to gather, there was simply no "regulatory" requirement to certify an aircraft for known icing before 1974. At that point, regulations went into effect that mandated a difference between these two standards of aircraft certification.

 

[cjh]

Looking for something else and came across this thread.

Regarding certification of older aircraft, my 1969 Piper Navajo is certified for flight into known icing. Here's the info from the AFM.

"When this airplane was delivered it contained the properly installed equipment listed in the rear of this manual and, therefore, was satisfoctory for the types of operation indicated below by an asterisk.

3.a. Light to moderate icing after de-icing and icing equpment listed on page for operating in icing conditions has been installed in accordance with Piper drawings or in an FAA approved manner.
b. Light to moderate icing."

It then goes on to say that changing any of the installed equipment may prevent it from being used as originally approved. Under the equipment list for various flight conditions it continues with:

"Light to Moderate Icing
1. All equpment required for night IFR
2. Wing and tail de-icing system
3. Heated windshield
4. Static wicks
5. Shielded antennas
6. Heated pitot tube
7. Propeller de-icing
8. Elevator horn de-icing boot"


The "FAA approved manner" language in the first quote certainly sounds like there was regulatory language back then.

 

[Timebuilder]

I agree.

I was told (and of course ANY discussion of regulations between two pilots can be considered guesswork, at best) that the regulatory phrase "approved for flight into known icing" was part of a new approach in the regualtions, and that after 1974 the placard began to appear indicationg approval or disapproval for flight into known icing conditions, and language went into effect that determined the standards required.

What say you, Avbug? Was I given some bad information?

 

[cjh]

Upon further reading!

Here's some more info from my AFM, which certainly continues to point to the fact that the regs were there before 1974.

"Pilots are warned that the following lists are based on the FAR's as of January 11, 1966, and that they are responsible for complying with amendments issued after this date". The lists that follow include day and night VFR and IFR, flight in positive control areas, and Light to Moderate Icing. (BTW, the AFM also specifically prohibits flight through known or forecast heavy icing!!)

On the subject of placards, my AFM has a host of them but none pertaining to icing. Perhaps that was a later modification contributing to the belief that the reg itself went into effect in the 70's.

 

[Timebuilder]

Perhaps that was a later modification contributing to the belief that the reg itself went into effect in the 70's.

That may be it.

A major overhaul of the 1966 regs might consitute the basis for just such a belief.

 

[TurboS7]

Now we have moving map displays, GPS, hot props, boots and all that good stuff. So I guess what we get now is high tech icing, I guess the guys in N.H. found out how a Cherokee Six handles iciing with a load. I think the whole world has become icing complacent, so here we go in a full circle again all bought with blood. I took off from DTW the other night with an RVR of 1500 in snow and fog. I had to get the airplane deiced before I left due to 2 inches of rime left there from the previous crew. I knew there may be ice, I was on top at 6000 feet with neg ice. I called up flight watch and passed that on to them and they acted like they could have cared less. When I was flying up north I would die waiting for a Pirep like that. I told myself if I ever flew an airliner I would surely pass the info on. I guess if the system doesn't care then way should the user. Be careful guys ice will kill you.