Air Midwest #5481 Investigation Update

[Huck]

Nothing beats the MD-80 crash in DFW a few years back, where an F/A was in the cockpit chatting during the taxi out. At one point the F/O said, "Hey let's talk about your sex life, so it will be on the transcript if we crash."

 

[Vladimir Lenin]

Nothing beats the MD-80 crash in DFW a few years back, where an F/A was in the cockpit chatting during the taxi out. At one point the F/O said, "Hey let's talk about your sex life, so it will be on the transcript if we crash."

addy or a docket number, plz?

 

[sf3boy]

While the sterile cockpit rule was not in full effect on this flight, I do not see that it was a contributor to what happened. The W&B of the airlpane, to me, seems to be the root of the problem.

I would say that on average at my airline, the saabs are overweight by 200-500 pounds when they start getting full with passengers. They (management) in the last year and a half have lowered what the standard bags weigh in order to put more on. They have also informed the ramp agents to not count "heavy" bags unless they look like a certain picture on a bag description list, regardless of the actual weight. Example: duffle bag full of wrenches and bowling balls weighs 67 lbs. It gets counted as 28 lbs. Almost every bag weighs over 28 lbs, but they only get counted as 28 so we can load more of them legally in the plane.

 

[328dude]

Chilling to read. I think almost everyone is guilty of non complience with the sterile rule to an extent.

www.airdisaster.com or something like that. THey have a recording of that Delta flight. That accident is a very good reason for the sterile below ten rule and could have been avoided, which was not the case for our fallin comrades.

Kinda makes all the bickering between regional carriers and ego's from pilots's ridiculous when we lose anyone from another carrier.
We all human and do the same thing. Regardless of what airplane you fly.

 

[chperplt]

The W&B of the airlpane, to me, seems to be the root of the problem.

The final report won't be out for a while yet, but I don't think weight will be the primary cause of this accident.

The prelim already shows maintenance issues with the elevator system. One of the cables was installed incorrectly and appears to have come off. The weight of the aircraft did not cause the cable to come off its pulley.

Granted, the old system of calculating weight was outdated and unsafe. The new weights are more in line with reality, and some of the required procedural changes that are now coming into effect are for definitely for the good.

Anyone who has flown that airplane knows it's a truck. It can haul 19 people and a sh!t load of cargo and do the deed just fine.

 

[Huck]

I hesitated to name the carrier, but it was DAL, back in the late eighties, I think. Flaps were mis-set, though there are more than a few who think that the fuel was out of balance (gauges were MEL'd).

As my fuzzy memory recalls, the CVR tapes were demanded by a plaintiff lawyer in Texas, and the state judge ordered them to be handed over. They ended up being played on the evening news. ALPA got up some steam and got a federal law passed barring the discovery of actual tapes in court cases (transcripts only).

 

[Typhoon1244]

Nothing beats the MD-80 crash in DFW a few years back, where an F/A was in the cockpit chatting during the taxi out. At one point the F/O said, "Hey let's talk about your sex life, so it will be on the transcript if we crash."

It was a 727, actually.

The F/O later asserted that he couldn't remember anything from the time they left the gate. Post-traumatic stress, you know.

 

[stillaboo]

The prelim already shows maintenance issues with the elevator system. One of the cables was installed incorrectly and appears to have come off. The weight of the aircraft did not cause the cable to come off its pulley.

There is a powerpoint presentation available on the website that shows the actual elevator cables and turnbuckles from the wreckage, as well as the elevator travel recorded on the FDR both before and after the maintence. One of the cables is clearly much longer than the other as a result of the turnbuckles being manually adjusted. It is though that contract maintenance adjusted these cables incorrectly. As a result, the full deflection of the elevators would yeild less than full elevator down. It is likely that the pilots no longer had full command authority over the aircraft, particular with respect to the nose down attitude.

We can theorize that, with the plane loaded a bit out of its CG, too heavy and aft of the envelope in retrospect, though technically legally within the CG at the time (again, see the PP show of the NTSB), the plane would tend to pitch nose up. The crew, being unable to command the proper amount of nose down b/c of the improperly long elevator cable, could not maintain proper attitude, which resulted in the stall.

The investigation is still in progress, of course, but after reviewing more than just the CVR, the FDR and the turnbuckes recovered clearly indicate something amiss with the pitch control of the aircraft. The CVR just affirms this.

I have yet to see any indication that the cables came off the pullys. Perhaps I missed it.

I only hope that Capt. Leslie and FO Gibbs' actions will help us further improve upon the safety of commercial air travel. May they and their passengers experience blue skies and tailwinds forever.

-Boo!

 

[Vladimir Lenin]

DCA88MA072 is the report number for that Delta accident. They didn't configure flaps/slats properly, and it seems as though aural warning chime wasn't working. Coupled with all the chit-chat, they got a randevouz with an ILS installation at the airport.
Couldn't find a CVR though

 

[DCitrus9]

The engines were started at 8:25 and they were cleared for takeoff at 8:45. That does not seem like a large amount of chatter for 20 minutes of taxi, much of which was probably with parking brake set while waiting in line.

 

[T-Gates]

I don't know how many days of my flying started off just as innocently as thiers did. You never know...... RIP

--03M

 

[328dude]

www.airdisaster.com/download2/dl1141.shtml

CVR Audio FIle. Turn your volume up and your Bass down to be able to hear it.

Creepy!

 

[rjcap]

I don't know how many days of my flying started off just as innocently as thiers did. You never know...... RIP

DITTO !!