AIR INC & Kit Darby, Disappointment

[bobbysamd]

. . . . and perhaps a little straight talk

For those of you who are looking to get "face time" with the recruiters, how many of you would be interested in another Aviation Interviews Job fair . . . . Last year we had ASA and ATA and around 75 pilots attended. Yes, I know this is "small" compared to some other job fairs, but most of the people who attended liked this because it gave them a lot more "face time" with the recruiters.
I'm not doing this to sell you books, or any other garbage. All I'm trying to do is help out my colleagues land a new job . . . .

As long as the pilot recruiters are meeting with pilots in good faith, this is something I would support and probably attend if I were still in the job search.

 

[CorpFlyBoy67]

For those of you who are looking to get "face time" with the recruiters, how many of you would be interested in another Aviation Interviews Job fair? I set up the first one last summer and I look forward to having many more!
Last year it was $25 per person (this covered the cost of the convention center), this year I hope to do it even cheaper! It all depends upon how many people we can get through the door.
Last year we had ASA and ATA and around 75 pilots attended. Yes, I know this is "small" compared to some other job fairs, but most of the people who attended liked this because it gave them a lot more "face time" with the recruiters.
I'm not doing this to sell you books, or any other garbage. All I'm trying to do is help out my colleagues land a new job.
Here are a few pics from the job fair last summer
http://www.aviationinterviews.com/pilotjobfair/

Some of you might be wondering what happens to the money that is made by the web site.....
Most of it is given away in scholarships for aviation students
http://www.aviationinterviews.com/scholarship2003.php

I look forward to your comments and suggestions.

Mike,

That cost is more in line with how it should be. I commend you for helping fellow pilots in this way. Also, for giving scholarships to others...

Kit is just a snake oil salesman. Most job fairs the employers pay for a both there. Not sure how Kit works his - but he should not pay for his seminars off the backs of furloughed pilots.

As far as the comment by Nindiri - what interviews have you gotten off your resume that Air Inc produced for you? I had my resume done by them a few years ago and got nothing.

Then, I had my resume done by Kathy at The Write Resume and I landed a job right away. I don't believe in trying to "learn to write a resume". That is not my profession. I leave it to a true professional who does this as a career. I fly planes. I highly recommend anyone who wants to have their resume and cover letters done right to visit Kathy's website at www.awriteresume.com

She emails you a copy of your resume and cover letter and you can make all the changes you want yourself. No wait time involved cause you are doing it yourself.

As far as interview prep goes - I tried to get information from Air Inc about a company and I knew more than the person trying to help me on the phone. Do your research, follow the comments on this board and read any news that will help you make a decision. I would say that it is more valuable to do prep with people that are experts in each individual airline, then someone who knows nothing about any specific airline process. There are resources on this board and when I decide to go to the airlines (if I do) then I will use someone on this board.

Jeff

 

[Speedbird34]

Anyone know the name of the ATA chief pilot at the job fair. an excellent gentleman who gives the speeches about his many other airline interveiws. I got an application through him and a interveiw with Northwest airlink Pinnacle at Kit Darby job fair.
Lonnie Robinson is a great guy who represents OBAP (organisation of Black Airline Pilots ) in the USA and he has lots of pull in the industry and I would be happy to give him my resume.

 

[Ty Webb]

The problem with companies using the Air Inc. job fair is that when you make a de facto requirement to attend one of these things, it requires applicants pay "bahksheesh" to Kit, the airline job pimp.

As for the naive person who wondered why companies would attend this thing if they weren't interested in hiring applicants-

did you ever think that this might give them a chance to eyeball candidates who can help them "Diversify"?

Hmmmmmmn.

 

[Publishers]

Why

Why would a recruiter go even when they are not hiring.

Well, first of all let us start with the part that it costs them nothing to go at all.

Secondly, recruiters tend to flock together and like to visit each other. A free hotel, some free drinks, and a couple of days out of town, sounds good to me.

Third, well that is the part where Kit begs them to come. Many of the recruiters like to see a grown 737 senior captain grovel for their attention. OR buy their drinks.

Lastly, many of these recruiters are trying to find a better job themselves. In thh old AEPS jobfair days, more recruiting went on after it was over than during it. Plying a fellow recruiter with free drinks, especially ones that are Kits, well it does not get much better than that.

 

[Nindiri]

CorpFlyBoy67

Using the AirInc resume, I was invited to interviews at ASA, Comair, Airlink, and Commutair. I don't believe it was specifically because I used AirInc, but simply because the resume was professionally done. As you said, I don't want to take the time to become an expert resume writer when I can just let a professional do it for me. My choice of the AirInc service was simply because I was familiar with their work, but other resume services could have done as well.

 

[Ty Webb]

Re: Why

Geez, why don't we just cut out the middleman, bring the recruiters somewhere warm in the winter, ply them with complimentary schnocktails and have a big ol' time?

I've already got a job, but I would go just to have fun!

 

[TheGuat]

I'm an AirInc member, hopefully it will payoff with an RJ right seat.

 

[bobbysamd]

Rotsa ruck

I'm an AirInc member, hopefully it will payoff with an RJ right seat.

I hope it will, too, before Kit takes too much of your money.

In the meantime, if I were you I'd be thinking more about that first job out of flight training than that RJ seat. Kit doesn't provide much help to entry-level job-seekers.

 

[Ty Webb]

I'm an AirInc member, hopefully it will payoff with an RJ right seat.

You might be better off spending that money on a boob job.

If the flying thing doesn't work out for you, maybe the National Enquirer will buy you a 737 type rating in exchange for your "story'.

 

[TheGuat]

What was that remark about?

 

[CorpFlyBoy67]

I'm an AirInc member, hopefully it will payoff with an RJ right seat.

With 223 hours of TTL time, I think you will have to be an Air Inc. member for a LONG time for it to pay off in an RJ seat.

Not to sound discouraging, but I hope you have a better plan than relying on someone else to get you the RJ job.

My best advice to you is to listen to the sage advice on this board, read everything you can and have a specific plan in mind.

 

[TheGuat]

With 223 hours of TTL time, I think you will have to be an Air Inc. member for a LONG time for it to pay off in an RJ seat.

Not to sound discouraging, but I hope you have a better plan than relying on someone else to get you the RJ job.

My best advice to you is to listen to the sage advice on this board, read everything you can and have a specific plan in mind.

Did i say ANYTHING that i would be going to an RJ right seat anytime soon? I take all the advice here seriously.

 

[j328driver]

I went to one seminar for the sole purpose of getting face time. 90% of the day is self-serving hype to get you to buy stuff (which you don't have to and I never did). But I did get to meet 2-3 people that I wanted to make a first impression with.

Later, at an interview one of those people recognized my face (it was obvious he had that look of "I've seen you before") and I'd like to think that it helped.

So, in the end I paid $150 for a decent chicken lunch and 10 minutes of time with someone that I wanted to meet me. I accepted this as a resonable sum of $ to risk as an investment in my career.

For my money I got exactly what I expected to get. I used a service that someone made available to me. It worked for me and it might or might not work for you. Or, it might or might not be a cost that you are willing to accept. Nothing wrong with that.

As for someone "pitching" to improve their business - hey, that's captialism and "caveat emptor."

BTW - I thought that all those seminars and workshops would be a great collection of services for military transitions. It's kinda like one stop shopping for launching your civilian career. I was a commissioned officer in one of our esteemed services (but not a pilot) and that was one thought I took away from my experience.

I definitely agree that the whole L.R. thing seemed a bit insensitive and the "hiring stats" for the year are unbelievably misleading (the recycling thing).

Anyway, my .02. If you're smart enough to check things out here on this forum (and others) and to question things (beforehand) you can go there and get what you're expecting to get.

Cheers.

 

[Treme]

Pretty good magazine though.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

Later, at an interview one of those people recognized my face (it was obvious he had that look of "I've seen you before") and I'd like to think that it helped.

I had two interviews in which I was interviewed by the very person who's hand I shook at the convention. I'm sure they remembered my little finger-tickle tecnique in my handshake with the simultaneous wink. Seriously, though, one recruiter flat-out told me right away she remembered me from Dallas before I could even mention it. The other, when I introduced myself, I said "Good Morning, Mr.____. My name is ______, we met briefly at the airinc convention in Dallas. It's nice to see you again." Did it help? I dunno, but couldn't have hurt.

 

[Ty Webb]

Well put.

I think what most of us object to is the hucksterism and the fact that these things could be put on for maybe $20. bucks a head instead of charging ten times that so that KD can pad his pockets with the money of furloughed pilots.

If he had any sympathy for the less fortunate (some of whom decided to Come! Be a Pilot based on his self-serving promotions) then he would charge a nominal fee and make up the rest with sponsors. . . . CFI Booth sponsored by Ramen noodles, etc.

I went to one seminar for the sole purpose of getting face time. 90% of the day is self-serving hype to get you to buy stuff (which you don't have to and I never did). But I did get to meet 2-3 people that I wanted to make a first impression with.

Later, at an interview one of those people recognized my face (it was obvious he had that look of "I've seen you before") and I'd like to think that it helped.

So, in the end I paid $150 for a decent chicken lunch and 10 minutes of time with someone that I wanted to meet me. I accepted this as a resonable sum of $ to risk as an investment in my career.

For my money I got exactly what I expected to get. I used a service that someone made available to me. It worked for me and it might or might not work for you. Or, it might or might not be a cost that you are willing to accept. Nothing wrong with that.

As for someone "pitching" to improve their business - hey, that's captialism and "caveat emptor."

BTW - I thought that all those seminars and workshops would be a great collection of services for military transitions. It's kinda like one stop shopping for launching your civilian career. I was a commissioned officer in one of our esteemed services (but not a pilot) and that was one thought I took away from my experience.

I definitely agree that the whole L.R. thing seemed a bit insensitive and the "hiring stats" for the year are unbelievably misleading (the recycling thing).

Anyway, my .02. If you're smart enough to check things out here on this forum (and others) and to question things (beforehand) you can go there and get what you're expecting to get.

Cheers. [/B]

 

[N tha jungle]

Attitude is everything

Sure, these seminars are expensive- and if you walk around all day thinking how bad you got "swindled" you're not going to have a good day with the recruiters. As said before, "What you're paying for is the face-time." I didn't go to the morning meeting or lunch, just got there in time to stand in the long lines and get my resume into the "received at Air inc seminar stack." Use this to your advantage and put on your happy face when you meet these guys. Tell them you would be excited to fly with XXX airlines. That's what i did and it worked. Three calls for interviews, two job offers. I realize this is not everybody's outcome. The seminar itself does not get you hired. Its the combination of good flying experience, good resume, good personality, ETC.......

P.S. For newbies in the industry, take alook at the monthly newsletter by kit(maybe you can buy just one issue instead of getting taken for a whole year?) and send a proof-read resume to all companies you are seeking employment with. YES, i know you could reseach all this on the net or whatever for free, but i think it would be worth the couple bucks to get current info in one place. Also maybe raa.org or raa.com may help.

 

[DLslug]

Timing is everything!

Attended seminar Nov '97 (DFW), interviewed with Delta 2 months later Jan '98 after speaking with Plato Ryne and handing him resume.

It worked at the time because, well, times were good. Long lines with many airlines that were all hiring.

Hang in there.

 

[Lear70]

First, I had a chance to talk with Lonnie in January. He was NOT there representing USAirways in any way shape or form and did NOT speak on behalf of USAirways at all. The post earlier in this thread was referring to LAST year's (Jan 2003) DFW Career Fair where I was as stunned as everyone else. Not saying it to defend him, but he wasn't put up on stage THIS year as a USAirways recruiter when he's worried about HIS OWN job and pension.

Secondly, on the thought that "there must be another way"... WHY does ANYONE continue to go to the first half of the day? We ALL know it's bullsh*t designed to sell his products. I go to the one in DFW every year and sometimes in Atlanta but not since Delta stopped hiring - may go to the one this year for Air Tran, but back on subject. I've landed two of my aviation jobs DIRECTLY from those career fairs and haven't been to the morning session since '99.

Plan: Pay for seminar only. Do not need hotel room Friday night as I non-rev / jumpseat in early Saturday morning. Van to hotel, arrive just in time for free lunch. Meet up with old friends from Express One and other jobs for fun b.s. session in lobby during 2 last hours of "buy this stuff" session. Return for airline informational forum and meet-and-greet session. Go drink beer. Get hotel room, drink more beer. Call up ex-girlfriends in Dallas to come party, drink more beer and mix with margaritas. Wake up with hangover sometime Sunday just in time to jumpseat back to domicile and sit Late Ready Reserve.

Hey, it's not perfect, but it beats falling asleep in the morning while recruiters watch from the wings and there's no WAY I'd have a decent job right now if I hadn't gone to the AIR Inc fair in '01... just not sure I made the right decision between EJA and PCL... Hindsight isn't always 20/20!

Good luck to all!