Ahhh!!! I can't take it anymore/SECURITY

[flight-crew]

Maybe I'm one of the members on this board who gets more pi.ssed than others when dealing with security (minimum wage McDonalds workers right off the boat, on their own little power trip), but I finally had one of the worst days of my life yesterday dealing with security.

The story is way too long to go into on here, but between getting all the random security checks when jumpseating and all the other bs, I'm just completely disgusted at what flight crews have to go through just to WORK and do their jobs. I wish ALPA would just decide to shut everything down with a complete work stoppage until the Universal Access System was implemented where flight crews could bypass security and avoid being harassed. I guarantee you that if ALPA did that, shi.t would happen quickly. VERY QUICKLY. Actions speak a lot louder than words. I say screw all of this lobbying "nice guy" stuff. It's time to get down and dirty. I'd like to see how long the country would function without air travel. The TSA and FAA would get their heads out of their a.sses very fast and come up with a system faster than a speeding bullet.

But obviously what I'm describing isn't going to happen. So all the flight crews will just continue to get harassed and deal with all the bs. So what do most of you guys do to handle it? Any techniques that you've come up with?

 

[328dude]

Since the TSA is slowely taking over, I can guarentee they are making more then most regional FOs and some CAPT's. Sad aint it.

 

[skypine69]

flight-crew....
yeah i agree with you....! if you look at some of my past posts i have been advocating a nation wide walkout of all crews to get this fixed. I was watching the "random" screening the other day in Fresno and was simply amazed to see the screener running the had wand over a persons bare arms and legs! What the he!! are they going to hide in there??? I went thru the employee check point at the UAL terminal in SFO and was not in uniform. I was "selected" for additional hand wand screening (i guess they are always supposed to be screening someone). At an employee check point!!! Who are they trying to impress??? All the employees already know the security is worthless...why not spend the resources trying to impress the general public. They are the ones they need trick into thinking they are safe again!

i get so pi$$ed off just thinking about!

 

[chperplt]

I must be the lucky one.. I never have a problem anywhere.

 

[1900laker]

We feel your pain brother,

One of the new TSA (shimmering light, and voices from heaven here) security gate screeners at BWI was doing another computer generated selection screening of me while I was jumpseating to work the other day. Opened my Flight case and immediately said uh oh, we got a problem.

This was after he had already groped me down, made me unbuckle my belt and TROUSERS to inspect behind, flipped through my wallet piece by piece and COMMENTED ON THE LOW AMOUNT OF CASH I HAD ON ME AT THE TIME!!!

Anyways back to the flight case. He was commenting on my FAA required 2 D-cell battery flashlight. He said, "Oh you can't take this; it's considered a heavy tool or a blunt force weapon." I kindly tried to explain that I am required to have that item with me a part of my equipment. He stood firm as did I. I was the last person to be screened and now the flight was being delayed. The 4 or so SWA gate agents were standing their in amasement of this screener guy. After 2-3 minutes of discussing the situation, I suggested he talk to the captain of this flight and see what he thought. So the screener and a couple of agents went down to talk to the captain. They came back and the screener said,"Well, OK, as long as you realize this is violating my regulations by allowing this!" The gate agent says, "Yeah, the captain said to all of us that he has that same exact model of flashlight in his flight bag as well."

I had time to think about it more as I stewed over it on the 1.5 hour flight to STL, and this is what I have decided. I'm furloughed now, so doesn't matter, but after recall, the next screener I begin having any problems with, I am going to immediately ask for his/her supervisor to arrive on location. I will hold up the operation until that time. I may ultimately lodge an official complaint against the screener. While these people will be impossible to get fired now that they are federal employees, their possible promotions might be affected in this manner, and while their buddies get to step up to making 60 grand a year, these idiots will be stuck making 35 for their career.

I believe some sort of organized effort to picket security on a nation wide effort would definately gain the media's attention no less, and might just get us that national ID and separate screening we are so desperately seeking. Who knows. But I do know that the longer the current system remains as is, the harder it is going to be to change it.

 

[herb]

I jumpseated on UAL the other day. They always screen the jumpseater, even though you still can't sit in the cockpit. The security screener took every single credit card, license, etc out of my wallet and looked at it. I've had them look through my wallet...but never take everything out. Yeah, I was mad, but glad to get the jumpseat.

 

[1900laker]

Hey Chperplt, do you commute or jumpseat frequently?

 

[Cornelius]

I'm one of the lucky few that is based at an airport where I don't have to go through security, but I have jumpseated a lot and seen screening at its worst and best.

Speaking of going through wallets, I was jumpseating from La Guardia last week and a business man on the flight who was randomly screened had most of his money ripped off from him by one of those TSA guys. While you're getting wanded there were about 4 tsa guys going through luggage, wallets, jackets, or anything else at another table you couldn't see. The problem is you can't see what those sneaky bastards are up to. The victim was pissed and then he started getting everybody on the plane pissed off as well.

 

[chperplt]

1900laker,

Not as much as most I'm sure, but I commute LAX/LAS to the east coast and back quite a bit.

 

[TurboS7]

I fly out of BWI all the time and have found the TSA guys there to be more than nice. They talk and joke and seem to enjoy their job. Maybe they picked up your bad attitude, that will cause just you a heap of trouble, so change it.

 

[Typhoon1244]

This wasn't a TSA issue, but I found one neat way to handle these security issues.

I was in CHS the other day, showed up early for our flight because I was returning a rental car. (Went over to see the sircraft carrier, you know.) When the plane we're scheduled to fly out shows up, I go up to the gate and ask if I can go down and take the aircraft off the inbound crews' hands so they don't have to shut everything down. Save us a lot of time that way.

I was told by this Delta agent that I couldn't be allowed access to my plane without a dispatch release with my name on it...and it hadn't come up yet. So I made myself comfortable.

Ten minutes later--and by now the rest of my crew had arrived--another Deltoid runs up with this sad story about their holiday schedule. They're gonna need our gate for another aircraft, and could we depart fifteen minutes early?

I looked at my watch and said that I'd love to help, but our scheduled duty-in time was still twenty minutes away, and they'd just have to wait. After all, I couldn't force my crew to work during their down-time, could I?

Hey, if they want to follow the rules to the point of absurdity, so can I. We left one minute early, by the way. The other flight rolled up right as we pushed back, so no gate conflict anyway.

I'm not certain which is worse; being jerked around by newly-empowered screeners or newly-empowered gate agents.

 

[1900laker]

I fly out of BWI all the time and have found the TSA guys there to be more than nice. They talk and joke and seem to enjoy their job. Maybe they picked up your bad attitude, that will cause just you a heap of trouble, so change it.

I assume you must know my attitude in the terminal? Have you ever seen me getting screened? And BWI is your home or your base airport?

Your right the guy who was searching through my wallet was joking all right. These idiots nor you don't realize that having every personal item on your person and belongings searched (to the point of the screener feeling behind my waistband on the front of my person) is highly invasive and should require the upmost professionalism during the search. Additionally, my point to begin with was that the same people that were running security before at BWI, are now dressed up as the TSA, but no additional training has been given to these folks. In fact, I have been carrying that flashlight with me in and out of BWI since September 14th 2001 and no one has questioned it until now. There is no standardization amongst these screeners, except the obvious guns, knifes, bombs, box cutters. But beyond that, many feel that they can just make up their own rules about what gets through and what doesn't. Their was an old lady screener at a checkpoint in DTW that consistently every day demanded that flight crews remove their shoes for x-ray inspection, even if they could pass through the metal detector without setting it off. That is contradictory to the security directive that was issued to directors of security at all airlines. Nobody is supervising these people to make sure they are getting it right.

Sorry if you have a problem with that attitude, but I refuse to be the meek sheep who will not say something when something is definately wrong.

BTW, I do not have a problem with many screeners that I have come in contact with, and think they are doing a fine and professional job, but the percentage is still way to high of the incompetent ones.

 

[Dep676]

I have only flew a few times since 9/11 and have been picked for "random screening" tiwce. The first was terrible it was a guy and 2 ladies that could barely speak english. That is were the problem was. You want to work in this country and look through my personal belongings. You better be able to understand me and I better be able to understand you. The one lady had a big chip on her shoulder. I would have liked to take it off for her and put her in her place. You all know what would happen then I would be the bad guy. The second time wasn't nearly as bad. They barley even looked at my stuff just opened my brief case and looked in. Didn't take everything out like MS. Barney badA$$. Then once they seen my county ID and realized I was in law enforcement also. They just kind of went through the motions and didn't seem to care about what I had. That is the second time I was "picked". Although I didn't have anything I wasn't suppose to.

It's only going to get worse before it gets better. Because these knotheads are employed by the government. We all know how government employees work. It will almost impossible to have any of the A-Holes fired even if they do anything wrong. That was the worst mistake that was made making these people federal employees.

BTW, how about they screen the people that are the real potential terrorist. Instead of flight crews and little old ladies. Oh I forgot that the little old lady going to see her grand kids is just waiting to highjack an airliner. Give me a break. I want to see them pick somebody from a middle east country and see how the Sh!t will hit the fan then. When they start crying discrimination or some crap like that. Then you will the ACLU, Jessi Jackson, Al Sharpton and Farrakan (sp?)down there running there sewer traps.

 

[I.P. Freley]

After getting the third degree from the same gang of screeners in FWA that I have seen half a dozen times, involving the entire "take off your shoes, unbuckle your belt, let us pat you down including running our hands through your hair to look for nuclear weapon detonators etc., etc., etc..." routine, I finally decided to say something to the overzealous security folks....

What did I say?

"I find it amusing that you are worried about the metal on my ID holder setting off your metal detector, as I have instant access to an AXE in the cockpit, right behind my left elbow."

You can imagine the response, as they had no idea that there were any weapons aboard the airplane.

"An axe?"

*sigh*

I can also say that I have been in 1900laker's shoes, as the MagLite is a constant source of befuddlement for many screeners.

 

[Chaz]

Instead of flight crews and old ladies..

To ensure we Americans never offend anyone, particularly fanatics intent on killing us, airport screeners will not be allowed to profile people. They will continue random searches of 80 year old women, little kids, airline pilots with proper identification, secret service agents who are members of the president’s security detail, 85 year old congressmen with metal hips, and Medal of Honor winning former governors.

Let’s pause a moment and take the following test:

In 1972 at the Munich Olympics, athletes were kidnapped and massacred by:
a. Olga Corbutt
b. Sitting Bull
c. Arnold Schwartzeneger
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1979, the U.S. embassy in Iran was taken over by:
a. Lost Norwegians
b. Elvis
c. A tour bus full of 80 year old women
e. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

During the 1980’s a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by:
a. John Dillinger
b. The King of Sweden
c. The Boy Scouts
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1983, the U.S. Marine Barracks in Beirut was blown up by:
a. A pizza delivery boy
b. Pee Wee Herman
c. Geraldo Rivera making up for a slow news day
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1985, the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked, and a 70 year old American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard by:
a. The Smurfs
b. Davy Jones
c. The Little Mermaid
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1985, TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens, and a U.S. Navy Diver was murdered by:
a. Captain Kidd
b. Charles Lindberg
c. Mother Teresa
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by:
a. Scooby Doo
b. The Tooth Fairy
c. Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1993 the World Trade Center was bombed the first time by:
a. Richard Simmons
b. Grandma Moses
c. Michael Jordan
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 1998 the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by:
a. Mr. Rogers
b. Hillary, to distract attention from Wild Bill’s women problems
c. The World Wrestling Federation to promote its next villain
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked and destroyed and thousands of people were killed by:
a. Bugs Bunny, Wiley Coyote, Daffy Duck and Elmer Fudd
b. The Supreme Court of Florida
c. Mr. Bean
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 2002 the United States fought a war in Afghanistan against:
a. Enron
b. The Lutheran Church
c. The NFL
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

In 2002 reporter Daniel Pearl was kidnapped and murdered by:
a. Bonnie and Clyde
b. Captain Kangaroo
c. Billy Graham
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40

Hmmm . . nope, no patterns anywhere to justify profiling

 

[HexWRX]

Chaz, well said.

 

[RichardFitzwell]

1900laker and skypine69,

You guys are barking up the wrong tree. The new TSA screeners are doing what they were told to do and nothing more. They do not make the rules. They simply follow them. They have been told to look through your wallet only if you set off the walk through metal detector. It isn't done to hurt your feelings or belittle you. They want to ensure the people on the aircraft are safe. Believe it or not, people do carry credit card knives in their wallets. I'm sure they could care less how much $$ you are carrying.

Until a national identification process is implemented for flight crew, we will put up with this type of screening. I don't want the screeners to be responsible for determining whether you are 'a real pilot' flying for whatever no-name airline you might be with. I agree it may feel like harassment but who's to say a person with misguided intentions isn't dressed up in a pilots' uniform and trying to get through security? I agree the flashlight being considered a blunt object and trying to ban it from the aircraft was a stretch. If you were a 'normal passenger' this probably would have been banned because it is a blunt object (ex. golf clubs and hammers are banned).

As for flight crew members being picked for continious screening, it won't happen with the TSA. It is against their policy. You will only be wanded if you set off the metal detector.

Profiling might be a better system but it is not currently allowed at the TSA. I agree this is not a perfect system but until something better comes along, I will work with these people in a professional manner. Like it or not, we are counting on these people to ensure our aircraft are free from threats. Common courtesy on our part may ensure success at their job. I feel it will also build confidence with the traveling public and get people flying again. If passengers see you treating their efforts as a joke, they may also.

Sorry to rant. Fly safe.

 

[Caveman]

"The new TSA screeners are doing what they were told to do and nothing more. They do not make the rules. They simply follow them."

Yup and so did Hitler's boys and Stalin's cronies. Extreme examples? I think not. Most of the crap that happened under those regimes started out with everyone putting up with some minor incoveniences "for the good of the state". "Comrade, you shouldn't mind being inconvenienced if you have nothing to hide" is a BS reason to trample on the Bill of Rights.

 

[dashtrash]

I was riding the crew bus to the parking lot in SEA. I was out of uniform and sitting next to 5 or 6 screeners that just got off duty. The 6 foot 7 inch 130 pound bull-legged guy with a big head was talking to the 5 foot 1 inch 300 pound plus girl with two guts. He was bragging about the leatherman knife he swiped from the bin and complained about the fishing lures the passenger decieded to check back at the ticket counter. These are our tax dollars at work. Thanks Mr. Mineta!

 

[Huck]

Does this atmosphere remind anyone else of the book "Catch-22"?

"Yossarian sat and watched his fellow pilots as they stripped for the security guards. The guards were highly trained and invincible, as shown by their intense searches. They looked behind every pilot's belt buckle; they felt the undersides of pilots' feet. They questioned each pilot as to his background, religious affiliation and political leanings. The pilots sheepishly offered their socks and wallets to the x-ray machine. They did not mention the cockpit crash-axe, for weapons were not allowed on aircraft, therefore the crash-axes must not really be there. After balancing on one bare foot and reciting the Pledge of Allegiance backwards, they were allowed to proceed to the aircraft, grateful for the recent cessation of the rectal probe portion of the screening...."