ACA cuts UAL Ties - possible new LCC

[AirBoard]

Good luck to my former ACA buds. United has brought this on themselves by lowballing the UAX flying. Even as a former ACA pilot I know who is now at UAL put it, "The new Tiffany Service from UAX" Transtates and Mesa. Funny how UAL dropped both of them as feeders a few years ago but now with no cash goes walking around like a bum getting handouts, "Buddy can ya spare a feed?"

Exactly!. Besides what do you nay sayers expect ACA to do? Capitulate to every penny pinching whim of UAL and their high priced consulting firms OR be proactive and cut the life boats loose.

Not trying to desert the passengers but I'd rather try to paddle to shore now than help the crew patch the hole with duct tape on the way to the bottom.

 

[colored_airman]

I agree with the majority of the board, ACA is screwing themselves but time will only tell. With that said that could mean 2 airlines going belly up. Now wouldn't that Suck!

 

[Boeingman]

The impression I get is that it is a desparation move to distance themselves from UAL. Perhaps they are privy to some financial information that UAL may not be around much longer?

This is a very dramatic action and there must be some serious issues to cause a split like this.

Handwriting on the wall?

 

[spinup]

BM,

ACA is not privy to any inside UAL information. Allowing any contractor this access would be insanely counterproductive to negotiations.

It’s very simple. ACA's an underperforming contractor that didn't like the slice of pie UAL offered. So they took their ball and went home.

CB,

That's the tough thing about being a contractor; you can and will be undercut. The mistake you make is thinking ACA is somehow righteously due a better deal. Not so. As far as Transtates and Mesa becoming code partners, they'd be hard pressed to under perform ACA; however, I would initially expect to see an Increase in USAirways express code presence compensating for any shortfall in IAD feed.

 

[j41driver]

From 7/30/03 USAToday.com....

I found this on http://www.usatoday.com/travel/today/sky.htm

"United may drop Dulles hub in ACA split
If Atlantic Coast Airways really does ditch United to become a stand-alone low-cost carrier, Washington Dulles' days as a United hub could be numbered. One analyst notes that because ACA controls its own slots at Dulles, United can't bring in a replacement carrier. "You lose that kind of revenue at one of your weaker hubs and you have no ability to bring in a replacement carrier, what do you do? You close down the hub," an analyst told Rocky Mountain News. However, one beneficiary could be Denver International Airport, which would likely see a gain in international flights. Analysts say Denver could pick up some of United's nonstops to Europe if the carrier does abandon its Dulles hub. "

 

[46Driver]

I don't know if Midway had them or not, but I believe Air Tran has a deal with quite a few cities to fly there at no risk. The city simply guarantees a minumum amount of tickets sold - the benefit being to the business community of airfares plummeting by over 50%. Considering that traffic here at PNS has risen by 33% since AirTran arrived and dropped by about 15% at the neighboring 3 airports, I would think that many smaller cities would love to support a LCC. It is from this that I hope ACA can get a guaranteed revenue stream. Maybe one of the Air Tran guys can tell us the nuts and bolts of how it works for them.

 

[Booker]

Re: From 7/30/03 USAToday.com....

...an analyst told Rocky Mountain News...Analysts say...

Thank God for these guys. Without them, we'd have no idea what's going on.

 

[DarnNearaJet]

A lot of the complaints concerning ACA's operations in IAD can be blamed on UAL. Overbooking , facilities, and departures scheduled too close together: these are all out of ACA's hands.

Our management is top-notch. Morale has made a 180 turn in the last 72 hours. Every pilot here is psyched! The Washington metro area is ranked #2 or #3 in the country in terms of population (and money.) The RJ-LCC model is just a strategy to make use of what we have now until we order the Boeing-Airbus equipment which will turn us into a national LCC.

You can count us out now or you can see back and watch us become the next Air Tran.

For those of you who wish us luck: Thanks.
For those of you who wish us ill: Wank-off!

Only time will tell.

 

[g159av8tor]

Spinup,

It’s very simple. ACA's an underperforming contractor that didn't like the slice of pie UAL offered. So they took their ball and went home. I would initially expect to see an Increase in USAirways express code presence compensating for any shortfall in IAD feed.

Glad you seem to know what's going on more than most, even those of us privy to ACA company info. Where do you get off man? Sorry, you probably just don't. Thank God for this board.

Tailwinds...

 

[spinup]

g159av8tor,

What part of underperforming contractor do you not agree with? What part of ACA not liking UAL's terms do you not agree with? ACA had and has the most abysmal service in the industry, probably due in large part to attitudes like yours. Better clean it up, mainline won't be sharing the heat any longer, it all falls on you. The information I am "privy" to is the same as yours, DOJ statistics.

Nice avatar, FU to the company that feeds you and your family. Other ACA employees will be missed, whereas you won't.

 

[46Driver]

Spinup,
Considering that UAL - not ACA - is bankrupt, they would seem to better fit the description of "underperforming"....

 

[spinup]

46driver,

Are we talking DOJ performance or financial? If we are talking financial, then where do you suppose ACA got the lion’s share of their earnings last quarter? An incredible quarter by any standard. As far as ACA is concerned, UAL's performance (financially speaking) is far from lacking.

I know the LCC is a rallying point for ACA employees, but I (my opinion) feel that management sold you out. They coludn't negotiate amicable terms, and gave up. UAL has continued to state their receptive to continuing negotiations. Your pilot group, showing more intelligence and resilience than upper management, saw the importance of maintaining this code with a concession vote. I'm not convinced ACA management would have chosen this route absent problems with UAL negotiations.

As I've stated before, I prefer ACA (with improved DOJ stats) remain partners with UAL. Not this mess we have now.

 

[46Driver]

Financial. Our rates were good from UAL - and I have no desire to see our company whipsawed against Mesa. The terms UAL gave us were unacceptable. Our company was willing to take on UAL in the past (their pilots did not want us to have any RJ's at all) so we flew them in our own colors until UAL caved.

The pilot group - and employees as a whole - are ecstatic over going solo and consider it the best option, especially in consideration of the changing market and long term prognosis of United. For us, its now Do or Die. Airplanes are cheap, Jet Blue and Air Tran haven't made their big expansions yet, and we have $200M+ in the bank. We are going to have to move fast with US Air, UAL, and more than likely AirTran trying to take us out.

 

[Cappy]

46driver,

Are we talking DOJ performance or financial? If we are talking financial, then where do you suppose ACA got the lion’s share of their earnings last quarter? An incredible quarter by any standard. As far as ACA is concerned, UAL's performance (financially speaking) is far from lacking.

I know the LCC is a rallying point for ACA employees, but I (my opinion) feel that management sold you out. They coludn't negotiate amicable terms, and gave up. UAL has continued to state their receptive to continuing negotiations. Your pilot group, showing more intelligence and resilience than upper management, saw the importance of maintaining this code with a concession vote. I'm not convinced ACA management would have chosen this route absent problems with UAL negotiations.

As I've stated before, I prefer ACA (with improved DOJ stats) remain partners with UAL. Not this mess we have now.

Apparently, you are a UAL employee and really know nothing of the terms behind the offering UAL gave the regionals. You are also out of the loop on why ACA is going it's own way.

Please go to this link first:

http://www.atlanticcoast.com/PressReleaseArchive/2003/july/webcastinstructions.htm

Then this one:

http://www.atlanticcoast.com/For_Investors/webcastinstructions0730.htm

The second one has about 12 minutes of financial talk before Kerry Skeen discusses some more details regarding the LCC. I believe this will provide answers to help the discussion for you and others.

__________________________________________________

"My CEO has bigger balls than your CEO!"