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AA Court Case

Raoul Duke

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Someone told me today that American won an injunction against the APA prohibiting any effort to refust to pick up open time. Anyone have the details?
 

Raoul Duke

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I found an article:

Appeals court rules on pilots' union OT issue

Appeals court says American Airlines pilots union can't tell members not to fly overtime

  • On Friday August 28, 2009, 5:46 pm EDT

FORT WORTH, Texas (AP) -- The pilots union at American Airlines says a federal appeals judge has told it not to advise members against flying overtime.
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The Allied Pilots Association said Friday the court was influenced by similar decisions against another union and pilots at Delta and United.
The judge also said that a federal law covering labor negotiations in the airline industry was designed to prevent strikes.
The pilots union and American have been negotiating over a new contract for three years and remain far apart on pay and other terms. Last year, the union asked the U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Washington to declare that it has the right to tell members not to volunteer for overtime.
American said it needs overtime pilots for about 500 work hours per day, and if there were no volunteers it would have to hire and train 333 additional pilots at a cost of $59 million per year. Some unprofitable routes would have to be canceled, the airline argued.
Judge Alexander Williams Jr. said an anti-overtime campaign would disrupt American's operations and lead to flight cancellations. He said the union was "attempting to exert economic pressure on American" and he questioned whether the pressure was allowed while the two sides are in labor negotiations.
American officials said they were pleased the judge supported their position.
The dispute arose when American was threatening to furlough pilots. The union believed it could prevent layoffs if pilots declined overtime assignments. No pilots were furloughed.
 

Minimaniac

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500 hours per day? Wow. Talk about improper staffing. The APA may not be able to say it, but I can... NO OT! Bring 333 pilots back!
 

BoilerUP

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The dispute arose when American was threatening to furlough pilots. The union believed it could prevent layoffs if pilots declined overtime assignments. No pilots were furloughed.

That's another strike against those who think refusing OT won't save jobs...
 

Mike man

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500 hours per day? That seem a bit high. So does the starting pay for the 333 new hires, $177,177/year isn't that more than 4 times the first year pay at AA?

What is the incentive to pick up over/open time at AA?
 

100 c.i.

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500 hours per day? That seem a bit high. So does the starting pay for the 333 new hires, $177,177/year isn't that more than 4 times the first year pay at AA?

What is the incentive to pick up over/open time at AA?
The problem is that the next 333 to return are 7 year plus Twa dudes at over 109.00 per hour.
 

C-150ETOPS

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"Judge Alexander Williams Jr. said an anti-overtime campaign would disrupt American's operations and lead to flight cancellations. He said the union was "attempting to exert economic pressure on American" and he questioned whether the pressure was allowed while the two sides are in labor negotiations."

Dear Judge,

Every single second of the day, 24/7, 365, the piss poor managers of AA attempt to exert "economic pressure" on the pilot group.

You are a complete tool
 

ultrarunner

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A union will typically loose when they collectively attempt to disrupt the 'status-quo'. And they know that. Waste of union bucks on that one!
 

Mamma

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A union will typically loose when they collectively attempt to disrupt the 'status-quo'. And they know that. Waste of union bucks on that one!

It really does not matter. We are our own worst enemies. Senior pilots will screw over the junior ones whenever the opportunity rises. I find the whole union idea in the airlines a joke when it comes to representing all members and looking out for one another.
 

ultrarunner

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... I find the whole union idea in the airlines a joke when it comes to representing all members and looking out for one another...

Yeah, no doubt about that.

Can you imagine if some of the stuff pilots do to their brothers and sisters went on over at an IAM, UAW or IBT (pilot shops excluded)?

Those members would quickly find themselves at the bottom of a very deep lake!
 

IBNAV8R

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I don't see why APA shouldn't just cede this point:

"The APA is hereby NOT directing anyone, to refuse overtime, fly to rule or call in sick in October or at any given time. Individual pilots are expected to uphold the utmost standards of professionalism and devotion to safety.

1. Pilots are cautioned to heed AA FOM and SOP and all applicable FAA regulations. This should NOT be construed as a call for any individual or group of individuals to disrupt service during the month of October, or at any other time.

2. With the recent scrutiny of the public and the FAA regarding fatigue, pilots are reminded that they have a personal responsibility to ensure they are well rested for ALL periods of duty, whether or not those duty assignments are scheduled or requested of the crewmember on an off day. Incidentally, October is Fatigue Awareness Month.

3. With the upcoming flu season, pilots are hereby directed that this shall NOT serve as a reason for individuals or groups of individuals to call in sick in when they are, in fact, in good health. It is APA's express desire NOT to disrupt service or make extra demands of existing manpower that may require the use of overtime beyond that already caused by improper staffing and piss-poor management. Pilots should remain extremely vigilant, however, for any symptoms of the H1N1 virus - which is projected to affect the North American continent in October of this year.
 

Draginass

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This is nothing new. ALPA had the same thing happen to them. The courts and judges are in the pockets of the ATA and that's probably not going to change anytime soon.
 
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