2000 hour UAL Pilot out on the street!

[Boz]

Relax Bro!

Sedona33,

Hey brother, it seems like most of the posts here have covered what needs to be said. All I want you to realize is that in this career you can not constantly compare yourself all the time to others and judge them by flight time, gender, age, race, etc........... I think you get my point!

You need to worry about you! Focus on you "sedona33" getting in the right place at the right time. Meeting the contacts that might land you your dream job, etc...

Why do you get so upset that maybe 1% or lets say even 5 % of UAL pilots were lucky enough and got there job via the unpaid internships, or some other program that probably would offend you.

I know there are many pilots that probably are upset for not even getting the opportunity to interview at UAL let alone work here. Some are actually better off right now due to our currecnt state. Trust me I know a few!

Just worry about yourself and move on. There are many great avenues to explore out there in this career. Just take it easy, breath and relax. Try to extend your negative energy into staying positive and maybe you will get what you have always wanted.

Take care and remember we are professionals that should conduct ourselves as such instead of worrying about some 20 something major airline pilot that is furloughed and probably having a hard time finding work because of guys like you that are pissed at him because you wish you were in his shoes at one time.

Just a hunch but I am guessing you were shot down by UAL and still upset about it!

Get over it,

BOZ

 

[Sedona33]

"Just a hunch but I am guessing you were shot down by UAL and still upset about it!"

No, but that is the standard response when someone like myself brings something like this up. I gotta admit the rest of what you said is well put and your comments earned respect from someone who isn’t real big on United (if you hadn't noticed).

I made the original post on a day when the realities of "life isn't always fair" were readily apparent. I am happy with my current position and will retire happily here. There was a time when I was more than mildly disappointed that the day I finally got that Delta interview was the day they shut down all interviews and nobody was hired. Fortunately I quickly picked myself back up and was able to secure what seems to be a much better deal in today’s climate than what Delta would have been.

I have a friend that has not been so lucky and he is one of the guys that I contrast to this twenty something United kid that was "in the right place at the right time". My friend started with the standard earn a rating a year as he worked his butt of thing and eventually got to the flight instructor level. He did this for nearly two years because the market was pretty slow at the time (kind of like right now). He then got hired by a scenic airline where he was able to strengthen his qualifications. This followed with a job at a popular small freight company (that’s where I met him). He got hired there with 2000 total and 500 multi. He advanced from a high performance piston to a multi engine piston to a multi-turbine in about two years. Up to this point he had never had any problem in training. He was a sharp pilot and well liked by his peers. During Metro training he brought a concern to the assistant chief pilot that he didn’t think the syllabus was being followed and parts of the training were being skipped. As it turns out this "CRM" was a mistake. When he went to take his check ride the story goes that the Assist Chief himself (unusual for the AC to be giving a check ride) loaded him up to the point of near impossibility. He felt he did good under the circumstances but was failed and fired nonetheless. On top of that it turns out some very negative things were put in his file that never happened but there was nothing my friend could do to correct it contrary to what rights he thought he had as a pilot. He spent the next six months scour ring the aviation community for a job and was able to land a corporate gig where he helped a mechanic turn wrenches half of his duty time, but he was thrilled to have another flying job non the less. After about a year there he got and interview with Emery Worldwide (they don’t mind hiring guys with blemishes in their records because they know they wouldn’t bail). After nearly a year there he upgraded from FE to F.O. on the DC-8. Less than a year later he was furloughed. He was able to do some part time work at his previous corporate job (because he left on good terms) but they didn’t have too much flying for him. He later hooked another small freight job flying Caravans and subsequently became Chief Pilot of this operation. About six months later, the people with the dough pulled the plug on funding and shut down the operation. Fortunately a friend had got my poor friend an interview at Frontier and the Chief Pilot after much explaining from my friend about his training record agreed to hire him and put him in the pool for a class. Finally my friend was on his way. Inter 911 and a change in the hiring dept and process. The new guy wanted everybody in the pool to re-interview. When my friend re-interviewed the new guy said no can do on the training record thing and my friend’s job offer was relinquished. He struggled for a while and with the help of his friends kept his wits about him. He then landed a job with National Airlines flying a 757. The pay wasn’t too good but hey flying 57's out of Vegas, how could he complain. Ok, everybody knows the story, no more National. My friend is currently interviewing for another corporate gig and still has a great attitude.

I know this post is getting long but I will briefly contrast the above story with a couple guys I know went to United. One guy interviewed at the freight company me and my friend worked at but busted the sim. He then interviewed at a popular regional airline in the west and was turned down. He kept got a job at Flightcraft in California flying mostly in the right seat of King Airs and what have you. This guy was my roommate for a while with my other friend and three other pilots and this kid was IMPOSSIBLE to get along with. He was cocky as all get out and had very little consideration for others. To this day I don’t know how he did it (he was not a minority or black) but he got an interview at United and got hired. Last I heard he just penned a deal for a $350,000 house in California when he was just coming up on his probation. I understand he has been furloughed for a while now. Another acquaintance that flew with me at the regional I used to work for got an interview and hired with 2500 total and 200 multi, no turbine PIC. He made it known to all us prop drivers at the time that he was glad to be getting out of the "puddle Jumpin" stuff and moving on the some real iron. He had always said his two objectives in aviation were to fly a 747 and make lots and lots of money. He did for a while until he recently was furloughed. He also bragged about buying what he called "an airline pilots house" in Sacramento. Don’t know what he is doing now. I say one thing about this last guy, he could definitely tell a good story factual or not. He admitted to embellishing a couple stories in his United interview to me.

Now I realize that not all United pilots are as arrogant or tactless as those mentioned above but I guess with my limited exposure to these guys and a couple others (not so well liked) that went to United I always wonder when I see some kid who’s dad flew 747's at United and who got him the job and interview if they will ever really appreciate a good job like my friend looking for work right now. We all draw conclusions from our own experiences and when I got off the phone with my friend the day of my physical I thought about this kid who walked around the doctors office with his nose stuck in the air who apparently was a 2000 hour UAL pilot that had just been furloughed. OK, flame away. I could care less. And I might as well beat everybody to what I know will be accused, my friend was not me

 

[2000flyer]

Sedona, Sedona, Sedona...

Just when I think the light bulb has come on and you (for a second time) make an attempt to correct your assesment of this "2000 hour UAL pilot", you haul off and blast him again in your final paragraph.

We all draw conclusions from our own experiences and when I got off the phone with my friend the day of my physical I thought about this kid who walked around the doctors office with his nose stuck in the air who apparently was a 2000 hour UAL pilot that had just been furloughed.

No where in your earlier posts did you say anything like this. It was a guy filling out his paperwork. Seems the story adjusts itself to fit a purpose.

We all have experienced or heard hard luck stories. They abound in this industry. Frankly, it's a fact of life. Now, when there are hundreds, if not thousands or pilot's on the street beating every door they can, there will be more "boy did I get screwed stories". Whether it's a 1500TT pilot beating a 10,000 hour veteran for an RJ FO job, or vise versa, someone is going to feel the system failed.

It sounds like your "friend" has a great attitude and knows how to pick himself up off the floor when he gets knocked down. Doesn't sound to me that he holds this same bitterness towards others that you do.

While sounding cliche, I believe everything happens for a reason. I was offered an interview with an owner of a pro football team. Boy, was I excited. How cool was that job going to be. Well, they hired someone else and a few years later I learned that the owner was actually Satan with a super bowl ring. He lost more pilot's a year than a flight school looses CFIs. Now, I could have been bent out of shape about it, or (like I did), I moved on and found something better. I can proudly boast a resume of nearly twenty years of consistent employment, having never been fired or furloughed, and, having never quit a job without having another already lined up.

Boz summed it up the best. Time to stop worrying why your "friend" did or didn't get something. Turn this negativity into a positive by helping your buddy score something bigger and better. After reading about him, I doubt he'd give a rats .... about this 2000 hour UAL pilot.

2000Flyer

 

[750driver]

Sedona,

I learned long ago that in order to survive in this business, one must accept these realities of life, and continue on. If you can't, you'll end up dying long before retirement.

Every dog has his / her day. Attitude, knowledge, persistence, and little help from the man upstairs never hurt anyone in the job hunt. Just do your best and focus on your own career.

Best wishes,

750

 

[FearlessFreep]

Sedona,

How would YOU feel if YOU were the furloughed 2000 hour UAL pilot?

It's all a matter of luck and timing. You give it your best shot and hope for the best.

 

[100LL... Again!]

Wow! The moral superiority flows rather freely around here.

I`m going to get in Sedona`s corner a LITTLE, even though his point was stated more strongly than I would have put it.

He makes a point that is similar to what MANY pilots I know have expressed.

Hey Sedona: I guess on top of life being unfair, you are apparently required to sit still, shut up and grin and bear it. When something bad happens LOOK AT YOURSELF, and think about blah, blah....
BS.

This industry has never been fair. We know that going in. Pardon the HE11 out of those of us who occasionally express that point.



Frankly, sympathy is not really the first thing that comes to mind when thinking about a situation such as this young furloughed pilot.

If he is a generally good guy, then I am only a little TINY bit sympathetic. He`s still had a better shot than most of us.
He could go back to pay the dues he PROBABLY never paid, and still end up on par with the rest of us.

If - IF! - this fellow was a cocky little twit who was quite pleased with himself, then I am actually pleased to see that what comes easily can go easily.


MY greatest concern is for the dedicated, seasoned pilots in the industry who have made great sacrifices for years to be in this profession.


From a prev. post
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...other pilots and this kid was IMPOSSIBLE to get along with. He was cocky as all get out and had very little consideration for others. To this day I don’t know how he did it (he was not a minority or black) but he got an interview at United and got hired. Last I heard he just penned a deal for a $350,000 house in California when he was just coming up on his probation. I understand he has been furloughed for a while now.
----------------------------------------

This way sir - justice is served.


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Another acquaintance that flew with me at the regional I used to work for got an interview and hired with 2500 total and 200 multi, no turbine PIC. He made it known to all us prop drivers at the time that he was glad to be getting out of the "puddle Jumpin" stuff and moving on the some real iron. He had always said his two objectives in aviation were to fly a 747 and make lots and lots of money. He did for a while until he recently was furloughed. He also bragged about buying what he called "an airline pilots house" in Sacramento. Don’t know what he is doing now.
----------------------------------------

He will not likely accomplish either goal. From the manner in which he stated them, neither was a worthy goal on it`s own. Be careful when trying to be a star. Some burn brightly, then burn out.


Expressing unpopular opinions since 1973.

 

[acaTerry]

From the mouth of a brilliant drunk...

Pappy Boyington put the answer to this well:

"Nothing great has ever been achieved except by those who were big enough to be above their circumstances".

To sit around and be mad at someone because they got luckier than you will never get you anywhere. Life isn't always fair, but don't hate someone just because they got a good break. Besides, he lost his job. Sometimes you will be the pigeon and sometimes you will be the statue.

 

[ellsworb]

Ego?

Why is it so many heavy iron drivers that are now on furlough have such a hard time accepting a job in the left seat of a jet? Isn't something better than nothing? Correct me if I am wrong.

~Tailwinds

 

[knightflyer]

Some of us in this world are lucky enough to be in the right place at the right time. Some of us even some sombody who knows somebody in high places. Just remember...that sometimes it's not fair...the world owes you nothing...and deserving "it" has got nothing to do with it.

 

[climbhappy]

sedona33 and your pity party

sedona33,

it sounds as if your having a struggle.... ever occur to you that everybody on this board has a unique and interesting story filled with potholes and triumphs, and yes shortfalls.

I think i understand from whence you penned that blurb.... sometimes we need to reread our thoughts a second time after we have cooled off..

there are plenty of cliches.... a good one when life gives you lemons....make lemonade...or how bout when your your destination and first alternate goes to crap, go to the second one.
do you have 3585? Always have a Plan, a contingency.

having said that, seems like you didin't convince anyone that the cosmos erred in selecting this young lad.... I am flying with a 23 year old alot right now who is as sharp as a tac.. he makes my job easy flying in the northeast.....

Pat Conroy, the notable author, who penned Lords of Dicipline, and Beach Music , has a new book out now called, " My Losing Season" pick up a copy and read it... it will do you good.