1st year as a Regional FO

[JohnDoe]

quote:
"Just do like every other entry level pilot does......

#1 Sell out the industry bu taking a job with such sub standard wages.

#2 Be thrilled to death you are flying for an airline.

#3 Enjoy the novelity of the job while it lasts.

#4 Start Bitzchin about how under paid you are knowing g0d darn well what the friggin pay was when you sold out your peers by taking your job.

#5 Walk around pizzed off and disgruntled and complain about how people working at McDonalds and Home Depot are making more than you.

#6 All the while you are stuck in a dead end job in an industry that isn't going anywhere anytime soon."



Unfortunately, it is quite funny because it is true (especially number 6).

quote:
"Thank you, Lequip, for your insight, kind words and encouragement for all of us up-and-comers in this industry. Lord knows we all are looking to undercut each other as much as needed for the honor and privilege of wearing three stripes and sharing the cockpit with a cheery soul such as yourself."

And there is the typical "you are a big fat meanie for dashing the hopes of all us up-and-comers, boo-hoo-hoo-hooo" reply.

You and some others call it being disgruntled, bad attitude, or whatever. Myself and many others call it an insight into the hard reality that is a career in this industry. Get used to it. Truth hurts doesn't it. One of my favorite posts from somebody in this forum (can't remember who, sorry) said: Never have as a career what others do as a hobby.

 

[Lequip]

Yes, I was one who took the job knowing the pay, QOL, ect. ect and I dealt with it and never complained. I wouldn't trade where I'm at for anything. I'm Just sick of all these regional FO's who think they are owed the world. You guys are going to be regional FO's for a LONG LONG time so just deal with it or quit. You are fighting a losing battle by saying crap "I'll vote No", "We deserve more", "Home Depot and McDonalds.....", it's all crap coming out of your pie hole and it has been said by thousands of entry level pilots who think they are owed and entitled to EVERYTHING just because Mommy and Daddy paid for their college and flight training or perhaps because they have a boat load of student loans to pay off. Well I got news for you..... REGIONAL FO Pay isn't going up because of entry level supply and demand. Face it, any dumbass can be trained to fly an airplane. 0 time to ATP and regional FO in 6 months by MANY outfits. You guys AREN"T Dr. and Laywers who require years and years of graduate study. Pilots are nothing more than glorified overpaid bus drivers and I'll be the 1st to admit it.

 

[Sticky]

Try This...

Now wait a second! Before we jump on Lequip, I want to point out that he makes a perfectly sane, logical and reasonable point: In order for me (a beginning airline pilot) to succeed in this profession, I should....not get a job as an airline pilot. That makes perfect sense, and I don't understand why anybody would question this assertion.

Heres an idea. Rather then going to work for food stamp wage as a "professional", don't go to the interview. Tell your peers not to go to the interview. If they do, encourage the labor unions to punish them. Soon as that happens, *poof* pay goes up. I've asked some people here through PM how they expect to live on such low pay. Most say they don't worry about it. For example, I had two school friends get hired by Eagle couple months ago. At the current rate of upgrade, and the pay scale, in 7 years they'll be 33 years old making $28,000 a year. How the heck can you save for retirement, save, invest, and own a property/house on that pay? All the time I see pilots my own age running off to fly those cool jets and wear the cool uniform. Amazing to me.

 

[OUjetdrvr]

Lequip,
Speaking of pie holes and shutting them!

Everyone else,
I have swallowed plenty of shiot at Eagle for four years to last a lifetime, therefore becoming one of the most stubborn dirtbag FOs I know!
Only through teamwork can we even fathom a chance to redirect the downward spiral that this industry is headed. Or I just might go to work at Home Depot if not just for sanity...

Newbies,
I know its hard but quit being so g.d. happy to be here!

 

[FN FAL]

Heres an idea. Rather then going to work for food stamp wage as a "professional", don't go to the interview. Tell your peers not to go to the interview. If they do, encourage the labor unions to punish them. Soon as that happens, *poof* pay goes up. I've asked some people here through PM how they expect to live on such low pay. Most say they don't worry about it. For example, I had two school friends get hired by Eagle couple months ago. At the current rate of upgrade, and the pay scale, in 7 years they'll be 33 years old making $28,000 a year. How the heck can you save for retirement, save, invest, and own a property/house on that pay? All the time I see pilots my own age running off to fly those cool jets and wear the cool uniform. Amazing to me.

What's so funny is all the eagle and simmons guys you trip over all throughout the industry. I bet you couldn't throw a beer can at an airport and not hit an ex-eagle/simmons guy in the head.

Five years ago I was down at O'hare with a 135 charter...thought I'd take a walk down to the big terminal to see what was going on. Ran into an eagle captain and his co-pilot that were hiding out trying to jumpseat home. Seems if they hung out in the lounge, someone would put them to work.

But anyway, this captain gave me about 30 minutes of his time and it was pretty clear to me that I wasn't ever going to put a resume in there. This was like the umpteenth time I had heard the same thing from eagle flight crew.

I'm sure there are some guys happy there, but like I said, it sure seems like you just about trip over ex-eagle pilots out in the world.

 

[English]

Eagle is a great place to be FROM.

 

[TonyC]

... , maybee have a kid with a wife that doesn't work, ...

No such thing as a Mom that doesn't work.

 

[Air Biscuit]

Yes, I was one who took the job knowing the pay, QOL, ect. ect and I dealt with it and never complained. I wouldn't trade where I'm at for anything. I'm Just sick of all these regional FO's who think they are owed the world. You guys are going to be regional FO's for a LONG LONG time so just deal with it or quit. You are fighting a losing battle by saying crap "I'll vote No", "We deserve more", "Home Depot and McDonalds.....", it's all crap coming out of your pie hole and it has been said by thousands of entry level pilots who think they are owed and entitled to EVERYTHING just because Mommy and Daddy paid for their college and flight training or perhaps because they have a boat load of student loans to pay off. Well I got news for you..... REGIONAL FO Pay isn't going up because of entry level supply and demand. Face it, any dumbass can be trained to fly an airplane. 0 time to ATP and regional FO in 6 months by MANY outfits. You guys AREN"T Dr. and Laywers who require years and years of graduate study. Pilots are nothing more than glorified overpaid bus drivers and I'll be the 1st to admit it.

Lequip, have you ever taken a job knowing it sucked, but took it anyway because there wasn't any other option? This is what these new guys are faced with and they have every right to bitch. The landscaped has changed and changed rapidly down the toilet. With your mentality everybody should just sit back and take it and not do anything to make it better. Well a no vote is the loudest voice one has. Name one place that you can go 0 time to regional f.o. in 6 months. It can't and does not happen.

 

[norskman2]

Face it, any dumbass can be trained to fly an airplane. 0 time to ATP and regional FO in 6 months by MANY outfits. QUOTE]

Hey, Biscuit's right. 0 to ATP in 6 months would only require 250 flying hours a month! A mere 62.5 hours of flying each week. That must be some academy! Great math, LeQuip!

 

[UPF-7]

1,400 on 75hr or at least 20,000yr

 

[Cl_65_Driver]

I always think its funny when I here people complain about where they work when they continue to stay there....I was just curious what everyone thinks the "right" amount of money is to fly 19 to 70 people (depending on what you're on)?..It seems like allot of people want to get paid like a 74 captains flying Rj's...I also think most are bitter because they will retire on the same equipment they are on now and not the 777 they had hoped and dreamed.....just my two cents.....

 

[BoilerUP]

It seems to me the biggest bunch of whiners on here is not the young RJ FO, its the jaded RJ captain with 6-9 years seniority at their company who expected to be at United or American or Southwest by now, bringing in 100K+ each year with a couple Beamers in the driveway. Sorry, its not 2000 anymore...

I did not come into professional aviation to get rich, I did it because I could make a good living doing something I enjoy. I don't have the pie-in-the-sky dreams of being a 30-year old 777 captain some of my counterparts have.

If fate has it that I can be a widebody captain towards the end of my career, then I'll be happy, but I'm not holding my breath. I have the possibility of being a 25 year old RJ captain making 55K+ with the earnings limit only being what my union can negotiate for the eqiupment my comapny has. If I can be 30 years old with a wife and two kids, a 2200 sq. ft. house, a motorcycle and two decent cars in the driveway and be otherwise financially secure with good seniority, then I will be happy. There is MUCH to be said about living within your means, at whatever level you happen to be at.

Is this what I thought I might have when I started back in August of 2001? No. But that's okay. If I wanted to be rich, I'd day trade on the internet. I say again to those bitching about their compensation - do something about it by working within your union or company, OR FIND ANOTHER JOB. So many of you seem so bitter, and say your income is so easily replaceable, so I say put your money where your mouth is. Otherwise quit using the internet as a means to bitch and whine about something you obviously aren't willing to take the responsibility to change yourself.

 

[SigAV8R]

I have the possibility of being a 25 year old RJ captain making 55K+ with the earnings limit only being what my union can negotiate for the eqiupment my comapny has. If I can be 30 years old with a wife and two kids, a 2200 sq. ft. house, a motorcycle and two decent cars in the driveway and be otherwise financially secure with good seniority, then I will be happy. There is MUCH to be said about living within your means, at whatever level you happen to be at.

I think you'll need a little more than 55K for that kind of aspiration. Drop the wife and you'll be a little bit closer. However I couldn't agree more with your last statement Boiler.

-SigAV8R

 

[HawkI]

After surviving first year fo pay, here is some real numbers for the family man starting with the airlines. It can be done!

Total
26,000
2000 health insurance (family 4)
500 uniforms
2500 fica/medicaid
2000 401K

$19,000 takehome
$800 paycheck twice a month
Tips on surviving!
1. don't live in the hub, but within driving distance. (living expenses lower but no need for a crash pad)(rent and car insurance per month in ord $1100, impossible! rent and car insurance per month in Iowa, $500, possible)
2. contribute to the 401K (I know you can't afford it, but your taxes will save you especially if you have kids)
3. practical car (8 year old cavalier, drives like a dream, very little gas)
4. when you get your second year pay put half of the increase in your 401K(and the same with every raise after)
5. credit card bad!
6. I splurge on 1 meal out with the crew a trip @$15

Don't bash me, I'm just sharing my experience.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Two words....SUGAR MOMMA