135 Proving runs

[mavrck]

We just bought a Cit II and are in the process of putting it on a 135 certificate. Naturally, we have to do the proving runs on it being this company's 1st jet.

Anybody have any info/thoughts on the proving run tests is greatly appreciated.

thanks
Mav

 

[corp_da20_guy]

Just insure you know your ops manual, MEL procedures (if applicable), and the FARs. Pretty straight forward. Will run several legs as you would a 135 trip. Things to watch out for: might try to get one pilot out of his seat to look at something (know your O2 regs), failed equipment (radar broken - need to divert - stay away from areas of forcast thunderstorm activity). These are the types of "tricks" they will play to see if not only you know the regs/ops manual/specs but how to apply them. A lot will depend on the inspectors and your relationship with them. Both sets of run that I participated in we had at minimum 3 inspectors and at most we had 5 (ops, maintenance, & avionics). Just relax and have a good time...but don't let your guard down.

 

[English]

Definitely don't let your guard down.

I met a really nice pilot a few weeks ago who relayed this story to me. He was doing proving runs and in the course of doing the proving runs, he was dinged twice - once was a letter of warning, the other was a full-on 709 ride! The 709 was because of how he handled a writeup. So yes, be very careful and do everything by the book.

 

[Rick1128]

One other point, read and know the appropriate sections of Orders 8400.10 amd 8300.10. These are the Air Carrier Inspector's Handbook and the Air Worthiness Inspector's Handbook. In the 8400.10 the appropriate section is Section 3, but it also depends on what authorities you are requesting. The handbooks lay out the FAA's standards for their inspectors. Well worth reading. And they are available on line through the faa website.

 

[Clutch_Cargo]

mavrck,

Don't stress over the proving runs but down let your guard down either. And above all, don't be tempted to cut any corners... don't give them a reason to hang you... not even something as simple as sterile cockpit rules. The proving runs are not just about your ability to fly the airplane but also about your company's ability to manage it. Make sure everyone involved... pilots, dispatchers, DOM, maintenance control, whatever you have is available and in the loop. I say this because unless you have some good pull, you'll be doing some night flying which normally falls outside normal business hours. You will have a mechanical at some point, simulated or otherwise, and there is nothing worse than not being able to get a hold of your maintenance. BTW, if you have to use contract maintenance be sure they are on a drug program and your company has a copy of it before he starts to work on your airplane. Your DOM should know this but it will impress them if you are aware of the requirement. It seems to be a common "trick" to try and get one of the pilots out of their seat to test your knowledge of O2 requirements so know them cold. For what it's worth, I wouldn't send a pilot back for anything short of a fire... if for no other reason than the crew is new to the airplane and you don't need to be single pilot at this point. That's your call and you can refuse a request for someone to come back. Again, I wouldn't do anything outside the norm... even to the extent that I wouldn't take a visual into anything other than maybe my home airport. Use everything you have available to you. As was mentioned above, know your GOM/FOM, MEL procedures, and FARs. I would also take a look at the 8300/8400... it's nice to know where the FAA is coming from. Also as mentioned above, you'll have at least three inspectors involved but don't be surprised to see more. I had one with seven or inspectors onboard. Proving runs don't happen everyday so they sometimes use them for OJT. Anyway, I've found most inspectors to be good people... show them you know what you're doing, accept their advice (good or not) and you'll be fine. Good luck and have fun!

cc

 

[English]

Ojt???

 

[Clutch_Cargo]

Ojt???

On-the-Job-Training

BTW, sweet ride English!

 

[some_dude]

Watch out for hazmat, as well. It's common for them to include a box with a hazmat sticker in with the baggage.

 

[Yank McCobb]

Just serve 'em a big meal and a bottle or two of wine. You'll have nothing to worry about after that.

 

[English]

Thanks clutch cargo!

 

[mavrck]

bump....

 

[capnflyright]

You've got 25 hours to fly off. Try to apply for a reduction in flight hours. Make up a binder which details the complete proving run process (Itineraries, detail is the key which shows them you will run the operation professionally). You will have to fly with a Citation "expert" from the FAA. This will be the ride you want to be pretty sharp on. The "expert" will be asking alot of systems/aircraft questions related to charter ops. Go over your maintenance write-up procedures and know them in and out. Look over the MEL so you will be familiar where items are generally located. If you will be operating in RVSM ensure that you plan a flight in this airspace. Also, if you are going to be operating with Class II navigation in your Op Specs get this flight out of the way during your proving runs. We flew our Class II nav. flight from Houston to Key West across the Gulf (Remember the rafts!). Make sure whomever you will be flying with is on the same page as yourself (Op Specs, GOM, Write-ups knowledge). If I think of something else I'll drop you a line. Good Luck.

 

[some_dude]

Plan your trip to stay at 350 or below. No oxygen masks that way.

One of the main things they are looking at is actually your maintenance and how you handle discrepancies away from your base. So, make absolutely sure your DOM is prepped for this and ready.