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135.101 + 135.247 SIC check

frascaflyer

amateur drunkard
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Jan 10, 2005
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Hi all,

What does the SIC check required by 135.247 entail? This is for an IFR 135 passenger operation without an autopilot. It's a new certificate, so we're trying to figure out how to get this done, and I'm new to 135 so I really don't know what's going on. Do we have to designate a check airman? Otherwise we have to do the ride with the FAA, right? What's covered on the ride, and how would we set it up?

Thanks,
FF
 

mike1mc

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 3, 2002
Posts
575
There is a lot of inofm on this board regarding your questions. Here are some quick answers:
  1. 135 Requires an SIC by FAR for all IFR, passenger-carrying flights.
  2. FAR 135.101 (?) and your Ops Specs allow for a deviation from the above, but its not required
  3. SIC Checkride is nothing more than 2 stalls, 2-engine landing, single-engine landing (engine out procedures), go-around, and maybe an aborted takeoff. Steep Turns are not required. You can opt to do the instrument stuff, but its not required (135 SIC Instrument Currency is the same as Part 61). Think about things such as GPS approaches, Circle to Land manuevers, etc that do require SIC training and checking. Look at the 8400.10 for more guidance.
  4. Company Check Airmen or FAA completes checkride
  5. Call your POI to schedule the ride. An initial checkride of an type needs to be given by an inspector CURRENT in that aircraft. This may be difficult depending on the aircraft type.
  6. Check Airmen needs to be trained as a Check Airmen in accordance with your training program and then given a checkride as such.
I'm sure I'm missing some stuff, but its a start.
 

mflyer

Active member
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Something makes me think you have to have an X number of pilots in order to designate a chief pilot. I think in order to be chief pilot there are certain requirements such as 3 years 135 experience. Look at FAR 119.69 & 119.71!
 

NoPax

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Something makes me think you have to have an X number of pilots in order to designate a chief pilot. I think in order to be chief pilot there are certain requirements such as 3 years 135 experience.

Almost...you need to have at least five pilots in the flight department to be able to qualify for a check airman.

All 135 operations must have a Chief Pilot, who must have in the past 6 six years, at least 3 years as 135/121 PIC in the aircraft category or type (if required). All 135 operations also must have a Director of Operations, with similar experience to the Chief Pilot, and Management experience also.
Finally, all 135 Operations must have a designated Director of Maintenance - mechanic with an Inspector Authorization.

A Check Airman, may be the Chief Pilot, Director of Ops, or a Line Pilot. And the Chief Pilot may also be the Director of Ops and/or the Director of Maintenance etc...
 

surveypilot

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NoPax said:
All 135 operations must have a Chief Pilot, who must have in the past 6 six years, at least 3 years as 135/121 PIC in the aircraft category or type (if required). All 135 operations also must have a Director of Operations, with similar experience to the Chief Pilot, and Management experience also.
Finally, all 135 Operations must have a designated Director of Maintenance - mechanic with an Inspector Authorization.

This is not true. A Basic or Full 135 Certificate has these requirements, but you can also be approved for a single pilot only certificate. The single pilot certificate has no requirement for any of the management personnell (DO, CP, or DM) or training programs. Of course, the one pilot has to be approved to operate single pilot using the autopilot in place of the SIC.
 

wingnutt

...recognize this?
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Mar 31, 2002
Posts
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+30yrs
NoPax said:
Almost...you need to have at least five pilots in the flight department to be able to qualify for a check airman.

frasca beat me to the single pilot ops, and i dont necessarily know that this 5 pilot thing is true either...
 

NoPax

NoPax NoMore
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surveypilot said:
This is not true. A Basic or Full 135 Certificate has these requirements, but you can also be approved for a single pilot only certificate. The single pilot certificate has no requirement for any of the management personnell (DO, CP, or DM) or training programs. Of course, the one pilot has to be approved to operate single pilot using the autopilot in place of the SIC.

Ok, you got me on the single pilot w/autopilot 135 certificate.


Single-Pilot Operator: Our Single-Pilot Operator website provides forms and examples for you to self-prepare FAA documentation in order to become a single-pilot Part 135 operator. Features include:
  • One single- or multi-engine aircraft.
  • One pilot crew.
  • Hazardous material (optional).
  • Ground deicing program (optional).
  • Seat removal training (optional).
  • Deviations and exemptions (optional).
Single Pilot-in-Command: This is a step up from the single-pilot operator and allows up to three copilots to be used in the operation.
  • One single- or multi-engine aircraft.
  • One Pilot-in-Command and up to three Second-in-Command pilots.
  • No General Operations Manual required.
  • No Training Manual required.
  • No Director of Operations required.
  • No Chief Pilot required.
  • Director of Maintenance may be required or turbine-powered aircraft.
Basic 135 Operator: The Basic 135 Operator certificate is the same as Full 135 Operator; except, the Director of Operations and Chief Pilot can be fulfilled by the same person. There is a limitation of no more than 5 pilots and no more than 3 aircraft. It is possible for a Full 135 Operator to get a waiver allowing the two positions to be combined thus alleviating the need for this level of certification.

Full 135 Operator:
  • There are no restrictions on the number or type of aircraft.
  • There are no restrictions on the number of pilots.
  • A General Operations Manual and Training Manual are both required.
  • A Director of Operations and Chief Pilot are required.
  • The Director of Operations and Chief Pilot can be combined for non-turbine powered aircraft upon approval of a waiver and as long as the operation is simple.
  • Director of Maintenance is required.
Source: http://www.usac.com/faa/Instructions.doc
 
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