1261 days to go!

[Flopgut]

I hate to see anyone furloughed. Lived through that a couple of times and wouldn't wish it on anyone. Did 65 have zero effect? Of course not, but of the 6-8 things that play into a furlough, it is at or near the bottom of the list.

There's at least 6 or 8 things that can cause a pilot to lose retirement savings. Yet that's the biggest reason for 65. Does 65 keep retirement monies safe? No, not really, just transferred wealth from many young pilots to a few old ones. More pilots will be exposed longer to the almost infinite number of things that can end this career. Not to mention the thousands that took the immediate hit. Whole thing is a damn waste.

Question: SWA is suppose to be some special place. You got several thousand pilots morbidly flat spotted while you're carrying on like a hog at the trough. You ever feel like an ass for potentially poisoning the well? Is Herb happy with you old guys?

 

[Flopgut]

Btw: another over 60 CAL pilot flamed out the other night. He didn't die, so I guess it's not news... Another good clean up job by an FO.

http://nebraskaradionetwork.com/2013/12/31/plane-makes-emergency-landing-at-eppley/

 

[Chest Rockwell]

There's at least 6 or 8 things that can cause a pilot to lose retirement savings. Yet that's the biggest reason for 65. Does 65 keep retirement monies safe? No, not really, just transferred wealth from many young pilots to a few old ones. More pilots will be exposed longer to the almost infinite number of things that can end this career. Not to mention the thousands that took the immediate hit. Whole thing is a damn waste.

Question: SWA is suppose to be some special place. You got several thousand pilots morbidly flat spotted while you're carrying on like a hog at the trough. You ever feel like an ass for potentially poisoning the well? Is Herb happy with you old guys?

I don't regard 65 as a remedy to any shortfall in retirement savings. It is simply a much less discriminatory forced retirement age.

I am in my 40s still, so still uncertain if I will gain from 65. Just now making it into my drivable domicile where I cannot hold many holidays off.

Herb lobbied for the change, so I suspect he is happy, but I have not asked or heard him asked specifically.

 

[Flopgut]

Herb lobbied for the change, so I suspect he is happy, but I have not asked or heard him asked specifically.

Ok, when you do see him, ask him for me. Let us know if he's happy with the results.

 

[SIG600]

There's at least 6 or 8 things that can cause a pilot to lose retirement savings. Yet that's the biggest reason for 65. Does 65 keep retirement monies safe? No, not really, just transferred wealth from many young pilots to a few old ones. More pilots will be exposed longer to the almost infinite number of things that can end this career. Not to mention the thousands that took the immediate hit. Whole thing is a damn waste.

Question: SWA is suppose to be some special place. You got several thousand pilots morbidly flat spotted while you're carrying on like a hog at the trough. You ever feel like an ass for potentially poisoning the well? Is Herb happy with you old guys?

The average baby boomer will have recieved over $350,000 in government benefits over their entire lives. The average <20 year old (to include the following generation not born yet) will be -$440,000 in benefits over their life. Nothing new.

 

[SWA Bubba]

Question: SWA is suppose to be some special place. You got several thousand pilots morbidly flat spotted while you're carrying on like a hog at the trough. You ever feel like an ass for potentially poisoning the well? Is Herb happy with you old guys?

Seriously?

Now you're going to blame Southwest for age 65? First we're an insignificant company with our own tiny little union, but now our group is solely responsible for something that might ALPA tried to do but couldn't pull off? Get a grip, man.

While you're at it, is there anything else you want to blame us for? Global warming? Congressional gridlock? The Kennedy assassination?

BTW, what does "morbidly flat spotted" mean?

Bubba

 

[gutshotdraw]

Seriously?

Now you're going to blame Southwest for age 65? First we're an insignificant company with our own tiny little union, but now our group is solely responsible for something that might ALPA tried to do but couldn't pull off? Get a grip, man.

While you're at it, is there anything else you want to blame us for? Global warming? Congressional gridlock? The Kennedy assassination?

BTW, what does "morbidly flat spotted" mean?

Bubba

It's when you stand on the brakes so hard, you not only flat spot the tire, but the sidewalls bulge out too....

 

[Flopgut]

BTW, what does "morbidly flat spotted" mean?

20 year upgrade. You need to get a grip, because you've taken my post out of context (again).

You think junior SWA pilots ought to be content where they're at? Are older individual SWA pilots more important than the company or culture?* You drug them all along with the "oh most will go at 62" lie. We made better efforts at supporting retirements at both CAL and UAL, you guys have done nothing.

*Thats the question, try not to go off on a tangent.

 

[SWA Bubba]

20 year upgrade. You need to get a grip, because you've taken my post out of context (again).

You think junior SWA pilots ought to be content where they're at? Are older individual SWA pilots more important than the company or culture?* You drug them all along with the "oh most will go at 62" lie. We made better efforts at supporting retirements at both CAL and UAL, you guys have done nothing.

*Thats the question, try not to go off on a tangent.

-I- never said that any pilots "ought to be content where they're at." And no, older individual pilots aren't more important, and -I- didn't drag anybody anywhere. You aren't going to find a quote of me on any thread on FI defending the age change. As usual, you have me confused with someone else.

You implied in your post that Southwest was somehow to "blame" for the retirement age changing. I said that was BS. That's all.

And as far as not taking care of juniors and youngers, in our last contract, SWAPA as a whole actually took less money (smaller percentage of an overall pay raise) in order to bump up the payrates of senior FOs. They now get 70% of captain pay instead of 66%, which is the industry norm. Senior pilots voted overwhelmingly for this, meaning that the "older, senior individual pilots" at Southwest voluntarily left money on the table to take care of their juniors. You guys ever do that?

Bubba

 

[Flopgut]

You implied in your post that Southwest was somehow to "blame" for the retirement age changing. I said that was BS. That's all.

I don't know how you got that out of my post. What I wanted to know is what would SWA pilots do about their current retirement situation.

As we speak UAL has 20 million allocated (from CBA) for pilot early retirements. It will probably get 80 or so to retire. We did something similar at CAL years ago and around 110 pilots retired. When pilots leave in large numbers it does have an effect. And when the retiree leaves with lump sum cash it's best for them. Creating retirements is much better than FO top pay being increased 4%. Matter of fact, that's kind of an insult IMHO.

 

[Flopgut]

You implied in your post that Southwest was somehow to "blame" for the retirement age changing. I said that was BS. That's all.

When I said "you got", I meant that you all got what you wanted (not that you did it).

 

[SWA Bubba]

I don't know how you got that out of my post. What I wanted to know is what would SWA pilots do about their current retirement situation.

As we speak UAL has 20 million allocated (from CBA) for pilot early retirements. It will probably get 80 or so to retire. We did something similar at CAL years ago and around 110 pilots retired. When pilots leave in large numbers it does have an effect. And when the retiree leaves with lump sum cash it's best for them. Creating retirements is much better than FO top pay being increased 4%. Matter of fact, that's kind of an insult IMHO.

The last time that Southwest offered an "early out" program, it included pilots for the first time. Lump sum to leave. As far as "what we're doing" about our current retirement situation, retirement enhancement is one of the three pillars of our contract negotiations this time (like specifically helping our juniors was in the last contract).

Increasing senior FO pay is an insult? Certainly not to them. And increasing it 4% of Captain pay is actually about 6% of FO pay. Tell you what--as your FOs if they'd be "insulted" if their pay was increased 6% above and beyond every negotiated FO payrate they'd ever get. Forever. You can get back to me on that.

In my opinion, that's much better than a one-off deal that benefits 80 retiring senior pilots (and of course, the 80 FOs who get to move up a little earlier because of it)

All of us work to enhance all parts of our respective contracts. It just seems funny to me that you always try to find a way to insult/slam/blame or whatever about Southwest in every situation that you talk about.

Bubba

 

[Flopgut]

I don't really have to wonder what our FOs would think about an incremental bump to top FO pay (in place of retirement progression), because I was an FO then. I think it makes a mockery of what we all do this job for. And keep in mind, top FO job is a vastly different thing here than SWA. Widebody FO can fly or IRO and the QOL of those schedules are incredible. Your FOs ride along and play fartcatcher to a bunch of cake eaters who gamed retirement age. I can't imagine how bad that would suck!!

I think it's a good thing that swapa is making retirement an important issue and not trying to raise the age again. I hope it works and I think you'll find that even a seemingly small number of immediate retirements makes a big difference.

 

[Flopgut]

And btw why is the collective SWA ego so frail? I don't bash SWA on all things. I'm not posting on the SWA meltdown thread, nor will I (even though that leprechaun Tankerhead calls me out) I don't take any pleasure in reading that sort of thing. I don't like age 65 and I don't like SWA airport BS.

 

[livin'thesim]

Flopgut - best not to use trigger words around people who are overly sensitive. They see offense in everything.