Day rate for contract work?

[TXCAP4228]

I searched around in the forum archives and couldn't find any recent threads on this subject. I'm curious what day rates people are charging for contract work in various airplanes - and also on the related subject, how do you maintain currency 61.55 / 61.58 (meaning, do your contract clients pay that or do you)? I'd like to get a feel for what the market expectations are around day rates and training.

I have an ATP and a PIC type in the HS125 and CE650 and I take care of my own training. For the Hawker I get $600-$700/day as an FO, and for the CE650 I get $400/day as an FO.

Anybody else willing to share?

 

[ditchpilot]

Way too low on the ce 650 if you are paying your own training cost. You would need to fly 20 days to cover recurrent training cost. The local market ( pilot pool ) usualy sets the going rate on each model. There will always be someone willing to work cheap and beat down the day rate.
Typed and current in mid sized older airframes like the Ce 650 should be no less then $600/ day.
This is the only careers i know of where the owners will put their entire family into a multi million dollar piece of equiptment that opperates at high speeds in the extream conditions and they decide who sits behind the controls by who is the lowest bidder for a front seat.
Go figure.

 

[jonjuan]

Way too low on the ce 650 if you are paying your own training cost. You would need to fly 20 days to cover recurrent training cost. The local market ( pilot pool ) usualy sets the going rate on each model. There will always be someone willing to work cheap and beat down the day rate.
Typed and current in mid sized older airframes like the Ce 650 should be no less then $600/ day.
This is the only careers i know of where the owners will put their entire family into a multi million dollar piece of equiptment that opperates at high speeds in the extream conditions and they decide who sits behind the controls by who is the lowest bidder for a front seat.
Go figure.

Ummm, regional airlines? 20 year old, 600 hour C150 wonder? Still safer than that family getting into a limo on the way to the airport. Go figure.

 

[CorpCaptain]

600-800 for LR45/ 1600-1800 for the Global. There's plenty of guys out there doing it for less though.

 

[TXCAP4228]

Ditchpilot - I wish there were a "like" button for your post! I agree that $400 is way too low for the 650. Frankly I have considered hanging up the 650 altogether since in my area this is what all of the owners want to pay a contract FO. The truth is that there are WAY more Hawkers in the world and I get paid a lot more (almost double, actually) to fly them. And besides that, the 650 will be dead in a few years as many of the airframes start to time out.

Part of my problem, and this is one of the things I'm struggling with, is that there are two major 142 centers at DFW that have a number of trained and current "professional" right-seaters (and for that matter a number of IP's) who are available for contract flying. This means that most jet owners can get into their airplane with little or no thought to crew expenses since there are so many guys who are ready to take contract jobs where training & currency costs are no factor.

One the one hand I am a big free-market guy. On the other hand, it really bothers me that so many owners in my area are willing to take total advantage of the large number of trained and available contract pilots.

In the end I don't know if I have the right answer.

 

[CorpCaptain]

Have you given any thought to part-time IP'ing in your spare time? I have several friends who work @ FS or CAE part time to maintain currency as well as network. They are always looking for new folks. Just a thought.

 

[G100driver]

Part of my problem, and this is one of the things I'm struggling with, is that there are two major 142 centers at DFW that have a number of trained and current "professional" right-seaters (and for that matter a number of IP's) who are available for contract flying. This means that most jet owners can get into their airplane with little or no thought to crew expenses since there are so many guys who are ready to take contract jobs where training & currency costs are no factor.

One the one hand I am a big free-market guy. On the other hand, it really bothers me that so many owners in my area are willing to take total advantage of the large number of trained and available contract pilots.

In the end I don't know if I have the right answer.

you can be a free market guy and still call folks out for whoring out their services. Especially at the training centers. Remind senior management that you are a client and are tired of competing with their employees on contract flying. They are pretty receptive to this.

This is part of free market principles ... Freedom to tell someone when they are screwing you over.

 

[brokeflyer]

$1200 per day is what you're worth. ask for it.

dont bring the bar down. these places can afford it easily.

 

[staledog]

$1200 per day is what you're worth. ask for it.

dont bring the bar down. these places can afford it easily.

While I agree with you, that doesn't mean anyone is going to pay $1200/day for a Hawker or CE650 pilot.

Actually, I guarantee they won't.

If you ask that much, you'll never get any work.

 

[TXCAP4228]

Reality

While I agree with you, that doesn't mean anyone is going to pay $1200/day for a Hawker or CE650 pilot.

Actually, I guarantee they won't.

If you ask that much, you'll never get any work.

This is absolutely correct. Nobody will pay that, and asking for it will just send potential clients elsewhere.

 

[greasy8driver]

Hawker. $800/day
604 $1000/day
Global $1500/day

 

[sshrae]

I think it all depends on the market where you are. I stay current on several types and one of them is a mustang, the smallest jet in the business, there are only a few of us in my area who do contract work and we all charge $1,000/day. I'm thinking there are probably a lot more 560 and hawker pilots around though. Don't undercut the average.

 

[MDP727]

Great topic.
What do you guys consider the most beneficial ratings to hold for general contract work? Left or right seat.

Would the Global be about the highest paying daily rate?
Is that $1500 for captain or fo?

In terms of the VLJ's which aircraft has the most work available?

Thanks

 

[greasy8driver]

Would the Global be about the highest paying daily rate?
Is that $1500 for captain or fo?

Globals and Gulfstreams would probably be the highest daily rate. Usually, per diem pilots are used as f/o's.

 

[greed]

I get $950-1200 in the 604/605 and $600 in the BE400, I charge the same FO or PIC

 

[JettBoii]

What are you guys getting in a sovereign?

 

[CIIBK]

When you guys fly contract trips are you named on the owners insurance policy and do you request a waiver of subrogation or are the trips flown under the provisions of the open pilot requirements?

Thanks

 

[brokeflyer]

day rate should be 50% over what the day rate of a heart surgeon since pilots have twice as much training and twice as much responsibility.

 

[paid4training]

What's the going daily rate for a king air? 90 and 200?

 

[CorpCaptain]

When you guys fly contract trips are you named on the owners insurance policy and do you request a waiver of subrogation or are the trips flown under the provisions of the open pilot requirements?

Outside a 3rd party contractor I rarely have to be named to the principal(s) insurance policy. Typically most of my trips are done with a full time, current employee.

What's the going daily rate for a king air? 90 and 200?

Are we talking PIC/SIC (On the 90 i'll assume PIC for good measure). Pt91 or 135? Area of the country your contracting in?? 3rd party (ACASS/Jet Aviation) or someone you dictate your own price? Numerous factors at play....

 

[400A]

We pay $650 on the Hawker for SIC. A company PIC is always on board. Our open policy allows anyone with 2500TT and a Current PIC check in any jet to act as SIC. My Personal policy is the contractor will be either Hawker Qualified or Proline 21 qualified.

 

[paid4training]

Outside a 3rd party contractor I rarely have to be named to the principal(s) insurance policy. Typically most of my trips are done with a full time, current employee.



Are we talking PIC/SIC (On the 90 i'll assume PIC for good measure). Pt91 or 135? Area of the country your contracting in?? 3rd party (ACASS/Jet Aviation) or someone you dictate your own price? Numerous factors at play....

Part 91 pic, in a certain oil rich town in west Texas for the owners....

 

[Headwind]

CE-525; BE-200 part 91 PIC (single pilot) 500.00. Sometimes more.

 

[CorpCaptain]

Part 91 pic, in a certain oil rich town in west Texas for the owners....

Single Pilot I would expect between 500-700 daily. Even in the 200 with a SIC I would expect the same. With that floating out there, i'm not well educated on the market in West Texas either.

 

[brokeflyer]

While I agree with you, that doesn't mean anyone is going to pay $1200/day for a Hawker or CE650 pilot.

Actually, I guarantee they won't.

If you ask that much, you'll never get any work.

if everyone charged that, they would get it.

if you have a hawker, you can afford it.

 

[Striptyler]

I don't get out of bed for less than $800. Normally $800 (min) or 20% of the fuel bill. ( burn at average rates if they own their own farm seems to be close to $1/lb). First contract gig I picked up, was for $650, and I flew that thing all damn day. Wasn't worth it. After taxes I think I netted like $300?

800 gets you nearly 2 hours in a HS-125, after than you get paid more. I turn down a lot of the work that comes my way ( work at a training center, and really have no desire to be out on the road swinging gear)

CAE/FSI in DAL are a bit different, as they don't seem to let their SIC's go out on their own. a "fair" number of Centers let them contract out on the side so long as it doesn't interfere with the center duties. The ones we have don't charge less than $800 for anything, including little old jets.

 

[TXDA2000]

Part 91 pic, in a certain oil rich town in west Texas for the owners....

In that certain oil rich town in West Texas, the going rate is $600 on the King Air's.

 

[Headwind]

I have found that most people who can afford to own a Jet didn't get that way by paying more than they have to for anything. In a perfect world all owners would have a full time crew and we would not be contracting......taking advantage of the greed.

 

[400A]

I have found that most people who can afford to own a Jet didn't get that way by paying more than they have to for anything. In a perfect world all owners would have a full time crew and we would not be contracting......taking advantage of the greed.

AMEN Headwind! We only use contractors for fill in. (Sick or Vacation) We are lucky enough to only fly 120 hours per year. Dual Captains. I refuse to get hosed by a contract pilot with a "they can afford it" philosophy. There is still a given market rate for each area. I make sure we stay right in the middle of the going rate for our area. In return, the company pilot covers all expenses and we normally pay in about 10 days. I remember what it was like to survive on contract work.

 

[paid4training]

In that certain oil rich town in West Texas, the going rate is $600 on the King Air's.

I'm getting a little more than half that but they just bought a company truck I drive around so I guess I'm doing okay then.