China

[Adios]

Anyone on here flying out of China?

 

[macdu]

Ya, let the questions fly.

 

[Bjammin]

Afirmitive!

 

[WYOMINGPILOT]

Why is there a HUGE disparate difference in pay between the A-320 in China and other Boeings? Most contracts have a 2-3K higher salary for the A-320. The 737 NG and the 777 and 747 are widely utilized in China but don't pay near as well as the A-320.

 

[climbhappy]

there is an airbus factory in Tianjin so there's a bunch more of these flying
they're adding capacity so fast, they can't crew them. it is simple demand.

also, there are more boeing pilots on the street so they're more available. I would submit this based on the fact there are many Europeans, and south americans over here flying boeings

the boeing pay will come up though ..it has to....200 new boeings coming to china in the next two years

 

[sniper]

there is an airbus factory in Tianjin so there's a bunch more of these flying
they're adding capacity so fast, they can't crew them. it is simple demand.

also, there are more boeing pilots on the street so they're more available. I would submit this based on the fact there are many Europeans, and south americans over here flying boeings

the boeing pay will come up though ..it has to....200 new boeings coming to china in the next two years

I am waiting for a 6 weeks on 3 weeks off, around 14k per month, NG Captain deal, is it coming soon or not...your thoughts

 

[Dumb Pilot]

I am waiting for a 6 weeks on 3 weeks off, around 14k per month, NG Captain deal, is it coming soon or not...your thoughts

No only opportunities like this will start popping up in China and S.E. Asia in general but as the demand for experienced pilots increases, there will be an increase in salary as well. The supply and demand aspect is what determines the pilot salaries and not really the location of the factory where the A/C's are built, there are simply more Boeing than Air Bus drivers out there but the applications are drying up, all operators are having trouble meeting their new hire quotas.
You will also start seeing some opportunities for experienced pilots to cross train between Boeing and Air Bus just like we saw for a short period before the world economy took a dive

 

[WYOMINGPILOT]

If you are an A-320 Captain with 500 hours PIC some amazing opportunities are out there. The Boeing pay is lagging but maybe as pointed out it is simply a supply and demand issue. Here is a 6/2 commuting opportunity for an A-320 gig. This is widely available out there so I won't post a source.
Compensation (net/after taxes in China):
US$16,333 made up of:
US$14,000 base service fee per month
US$ 833 travel allowance (US$5,000 reimbursement paid every 6 months)
US$ 1,000 completion bonus (US$24,000 paid at the end of 24 months of service)
US$ 500 flight safety bonus (US$ discretionary paid at the end of each year)

Approximately US$214,000 per year with overtime.

Contract Term:
2 years (renewable)

Work Schedule:
After 6 weeks of duty, off work for 14 days.

 

[d.fitz]

What is the F/O 320 pay like??

Thanks!

 

[Say Again Over]

d.fitz, pay is also good for FO's, also there are many very attractive free upgrade deals available in China.

 

[macdu]

d.fitz, pay is also good for FO's, also there are many very attractive free upgrade deals available in China.

Hmmm..............Where are the f/o deals in China. China produces plenty of their own f/o's. If you have concrete China f/o info please pass it along. But I would advise anyone thinking of taking an f/o contract anywhere to seriously consider you will not upgrade, no matter what the recruiter says or the airline. Except for ANA. It's a huge crap shoot.

 

[thunderworm]

Any of you guys work or know about Okay airlines in China. There is a b737 contract for captain that I might be interested in. I know that some contracts are negotiable but how much so. I would like to have buisness tickets instead of coach and more than 4 a year. Also the bonus is at the discretion of the airline. How likely are they to pay it? Any fines for not wearing hat or hard landings? Other info about quality of company would be great and how much to live in Tianjin. two bedroom apt?

 

[atpcliff]

Aviation in China is EXPLODING, and India is not too far behind!

 

[Dumb Pilot]

Any of you guys work or know about Okay airlines in China. There is a b737 contract for captain that I might be interested in. I know that some contracts are negotiable but how much so. I would like to have buisness tickets instead of coach and more than 4 a year. Also the bonus is at the discretion of the airline. How likely are they to pay it? Any fines for not wearing hat or hard landings? Other info about quality of company would be great and how much to live in Tianjin. two bedroom apt?

I suggest that you find a contract that suits your needs, there are a lot of jobs available right now and more coming in the near future so find one that has the completion bonus, commuting conditions and length that you seek instead of thinking that you can go to one of these outfits (that have a lot of applicants since they are increasing the pay) and tell them that although they don't provide business class commute, they will have to do an exception for you, that is unrealistic.

 

[Say Again Over]

Different strokes, but my preference is no completion bonuses, this only indicates an operation that has to use special tactics to keep you the full contract period, be careful.

 

[thunderworm]

I agree that the completion bonus is used to keep people there, but most contracts I have seen offer this. I was wondering if it is at the discretion of the airline do they usually pay it or not. Assuming that you complete the contract. I also agree that finding a contract that suits my needs is best and what I am looking for. To do this I am looking for information on the company and if expats are generally happy at Okay Airlines. If I go I plan on completing the contract as that is what I say I will do I just want to make sure it is a good decision first. Right now there is a lot of contracts and I want to make sure I pick the best one for me. Thanks

 

[CaptSeth]

Aviation in China is EXPLODING, and India is not too far behind!

Yes, but the explosions in India may wind up being due to CFIT judging by the quality of oversight there.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

I agree that the completion bonus is used to keep people there, but most contracts I have seen offer this. I was wondering if it is at the discretion of the airline do they usually pay it or not. Assuming that you complete the contract. I also agree that finding a contract that suits my needs is best and what I am looking for. To do this I am looking for information on the company and if expats are generally happy at Okay Airlines. If I go I plan on completing the contract as that is what I say I will do I just want to make sure it is a good decision first. Right now there is a lot of contracts and I want to make sure I pick the best one for me. Thanks

There are indeed a lot of shady outfits in China but there are also some good contracts out there, to say that as a rule of thumb you must avoid the places that offer contract completion bonus is eliminating 90% of the contracts offered currently. I recommend that not only do you look at the contract itself but that you also go with a contract company that has a good reputation, that seems to make a huge difference on regards to your experience and the support you will get, typically a good agency (PARC for example) will avoid the more infamous places and give you a more clear picture of what is like working there.

 

[macdu]

As stated there are some shady outfits in China and the ones that I hear about being the worst are the non-government owned operations, of which I think OK is, so take that for what it's worth. You have to realize here that corruption is rampant and that the government is acting like the "family", as in mafia. If an airline is allowed to operate outside the "family" then it's going to pay. What this means to the pilot contractor is that if the operating environment is difficult for the airline it will also be difficult for the pilot. An example is the CAAC is the government. They conduct checkrides, line checks, audit's, etc.......just like the FAA at home, but, with much less objectivity. If they want to slow the airline down they just attack the expat pilot for some infraction and your out. The company just lost a capt. It's difficult to fly with out qualified captains.
This may sound outrageous and it is but, it has happened to people I know.
My suggestion is to stick to the government owned operations. Then you are part of the club. You are working FOR the man, not against him. Crazy I know. But it is crazy over here. Cooperate, graduate, keep your head down, count your $$.

 

[macdu]

Another thing I want to add is, you will be operating as an "independent contractor" but you are signing agreements with the agency and the airline. At least this is the way it is for me. You don't come in and negotiate a contract with the airline. The agency and the airline have already hammered that out. You do your shopping first then decide who you would like to sign with. I have been here now for going on two years and have had two contract amendments that have been improvements to what I originally signed. It's great to be in demand.
With regards to the bonus. I would shop not based on a bonus but on what you take home every month being more important. You may for some reason not make it to the end of the contract, or you name it. Too "iffy". Look at the bonus as just that. I will add that my carrier has paid all bonus's due to all pilots at the completion of their contracts.

 

[thunderworm]

thanks good info. who are some of the Gov. airlines that operate b737s. The completion bonus with Okay is small compared to others but the base pay is greater that is what caught my eye. I agree base pay is better. the contract is through rishworth any major complaints on them for contracts in China?

 

[sniper]

thanks good info. who are some of the Gov. airlines that operate b737s. The completion bonus with Okay is small compared to others but the base pay is greater that is what caught my eye. I agree base pay is better. the contract is through rishworth any major complaints on them for contracts in China?

Let us know which agency and or airline you went with........and why
thanks. I may follow, still thinking about it and not sure for now

 

[macdu]

Just off the top of my head I know Shenzhen and Air China fly the 73. I haven't paid that much attention to it actually. I would check out PPrune on the subject and register with some the agencies. I think Wasinc, Parc, and maybe Vorholdings are your best bet.
Again, the agency is not here holding your hand everyday. Nor do they need to be. You will be on your own. They operate in the background(and the middle man for your $$) if you really need some serious help. You want them to be able to facilitate in the logistics if you for instance become seriously ill and need to get home now. You want to be able to make a phone call and say; Help!

 

[HalinTexas]

Xiamen is hiring B737NG CA's.