When will Frontier Exit Bankruptcy?

[Fubijaakr]

Yep. Ask 400 Midwest pilots how the RAH deal works. Better polish up those resumes F9ers.

 

[FastJP4]

Sad day for what used to be a fantastic airline. Now what - A320 FO's at 23.00/hr? This industry is toast.

 

[Axel]

Supposedly no integration. F9 will remain totally fenced off while republic/chataqua/insert other republic WO's here begin to fly dozens of shiny new EMB 190's all of the country.

sigh...

RAH scope clause:

1.D. Scope
1. This Agreement covers the company, any subsidiary of the
company, the company’s parent, any subsidiary of the
company’s parent and any future airline certificate(s) created as
a subsidiary of the company or subsidiary of the company’s
parent.
2. Except as otherwise provided in this Agreement, all present and
future flying (including that international flying which originates
or terminates within the United States or its possessions) and all
charters, ferry flights (not including ferry flights of newlyacquired
aircraft prior to being placed in revenue service),
training flights, test flights, (except test flights assigned to
management), or other utilization of aircraft owned or leased by
the company, the company’s parent or any subsidiary of the
company or subsidiary of the company’s parent shall be
performed by pilots on the Chautauqua Airlines Pilots’ System
Seniority List in accordance with the terms and conditions of this
Agreement or any other applicable agreement between the
company, the company’s parent or any subsidiary of the
company’s parent and the International Brotherhood of
Teamsters, Airline Division.
3. The Company, Subsidiary of the Company, the Company’s
Parent or Subsidiary of the Parent shall not establish any new
airline (alter ego or otherwise) or acquire a controlling interest in
any carrier whether directly or through the Parent or another
Subsidiary of the Parent, and maintain it as a separate carrier.
A “Controlling Interest” or “Control” means the ownership of an
equity interest representing more than fifty percent (50%) of the
outstanding capital stock of an entity or voting securities
representing more than fifty percent (50%) of the total voting
power of outstanding securities then entitled to vote generally in
the election of such entity’s board of directors or other governing
body.
4. The Company will not transfer aircraft, or operating authority to
its Parent, a Subsidiary of the Parent, or to a Subsidiary of the
Company for the purpose of evading the terms of this
Agreement. The Company will also not establish a third party
leasing device to evade the terms of this agreement.

 

[Baronman]

You know a bad day is a 'comin at your airline when Brian Bedford is seen in the building.

 

[Superpilot92]

i see the mainline partners dropping chauttleublic asap and not supllimenting a direct competetor after this is done. Especially when they will be using the majors own cash to keep ticket prices low.

With SWA going into MKE and DEN i see this turning into Indy Air II unfortunatly. Especially once the F9 guys realize they may have to integrate with a regional.

 

[StaySeated]

RAH scope clause:

1.D. Scope
1. This Agreement covers the company, any subsidiary of the
company, the company’s parent, any subsidiary of the
company’s parent and any future airline certificate(s) created as
a subsidiary of the company or subsidiary of the company’s
parent.
2. Except as otherwise provided in this Agreement, all present and
future flying (including that international flying which originates
or terminates within the United States or its possessions) and all
charters, ferry flights (not including ferry flights of newlyacquired
aircraft prior to being placed in revenue service),
training flights, test flights, (except test flights assigned to
management), or other utilization of aircraft owned or leased by
the company, the company’s parent or any subsidiary of the
company or subsidiary of the company’s parent shall be
performed by pilots on the Chautauqua Airlines Pilots’ System
Seniority List in accordance with the terms and conditions of this
Agreement or any other applicable agreement between the
company, the company’s parent or any subsidiary of the
company’s parent and the International Brotherhood of
Teamsters, Airline Division.
3. The Company, Subsidiary of the Company, the Company’s
Parent or Subsidiary of the Parent shall not establish any new
airline (alter ego or otherwise) or acquire a controlling interest in
any carrier whether directly or through the Parent or another
Subsidiary of the Parent, and maintain it as a separate carrier.
A “Controlling Interest” or “Control” means the ownership of an
equity interest representing more than fifty percent (50%) of the
outstanding capital stock of an entity or voting securities
representing more than fifty percent (50%) of the total voting
power of outstanding securities then entitled to vote generally in
the election of such entity’s board of directors or other governing
body.
4. The Company will not transfer aircraft, or operating authority to
its Parent, a Subsidiary of the Parent, or to a Subsidiary of the
Company for the purpose of evading the terms of this
Agreement. The Company will also not establish a third party
leasing device to evade the terms of this agreement.

I am aware of the existence of that CBA language. I have a few questions about the language itself and the pilots working under that CBA.

Who is defined, in the CBA, as the company?
Who is defined, in the CBA, as the parent?

Will the Chataqua guys demand today that the F9 guys get integrated (forget about how the SLI will take place for now) or will they remain quiet until after the deal is done to raise their grievance?

I would be amazed if no one else threw a bid into this mix. If you look at what Republic is getting and the price that they are paying it is the deal of the century.

Republic buys F9 in the form of $108MM in exit financing.

Republic gets their $40 MM loan repaid immediately.

Republic gets 7-9% of their $150 MM unsecured claim ($10.5-$13.5)

Republic gets untold millions in from First Data that is currently being held as unrestricted cash due to F9's low cash balance sheet.

So for around $50 MM (108-40-10), republic just purchased a billion dollar a year organization. They could possible walk away from the "closing" with cash in their pocket if First Data gets thrown to the curb, which is the most likely scenario. First Data currently has over $150MM in F9 credit card hold back.

Nicely plaid.

 

[huncowboy]

i see the mainline partners dropping chauttleublic asap and not supllimenting a direct competetor

Like they can do that overnight right? No contracts to worry about, etc.

BB wanted to own a real airline. Now he did it. He had to make that move rather sooner than later because the regional jet flying is history especially 50 seats and less. RAH could have not hoped for more codeshare flying. I think this fall many regionals will face reduction in flying that will not come back next Spring. He had to make a move or else he could have watched his company shrink into a dot over the coming years. This guy is brilliant, unfortunately he is a menace to our industry.

Sorry for the F9 FOs. My guess is relative seniority at best which is a disaster. I still remember some of my former CAs at RAH who went on to F9. This is a sad and scary moment for all of us who have managed to move on from RAH.

 

[Axel]

I am aware of the existence of that CBA language. I have a few questions about the language itself and the pilots working under that CBA.

Who is defined, in the CBA, as the company?
Who is defined, in the CBA, as the parent?

L. Definitions used in Article 1
“Company” means Chautauqua Airlines, Inc. or any other Subsidiary of
the Parent or any future airline certificate created or acquired as a
Subsidiary of the Parent.
“Entity” means a natural person, corporation, association, partnership,
trust or any other form for conducting business.
“Parent” means Republic Airways Holdings, Inc. or any successor of the
Parent.
“Subsidiary” means any entity that is controlled by the Company or the
Parent as defined above, herein.

Will the Chataqua guys demand today that the F9 guys get integrated (forget about how the SLI will take place for now) or will they remain quiet until after the deal is done to raise their grievance?

Good question. The union representation is in some turmoil due to the trusteeship imposed by the IBT international on the Local 747. This will certainly test the mettle of the new leadership as well as the RAH pilot group.

 

[johnsonrod]

So would there now be a flow-up and flowback to Frontier from RAH and vice versa? What about the Lynx pilots? I would bet that a senior RAH E170 driver would love to get his hands on a Bus sidestick...

Oh boy... This is gonna get messy.... And no doubt UAL wouldn't want to work with a competitor out of DEN. Perhaps this indicates RAH has little confidence in UAL's ability to survive going forward and it wants to better control its own destiny...

 

[CrownandCoke]

any speculation on the future of Lynx?

 

[sshrae]

They would still need someone to tap into the mountain cities. I don't know if the 170 is a good plane for ASE.

 

[Bolo]

The mood of the pilot group has changed from Giddy to funeral like. Republic wants a no scope clause with F9. Are you out of your mind! I already feel the Midwest scenario coming on F9 property. Pay an Airbus Captain 120 an hour or pay a Republic Captain for an E-175 or E-190 87 an hour for a nine year Captain? I hope there are other investors out there that may bid higher. I can see it now E-190's with Frontier Livery and Republic pilots flying for 87 dollars an hour! Bye bye Airbuses and bye bye Frontier culture which is pretty awesome to say the least.
Vote no on scope and vote often!

 

[Rickindfw]

I feel sorry for you guys, but I sure hope Southwest doesn't step in and do something.

 

[Cornelius]

Glad I'm already furloughed from F9 instead worrying like all the guys still on property. It would have been nice to be recalled since it is a great place to work but looks like other options may prove more beneficial. Good luck to you all and I hope something good comes out of this.

Has a regional ever bought a national? We are in no mans land these days and its just straight up crazy industry.

 

[FlyWolf]

I wonder if AirTran will put a bid in?

 

[Minimaniac]

Despite what Bedford says, there will be an integration of the two seniority lists (three, if Lynx is part of the deal). The RAH CBA requires it. The new trusteeship of Teamsters Local 747 has only worked on two business items so far that we can publicly observe, one being the hearings on our former president/legal counsel, and the other being a wrongful termination case. In both cases, the trustees have come out swinging with well crafted arguments and have been an enormus improvement over our indicted former representation. Bedford will not get around an integration. That said, I am certain that Frontier will be operated as a fourth, separate certificate. I am also certain that the seniority list integration, which is handled by the unions and not Bedford, will give some sort of fence protection to the Frontier guys. While there are RAH pilots who would love to get their hands on the 'Bus, the majority of us are sensible and recognize the need for such protections.

This mve will not hurt RAH's contracts with its partner airlines. We already make money by flying for US Airways, United, Delta, American, Continental, Midwest, and Mokulele. We have always served competing interests. This is no different. None of the above listed airlines will be in contract with the Frontier certificate, and therefore will not be bound by any constraints imposed by those major airlines. American limited the CHQ certificate to 50 seat airplanes via contract, but they can't influence Shuttle or Republic. Likewise, United and Delta have influenced the Shuttle certificate, but cannot exert influence over the Republic certificate. RAH will not lose any business. RAH will be a holding company, and no one will see any big difference at Frontier. Yes, 190's may show up in place of new Airbus. And yes, at some point in time an RAH pilot will end up in the driver's seat of a Frontier aircraft. But, it will stop there.

 

[donvag]

Despite what Bedford says, there will be an integration of the two seniority lists (three, if Lynx is part of the deal). The RAH CBA requires it. The new trusteeship of Teamsters Local 747 has only worked on two business items so far that we can publicly observe, one being the hearings on our former president/legal counsel, and the other being a wrongful termination case. In both cases, the trustees have come out swinging with well crafted arguments and have been an enormus improvement over our indicted former representation. Bedford will not get around an integration. That said, I am certain that Frontier will be operated as a fourth, separate certificate. I am also certain that the seniority list integration, which is handled by the unions and not Bedford, will give some sort of fence protection to the Frontier guys. While there are RAH pilots who would love to get their hands on the 'Bus, the majority of us are sensible and recognize the need for such protections.

This mve will not hurt RAH's contracts with its partner airlines. We already make money by flying for US Airways, United, Delta, American, Continental, Midwest, and Mokulele. We have always served competing interests. This is no different. None of the above listed airlines will be in contract with the Frontier certificate, and therefore will not be bound by any constraints imposed by those major airlines. American limited the CHQ certificate to 50 seat airplanes via contract, but they can't influence Shuttle or Republic. Likewise, United and Delta have influenced the Shuttle certificate, but cannot exert influence over the Republic certificate. RAH will not lose any business. RAH will be a holding company, and no one will see any big difference at Frontier. Yes, 190's may show up in place of new Airbus. And yes, at some point in time an RAH pilot will end up in the driver's seat of a Frontier aircraft. But, it will stop there.

You talked alot but missed the main point. The company you happen to work for is eliminating a decent career for a perpetual job.

 

[sshrae]

Not only that, but you are assuming that the f9ers vote yes. I would be absolutely amazed if that happened. The no scope clause will never fly.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

Why would they need the no scope. He just lets the two companies merge seniority lists per the RAH contract. You will fight to Put up a fence not allowing cross bidding for a certain number of years. Then BB slowly eliminates the airbuses and brings on 190's and BAM, you have just lost a nice pay scale and work rules and are operating under RAH contract.

 

[Superpilot92]

Why would they need the no scope. He just lets the two companies merge seniority lists per the RAH contract. You will fight to Put up a fence not allowing cross bidding for a certain number of years. Then BB slowly eliminates the airbuses and brings on 190's and BAM, you have just lost a nice pay scale and work rules and are operating under RAH contract.

bINGO! This should send up Red Flags to all F9 pilots. Anyone asking for "unlimited scope relief" is just asking to outsource ALL of your flying. Look at Midwest for an example of what good can come out of have no scope protection.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

The problem is they can give up scope or not. Under this deal the two seniority lists will be merged and it will be one company. It is required under the RAH contract. After the lists are merged BB just brings on 190-195s and gets rid of the Airbuses. Scope will have nothing to do with it. The news release said it all. After the reorganization F9 will be a wholly owned subsidiary of RAH.

 

[Superpilot92]

The problem is they can give up scope or not. Under this deal the two seniority lists will be merged and it will be one company. It is required under the RAH contract. After the lists are merged BB just brings on 190-195s and gets rid of the Airbuses. Scope will have nothing to do with it. The news release said it all. After the reorganization F9 will be a wholly owned subsidiary of RAH.

thats not what the reverend is telling the F9 guys,


This is directly from Frontier's Pilot Union:

"There are many terms and conditions within the Republic Plan that must be satisfied in return for this investment. Of interest to FAPA Members – the Republic Plan requires changes be made to our CBA including a 3 year extension (to March 2, 2015) of the amendable date and a change to Section 1.F allowing for “unlimited scope relief.” For all employees, the Frontier profit sharing plan will be replaced with a Republic profit sharing plan. Republic’s terms are initial “asks” and not changes that will be casually forced upon us. Republic has indicated that they plan to operate Frontier as a separate fenced off company and not merge seniority lists."

 

[Superpilot92]

Thats bedford showing how much he respects his current pilots contract if he's already saying he'll get around it. Thats a huge middle finger towards his current pilots. And giving up "unlimited scope relief" is asking to get outsourced or at the very minimum end up getting paid much less. uke:

 

[Captainzero1]

Is RAH, the Warren Buffet of the airline biz or what?

 

[sshrae]

The problem is they can give up scope or not. Under this deal the two seniority lists will be merged and it will be one company. It is required under the RAH contract. After the lists are merged BB just brings on 190-195s and gets rid of the Airbuses. Scope will have nothing to do with it. The news release said it all. After the reorganization F9 will be a wholly owned subsidiary of RAH.

I understand what you are saying, but again that is assuming that the f9 pilots vote for the lists to be merged. They cannot merge the lists without the approval of fapa. That is another area where I don't see the f9ers giving in. Scope and merge are two different things but they will be voted on together.

 

[Yuppyguppy]

So would there now be a flow-up and flowback to Frontier from RAH and vice versa? What about the Lynx pilots? I would bet that a senior RAH E170 driver would love to get his hands on a Bus sidestick...

Oh boy... This is gonna get messy.... And no doubt UAL wouldn't want to work with a competitor out of DEN. Perhaps this indicates RAH has little confidence in UAL's ability to survive going forward and it wants to better control its own destiny...

\

good one... now go back to your summer school class

 

[Secret Squirrel]

Fight the good fight.

 

[djsk]

I thought when Frontier took paycuts it was going to prevent all this?

 

[Browntothebone]

RAH just bought Midwest.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Republic-Airways-to-Acquire-bw-2066208706.html?x=0&.v=1

Republic Airways to Acquire Midwest Airlines

• Press Release
• Source: Republic Airways Holdings
• On Tuesday June 23, 2009, 3:30 pm EDT

• • Republic airways holdings inc.

INDIANAPOLIS--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Republic Airways Holdings (NASDAQ: RJET - News) today announced that it is acquiring Milwaukee-based Midwest Airlines from TPG Capital, a Fort Worth, Texas-based private equity firm. The transaction is subject to customary regulatory approvals and is expected to close in four to six weeks.
Republic will acquire 100% of the equity of Midwest and TPG’s $31 million secured note from Midwest. Consideration will be $6 million in cash and a $25 million, five-year note, which may be converted to RJET stock at $10 per share. In addition, TPG will have the right to nominate a member to the Republic Board of Directors.
“This acquisition will enhance the strategic positioning of Republic Airways,” said Bryan Bedford, chairman, president and CEO of Republic Airways. “Midwest has built a strong brand, a loyal base of customers and dedicated team of employees. We look forward to welcoming them to the Republic family and continuing the Midwest tradition of excellent customer care.”
Bedford added: “As Midwest celebrates its 25th anniversary, I want to make sure I recognize what the employees of Midwest – past and present – have built and sustained through both good and difficult times. This is a great brand built on superior customer service that will continue under new ownership.”
Under the agreement, Midwest will become a wholly owned subsidiary of Republic Airways, with the Midwest brand continuing. Midwest’s Boeing 717s will be replaced with Embraer 190 aircraft, enhancing Midwest’s ability to offer nonstop service to key destinations important to its frequent flyers.
Republic Airways Holdings, based in Indianapolis, Indiana is an airline holding company that owns Chautauqua Airlines, Republic Airlines and Shuttle America. The airlines offer scheduled passenger service on approximately 1,200 flights daily to 101 cities in 37 states, Canada and Mexico through airline services agreements with seven U.S. airlines. All of the airlines’ flights are operated under their airline partner brand, such as AmericanConnection, Continental Express, Delta Connection, United Express, Midwest Connect, Mokulele Airlines and US Airways Express. The airlines currently employ approximately 4,500 aviation professionals and operate 212 regional jets.
In addition to historical information, this release contains forward-looking statements. Republic Airways may, from time-to-time, make written or oral forward-looking statements within the meaning of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. Such statements encompass Republic Airways’ beliefs, expectations, hopes or intentions regarding future events. Words such as "expects," "intends," "believes," "anticipates," "should," "likely" and similar expressions identify forward-looking statements. All forward-looking statements included in this release are made as of the date hereof and are based on information available to Republic Airways as of such date. Republic Airways assumes no obligation to update any forward-looking statement. Actual results may vary, and may vary materially, from those anticipated, estimated, projected or expected for a number of reasons, including, among others, the risk factors disclosed in the Company’s most recent filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission.

Contact:


Republic Airways Holdings
Carlo Bertolini, 317-484-6069

 

[CitationLover]

I hope our MEC is calling Frontier's.