Avantair?

[Bustin]

I'm wrestling with the idea of leaving the regional 121 world for Avantair. I have yet to even apply, so this may be premature anyway, but can anyone offer any input into this world of fractional flying as opposed to flying in the regional world? More specificially, how is life at Avantair? How many hours are the pilots logging per month? Is a fractional pilot with turbo prop time marketable to a major airline if (in the unlikely event) one decided to switch back to 121? Financially, if I make this move, going back to a regional would no longer be an option on the table. This post may sound naive... I'm still pretty new to this industry. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

 

[johnsonrod]

I'm wrestling with the idea of leaving the regional 121 world for Avantair. I have yet to even apply, so this may be premature anyway, but can anyone offer any input into this world of fractional flying as opposed to flying in the regional world? More specificially, how is life at Avantair? How many hours are the pilots logging per month? Is a fractional pilot with turbo prop time marketable to a major airline if (in the unlikely event) one decided to switch back to 121? Financially, if I make this move, going back to a regional would no longer be an option on the table. This post may sound naive... I'm still pretty new to this industry. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Bustin,

Check your PMs and also look at this link to another post on Avantair:

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=110386&page=2

 

[Heavy Set]

I'm wrestling with the idea of leaving the regional 121 world for Avantair. I have yet to even apply, so this may be premature anyway, but can anyone offer any input into this world of fractional flying as opposed to flying in the regional world? More specificially, how is life at Avantair? How many hours are the pilots logging per month? Is a fractional pilot with turbo prop time marketable to a major airline if (in the unlikely event) one decided to switch back to 121? Financially, if I make this move, going back to a regional would no longer be an option on the table. This post may sound naive... I'm still pretty new to this industry. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

That Piaggio is one hot airplane as you will see here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PozsRQUjem4

or here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_T-7ZMeoc4

The 2nd youtube clip is goofy but the point is well taken - the Piaggio is a fast and fun airplane to fly. The Piaggio Avanti II is the more advanced version with the Pro Line 21 flight deck - very nice glass.

 

[Bustin]

Thanks for the info guys.

 

[irija]

can anyone post a day's experience at Avant Air?

 

[On Your Six]

can anyone post a day's experience at Avant Air?

Look at the following link and click on the flight numbers to see where they are flying and where they have been:

http://flightaware.com/live/fleet/VNR

 

[glasspilot]

Wake up at the hotel around 6 or 7 for a 7 or 8 show for a 8 or 9 wheels up. Eat the hotel breakfast and get in the crew car / rental car / hotel bus / FBO van and go to the airport. Captain goes in to file flight plans and arrange for aircraft services (fuel, gpu, ect) while the FO goes out to pull the plugs, put the steering pin in and get the cabin ready for the pax.

Captain gives the flight plan from flightplan.com to the FO and waits for the owners while the FO goes out to get the clearance and ATIS and such. Owners arrive pretty much on time and Captain greets them, exchanges pleasantries and informs them of flight time and weather while asking about transportation at their destination.

Everyone boards up and Captain or FO brief the pax on safety features and ensures they have all they need and are comfortable. Both pilots meet in the cockpit and run checklists and go.

At the destination the owners car is waiting for them and the pilots help get the owners bags and stuff into the car. Once they're gone the Captain calls the company and reports the times of the last leg and confirms that the remaining legs are unchanged.

Then the whole process is repeated 4 or 5 times until the day is done at which point the crew puts the plane to bed and heads to the hotel.

We always have at least 10 hours of rest but I can't remember the last time that's all I got. Most every night I get to sample an adult beverage and relax a bit.

Hope that gets the main points for you...

 

[Bustin]

Wow, that sounds like a long day. What kind of duty days are you guys putting in over there?

 

[Skimatic]

I've been averaging 10.2 hrs per duty day since the start of 2008.

This is from the log pages which I'm keeping stats on.

3.2 legs per day.

 

[irija]

That doesn't seem that bad at all. In between legs, how long are your sits if any / turn times and have you had nights without that much rest at all? Any short calls, etc?

 

[celloman]

The sits are from as long as 6 hours (VERY RARE) to as short as 30 min. Most of the turns run between an hour to an hour and a half. No day is EVER the same.

In 2 years I have done 2 red eyes. Each time with tons of rest. The good news is no standups!

As for short call outs that has happened once... we went from a 16 hr rest to 14 hr. During peak travle if your plane is working doing a 14hr. duty day is not out of the question.

-celloman

 

[Skimatic]

I've had my share of short call outs in the past 3 years.

Phone rings right at the end of 10 hours rest thinking I had an 18 hr rest period. Only twice that they have called at the middle of the rest period (which they are allowed to do once per our GOM).

Planes break during the night, wx and icing concerns, all contribute to this. I never assume anything concerning rest after the day's trips are done. I tell my FO get rested and standby and be ready for anything.

Each day is different. You have to roll with the punches here. If not you can get easily frustrated and burn out.

I don't volunteer for overtime except when asked or maybe I get in too late to catch that airline flight home. Last year (2007) I worked 188 days which included recurrent training. Not a bad schedule. I figure I can put up with it. They have me for a scheduled 7 days of time. I don't ask why they are giving me a 2.5 - 3.0 repo. I don't ask why they are sending me to this airport. It's obvious things are going to change here; they can't keep losing the money like they have. Remember Avantair is a public company so it is easy to track finiancials now.

They have many inefficiencies built in that must be addressed for the long term. I have my list of what I see. I guess we'll see.

 

[On Your Six]

What are some of the longest flights you guys have flown in the P180? Does it have pretty good range? Is it a 4-5 hour airplane? Given that the flight deck is a bit cramped, how do you keep yourself from developing dvt on the longer flights? That's one advantage of shorter flights - it can be less taxing on your back.

I know I can't sit for more than 90 minutes in a row - my a$$ is getting flatter by the day...

 

[AftCG182]

The 90 minute trips are the best. For me, anything over three hours might fall into the "bladder buster" category. 3 hours, 45 minutes is my longest so far, had several of those but I've only been here six months.

As far as the seat thing goes, years of doing heavy squats at the gym has provided me with a little extra padding on the buttissimo... a built-in cushion of sorts. The the lower back pain starts at 2-1/2 hours.

I'm sure the guys that have been here longer might have differing opinions on the seat thing.

I'm 5'9", and it feels like the cockpit was designed just for me. Not a tight fit at all once you're in and seated. Climbing in can be work, sometimes. With the adjustable seat and rudder pedals almost anyone can feel right at home.

 

[Masterplan]

Whats the hiring like now? Are all bases open? Competative times? Anybody want to adopt me?

 

[celloman]

We recieved an email from the pilot hiring dept that stated.

1. All classes had been filled for the year
2. Most if not all interview slots were filled and the people offered a job would be put in a pool.
3. Depending on needs they might add another class.
4. Hiring mins have not changed but I dont know what competative is.
5. You almost have to know someone to get hired.

As for bases. This is the million dollar question. Most of them are open except for a slot or two. The company is evaluating the cost of each base and adding to the basses that cost the least. It looks like most of the hiring is going to come from the middle of the country. I think IAH had 10 openings most of the east and west coast had 1 or 2 in each base.

Hope this helps!

-celloman

 

[PARAMOUNT]

You guys got to look at the big picture.....
1. you are all driving turbo props....
2. you really don't need a type rating to be a CAPT. in your company.
3. and the starting salary really sucks.....
plain and simple,
why would anyone want to work at this company?

 

[glasspilot]

Here's the "bigger" picture,

1. we fly a plane that is very economical,
2. I fly many former "other fractional" owners,
3. I have all of the precious type ratings I need to stoke my ego,
4. I make more money for less work than any other job I've ever had, and I've been a captain WITH a typed plane too!
5. you are a tool.

 

[avbug]

You guys got to look at the big picture.....
1. you are all driving turbo props....
2. you really don't need a type rating to be a CAPT. in your company.
3. and the starting salary really sucks.....
plain and simple,
why would anyone want to work at this company?

"You are all driving turboprops." Really? You don't think, perhaps that anybody noticed this? Is that anything like telling a man on a bicycle "you're on a bicycle" or informing a black man that yes indeed, he is black?

Your grasp of the obvious is indeed staggering, leaving one truly underwhelmed. You must be a college graduate.

"You really don't need a type rating to be a CAPT. for your company." Again, with the obvious. Here's something you might not know: one doesn't need a type rating to be a first officer there, either. Or a secretary. Or a mechanic. Or a bottle washer, chief hair dresser, or the guy who changes the lightbulbs in the records room. Isn't that an amazing coincidence? It does, however, beg the question: so what??

"And the starting salary really sucks." How would you phrase that if you didn't talk like a 14 year old? Sucks? Really? Do you preface your statements in general with "dude," too, or is "sucks" the technical way of analyzing the elementary compensation rate at this operator? Clearly you are an economics major, with a deep, technical vocabulary such as that. "Sucks?"

Of course, whereas you don't work there, of what possible concern is the starting salary, to you?

You're familiar with the salary at an airline, are you not? You're familiar with the starting salaries there, too? You're familiar with the fact that many pilots flying turbojet airplanes are making less, are you not? And yet you still say such stupid things, as what you just said? Are you finished embarassing yourself publicly yet?

"Plain and simple, why would anyone want to work at this company?"

You're not done embarassing yourself yet, we see.

First of all, to answer a question with a question...why is that any of your business? Why should you care? Does gainful employment by others offend you or hurt your sense of order in the universe, or are you simply in the habit of sticking your nose so far into other people's business that your pores are brown?

In a time when work is becoming difficult to find, in a time when furloughs are common, when companies are folding, when the industry at large is in peril, and when the economy on a global scale is collapsing and falling in many markets and on all sides, you have the temerity and stupidity to ask why a pilot would take a profitable, paying job in good equipment, with a regular schedule, good time off, considerable variety, descent clientelle, in new airplanes, flying domestically? Why don't you ask some of the pilots who have been there a few years now, and who like it there? But then again, why should you care, and what business is it of yours?

If it's not for you, then try not to trip over your knuckles, and move on.

 

[Snakum]

Paramount(ed) ... I'm afraid, my good man, your ass has been completely "owned", as my son would say. And that was some serious ownage, too.

I've peeked inside the 180 a few times when it was in for maintenance where I fly occasionally. Nice ride. Crews have always been friendly and professional. I'd jump on a job with Avantair in a heartbeat.