Fired From Virgin America

[FDJ2]

I think the APA as an independent union has more teeth than any ALPA carrier. The resolve of the members make the union not the boys in Herndon.

Yep, they were quick to make concessions after 9-11. I can't remember when they negotiated an industry leading contract.

I do agree that the resolve of the members make the union, but a strong union also needs a strategic plan, resources and a voice when legislation affecting the membership is considered.

 

[Kharma Police]

Delta's "queen of the skies"? Did she have union representation?

Nope, just a nice set of .........

 

[PCL_128]

I think we should look into and consider ALPA at AirTran. At least hopefully we would not be screwed as bad if we were bought by another ALPA represented airline?

Amen.

 

[Lear70]

If someone a little more well-known had run on an ALPA platform, it might have been a lot closer of an election...

There's a lot of people who are anxious for a little more "structure" from their Association. I'm hoping MB will help bring that to fruition...

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I think the APA as an independent union has more teeth than any ALPA carrier. The resolve of the members make the union not the boys in Herndon.

Bark and no bite....

The APA? Left ALPA in the 1950's over egos.

Won't come back to ALPA because of egos.

Does the common APA pilot have representation on Capitol Hill? Well...sort of... thru CAPA. But thier effectiveness is diluted if not nil.

Every single ALPA pilot is represented on CapHill.


Does the APA have permanent oberver status at ICAO, the avaition unit of The United Nations? No. However, every ALPA member is represented at ICAO.

AMR flies international operations. Are the APA pilots connected to an international federation of Air Line Pilots? No. Every ALPA pilot is.... www.ifalpa.org



The criminalization of Air Line Pilots is on the rise. If you have an abort, air return, injury or death on your aircraft in a foreign country quite often the first people on your jet is the police and they will most likely retain your pilot certificate and/or passport. Every ALPA pilot has a local number to call in a foreign country. Who does the APA pilot call? Dallas?

 

[Kharma Police]

Bark and no bite....

The APA? Left ALPA in the 1950's over egos.

Won't come back to ALPA because of egos.

Does the common APA pilot have representation on Capitol Hill? Well...sort of... thru CAPA. But thier effectiveness is diluted if not nil.

Every single ALPA pilot is represented on CapHill.


Does the APA have permanent oberver status at ICAO, the avaition unit of The United Nations? No. However, every ALPA member is represented at ICAO.

AMR flies international operations. Are the APA pilots connected to an international federation of Air Line Pilots? No. Every ALPA pilot is.... www.ifalpa.org



The criminalization of Air Line Pilots is on the rise. If you have an abort, air return, injury or death on your aircraft in a foreign country quite often the first people on your jet is the police and they will most likely retain your pilot certificate and/or passport. Every ALPA pilot has a local number to call in a foreign country. Who does the APA pilot call? Dallas?

You forgot stickers, ALPA gives out great stickers.

 

[thor2j]

Bark and no bite....

The APA? Left ALPA in the 1950's over egos.

Won't come back to ALPA because of egos.

Does the common APA pilot have representation on Capitol Hill? Well...sort of... thru CAPA. But thier effectiveness is diluted if not nil.

Every single ALPA pilot is represented on CapHill.


quote]
Great, we have people on capital hill misrepresenting the majority interests of its membership. APA definetly has more respect from its members, which in turn equals unity. ALPA is all over the place.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Great, we have people on capital hill misrepresenting the majority interests of its membership. APA definetly has more respect from its members, which in turn equals unity. ALPA is all over the place.

I take it you are an ALPA member....

What is ALPA doing that is misrepsresenting its pilots on CapHill....?

Why does the APA have more respect from its members?

What do you mean by ALPA is all over the place.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

You forgot stickers, ALPA gives out great stickers.

After an event in a foreign country... there is a 36 hour window to get a pilot back to his/her home country before incarceration....

If you want to talk about stickers we can.... but I want to be a part of an International Association that can get me home to my family so I don't sit in a jail cell. I want to belong to a group that has a local number and 36 hour game plan. Not a Dallas area code.

Note I said.... his/her...

Imagine being a female Captain in China or the Mid East and having an event... the police enter your jet to revoke your license..... and see something that offends them..... a woman captain....

Who do you want to call? The APA or a local member organization of IFALPA?

www.ifalpa.org

 

[Kharma Police]

After an event in a foreign country... there is a 36 hour window to get a pilot back to his/her home country before incarceration....

If you want to talk about stickers we can.... but I want to be a part of an International Association that can get me home to my family so I don't sit in a jail cell. I want to belong to a group that has a local number and 36 hour game plan. Not a Dallas area code.

Note I said.... his/her...

Imagine being a female Captain in China or the Mid East and having an event... the police enter your jet to revoke your license..... and see something that offends them..... a woman captain....

Who do you want to call? The APA or a local member organization of IFALPA?

www.ifalpa.org

Which ALPA airline do you fly for? Do you do alot of flying into China or the Middle East? You understand that other countries have different laws than the USA and if you break them the State Department, ALPA, IFALPA, NASA or anyone else might not be able to help you. Most pilot contracts have a provision from the company regarding this kind of situation but I'm glad you have a number to call.

 

[twepilot]

any t'dub pilots care to comment on that last post of brilliance?

rv

 

[Kharma Police]

any t'dub pilots care to comment on that last post of brilliance?

rv

Why don't you give it a crack

 

[AA717driver]

APA won't come back to ALPA because they don't see a benefit.

Other than a literal handful of pro-ALPA AA pilots, there is no desire on the part of the AA pilot group to join ALPA.

APA has direct relations with the other OneWorld carrier unions. Not a small number of pilots. But, if we ever see the need to communicate with Ethiopian Airways' pilot group, we have your number.

Representation on Capitol Hill? We'll take our chances. TC

P.S.--Better tell your boyz in Herndon not to destroy anymore evidence (electronic or otherwise). CHA-CHING!

 

[PCL_128]

P.S.--Better tell your boyz in Herndon not to destroy anymore evidence (electronic or otherwise). CHA-CHING!

You just see what happened to the RJDC? Complete and utter failure. After the settlement with ALPA for partial legal fees, they still ended up paying over $1 million in out of pocket legal expenses. The TWA lawsuit will end up the same way. Just a matter of time, and a bunch of pilots will end up with nothing to show for it except a drain on their pocket book to cover legal fees.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Which ALPA airline do you fly for? Do you do alot of flying into China or the Middle East?

Does it matter who I fly for or don't fly for? It is not about me. It is about the global economy and how the captitalist and gov'ts are looking at all examples.

The Ryan Air biz model in Europe is being watched. Other airlines are taking note of Ryan...not SWA. The poor working conditions in the US are nothing compared to Ryan.

If we don't concern oursleves with other pilots then as they go down we will be pulled with them.... no.. better to help them up... so we don't go down..

You understand that other countries have different laws than the USA and if you break them the State Department, ALPA, IFALPA, NASA or anyone else might not be able to help you.

Yeah.. that is my point... however, IFALPA has experience... including helping the EMB pilots get out of Brazil.... what did the APA do? See below...

Most pilot contracts have a provision from the company regarding this kind of situation but I'm glad you have a number to call.

Can you provide a reference?

APA won't come back to ALPA because they don't see a benefit.

Agreed...

Other than a literal handful of pro-ALPA AA pilots, there is no desire on the part of the AA pilot group to join ALPA.

Agreed...

APA has direct relations with the other OneWorld carrier unions. Not a small number of pilots. But, if we ever see the need to communicate with Ethiopian Airways' pilot group, we have your number.

I don't think One World business alliances is what we are talking about...

Representation on Capitol Hill? We'll take our chances. TC

You already are...

P.S.--Better tell your boyz in Herndon not to destroy anymore evidence (electronic or otherwise). CHA-CHING!

Ouch... that hurts me when you say that!

ALPA Reacts to Release of Pilots from Brazil
In reaction to the release by Brazilian authorities of two pilots who had been detained since they were involved in an aviation accident on September 29, Capt. Paul Rice, ALPA's vice-president–administration/secretary, released the following statement:

“Criminalizing action by pilots involved in aviation accidents is a serious concern to all ALPA members, other professional pilots, and the flying public. The threat of criminal prosecution of pilots undermines a healthy safety culture. It interferes with the effective and efficient investigation of aircraft accidents, but more importantly, it inhibits the collection of information needed to prevent the reoccurrence of a similar accident. Pilots need to be free to ensure the safe completion of their flight, and should not be distracted by the threat of a criminal investigation or imprisonment for doing their job.​

“ALPA will be closely watching this case as it unfolds, knowing that it will hold important ramifications for the future. We are pleased that the two pilots are returning home, and we will continue to work with our own government and those of other nations to ensure that future incidents like this are handled in accordance with International Civil Aviation Organization principles.”​

The ALPA statement states... "work with...."

Here is the APA's statment...

ALLIED PILOTS ASSOCIATION CALLS ON BRAZIL TO RELEASE PILOTS
DETAINED AFTER GOL AIRLINES FLIGHT 1907 ACCIDENT
‘Accident investigation should not be a criminal proceeding’​

Fort Worth, Texas (Nov. 21, 2006)—The Allied Pilots Association (APA), collective
bargaining agent for the 13,000 pilots of American Airlines (NYSE: AMR), has issued a
statement calling for the release of the two pilots of an ExcelAire Embraer Legacy 600 that was
involved in an apparent mid-air collision with a Gol Airlines Boeing 737 on Sept. 29 over Brazil.
The two pilots, who are U.S. citizens, were required by Brazilian authorities to surrender their
passports and have been detained since the accident.
APA previously issued a statement on Oct. 11 emphasizing the importance of a “full, fair
and timely investigation” into the cause of the accident. The Gol Airlines Boeing 737 went down
with the loss of all 154 aboard, while the damaged ExcelAire jet landed safely at a remote
military airfield.
“The Allied Pilots Association reiterates its call for a full, fair and timely accident
investigation and respectfully requests that the Brazilian government permit Captain Joseph
Lepore and First Officer Jan Paladino to return to the United States. We further call upon
Brazilian authorities to conduct this accident investigation according to widely accepted
International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) Annex 13 guidelines, rather than as a criminal
proceeding. It has long been understood that criminalizing the accident investigation process has
a serious chilling effect on its effectiveness, since parties to an accident are likely to be less
forthcoming with potentially vital information.
“APA is also asking the U.S. government to express to Brazilian authorities the need to
permit the two pilots to return to their homes, as well as the importance of conducting the
accident investigation in accordance with ICAO Annex 13.
“In closing, we will continue to keep everyone affected by this tragic accident in our​

thoughts and prayers.”

The APA can only "call upon" and "is also asking" because they have no long term standing working relationship with gov't or ICAO...