Leave CAL for SWA?

["Next Wave"]

Stay put! And congradulations on the job you have!

Stay where your at and apply at Fed-ex and UPS, much more secure. Barring a world war. Just look at the history of aviation. Um......... Braniff; the place to be....Pan Am; the place to be........ and in the 90's Delta and United the place to be........American still has people on furlough. Now Southewst; the place to be. The growth rate is slowing at SWA. Fuel Hedging? Whats next? Airtran threat? etc.........

 

[bravodude]

Once again your hourly pay is definetly better, but when u factor in 13% rertirement and SWA has none a 25 yr career is with in $90,000.

What in the world are u talking about. We not only have a 401k company match which is pretty generous but with profit sharring we have one heck of a retirement. I won't even try to explain how flying one type will get a swa guy to make max pay years ahead of a cal guy waitting to hold a 777 pos.

 

[Flopgut]

Hey Guys (and Gals)

Thanks for all the responses and insight. Yes, SWA is the place I've wanted to work since I was in high school....I feel like I want to shoot for my dream job at least one more time. I don't feel like CAL gave me a type rating because I was one of "those guys" who paid for it before I got to CAL (but lets not start another one of those threads).

Flying internationally doesn't appeal to me at all...but being home with more days off, great people, and a little more $$ sounds pretty good. That being said, I'm fairly young (28) and maybe 30 years from now I would want to do international stuff (but then again, maybe SWA will be doing that then).

One thing I worry about is my buddy at CAL that helped me get the job...but I also worry if I interview at SWA and have the 6-7 people there that I know write me letters...I don't want them to get any heat for me interivewing and then not accepting the job (if I got offered one that is).

I guess I need to get a second interview call before I need to worry about anything....but just wanted to get thoughts from others.

I've got no love for LUV. However, stop worrying about your buds, at both airlines, and do your thing. If you can get hired there, GO! Somebody at CAL gives you a hard time? Say: "I'm going to a better deal". CAL loses enough pilots and they'll figure out what's going on. Make an honest decision and it will be good for both airlines.

Check your PMs.

 

[thor2j]

What in the world are u talking about. We not only have a 401k company match which is pretty generous but with profit sharring we have one heck of a retirement. I won't even try to explain how flying one type will get a swa guy to make max pay years ahead of a cal guy waitting to hold a 777 pos.

Once again you need to re-read what I said. Company matched 401k involves you putting money in. I said Company paid, not with you puttiing in something. Profit sharing can not be counted on. Yes you guys have had it for a while, but it may not last. We had 8% at CAL, not factoring that by any means. I am not knocing SWA at all, I think it is a great place. I also think all the others will be coming back to where they should be and you guys may come up a little. It is all cyclical. In the 90s nobody wanted to work for SWA, post 9/11 everbody does. Who knows, 10 years from now the hot one maybe skybus!!!

 

[Charlie Brown]

However, stop worrying about your buds, at both airlines, and do your thing. If you can get hired there, GO! Somebody at CAL gives you a hard time? Say: "I'm going to a better deal".

This is a purely business decision. You have to take the emotion out of the equation. I agree you don't want to make your buddies who went to bat look bad, but you have to realize it is your life and you have to do what makes sense to you (and your family). I have been in a very similar situation, and it is somewhat sticky. Luckily my friends are truely friends and totally understood (and would have done the same thing as me if the tables had been turned--they told me this). I was fortunate that no ill will has been passed on to them from the airline in question, and I doubt it would be at CAL either. You have put some time in and are frankly just another number. They do not want to lose you, but life goes on, your are replaceable, and nobody is going to take the time to track down your recs, and ream them for something someone else did. It is just not very realistic to think this would happen unless you left under really bad terms.

In any case, it sounds like you still want SWA, and if you do I would encourage you to go for it. I wish you the best of luck!

CB

 

[Tejas-Jet]

I'd leave CAL for SWA after 5 years, here's why: QOL, money, management.

'Nuff said.

BINGO !!! I left a legacy airline after almost 10 years there. To date I have never regretted my decision to come to SWA and have not been disappointed. However my priorities were a bit different. I left for better Management, QOL, money.....

I found out that that money can be good....but if the company is shiite...it ain't worth it...crisis after crisis after crisis...it wasn't worth it to me...

 

[Tejas-Jet]

In the 90s nobody wanted to work for SWA,

Really??? I don't know what seniority list you are looking at but a quick look at the SWA seniority list I have says that from January 1990-December 1999, over 2,000 pilots were hired at SWA. Who knows how many more actually interviewed.

The pilot seniority grew by over 150% in that same time frame when "nobody wanted to work for SWA" and ( the best part)...nobody was ever furloughed at SWA during "the 90's when nobody wanted to work for SWA."

BTW....I am one of the over 2,000 that did want to work for SWA during the 90's.

 

[canyonblue]

BTW....I am one of the over 2,000 that did want to work for SWA during the 90's.

I also wanted to work, and interviewed, at SWA prior to 9/11. Many people also didn't want to buy a Japanese car in the '70's, plenty of stupid people in every decade. :smash:

 

[DiamondZ]

One thing I worry about is my buddy at CAL that helped me get the job...but I also worry if I interview at SWA and have the 6-7 people there that I know write me letters...

If you have the opportunity to go to a different company just remember to be respectful and gracious as you leave your current employer.

Your buddy should understand. Im sure at some point he too had to make a tough career decision.

 

[IAHERJ]

Not going to go into a CAL vs SWA debate here. These are 2 very different companies doing different things. I think you are worried about letting CAL or your friends down if you end up going to SWA. Don't!!! This is your life and your career. If your heart is at SWA, and they hire you, you have to go; period.... Don't worry about what CAL thinks. It happens more than you think here and I think it is good that people are leaving from time to time. Your friends will get over it if they are truly good friends. I had my best friend leave CAL for DAL a few months ago. I'm happy for him as DAL was his dream and his legacy. Go for it!!!!

IAHERJ

 

[Captain Overs]

a message to Express guys that were turned down by CAL: GET OVER IT!
i applaud the company for filtering out the fools.

btw: it's $3 billion in cash reserves for CAL. and yes...we know where a big chunk of it comes from. the pilots who signed the company a huge loan are retiring in droves. payday is coming soon for the rest of us.

Never applied at CAL, but I must be on to something because you can't defend what was said. I didn't post it to flame you, I only posted something that happens to be true. You can only try and attack me personally. Its ok, I understand frustration comes out in anger directed towards other people who happen to say things you don't like.

 

[SWA/FO]

I also wanted to work, and interviewed, at SWA prior to 9/11

the SWA/FO too

 

[Pocono Pilot]

I've heard about a lot of people leaving CAL for other airlines. Don't feel bad about it and make your move to a better company with better Qol.

If people keep leaving CAL in droves, as it seems they still are, eventually CAL will wise up and treat their employees better and get rid of that atrotious contract.

Or they will merge. One of the two.

 

[IAHERJ]

I've heard about a lot of people leaving CAL for other airlines. Don't feel bad about it and make your move to a better company with better Qol.

If people keep leaving CAL in droves, as it seems they still are, eventually CAL will wise up and treat their employees better and get rid of that atrotious contract.

Or they will merge. One of the two.

Are you for real??

 

[capt. megadeth]

the SWA/FO too

That's back when their standards were really low. :laugh:

 

[capt. megadeth]

If people keep leaving CAL in droves, as it seems they still are, eventually CAL will wise up and treat their employees better and get rid of that atrotious contract.

I wouldn't hold my breath for that one. We are in an era of corporate greed and rape. Companies could care less how they treat their employees whether they leave or not.

 

[Furloughed80]

CAL's balance sheet only looks that good because they made it off the back of the pilots and Fa's with concessions. Enjoy your "great" company at less than 1997 rates!

Those rates will change with Contract '08.

 

[johnsonrod]

There will always be enough COEX pilots willing to take the crap 1st-year package at CAL to "make it to the big leagues." CAL's management has nothing to worry about. What surprises me is the number of 1st and 2nd year CAL pilots willing to leave to go elsewhere and take their training with them...

I personally know a few who have left CAL for SWA after a year or two despite compelling reasons to stay (got past the 1st year pay/benefits package).

 

[MJG]

Companies could care less how they treat their employees whether they leave or not.

I wouldn't lump Southwest into that group.........They truely are a different kind of airline in that regard.

To the original poster, give your buddy a call and a heads up on what your plans are. Just let him/her know what you truely want to do. I think you'll find that they will be very understanding.

Just make sure they are not still on probabtion at CAL...................

 

[Furloughed80]

As noted on another thread, this was posted by Pocono Pilot on 2/24/07.

I agree.

With all the retirements, CAL could be the most secure major out there. Also, there is a good chance that CAL will be the highest paid eventually with a new contract.

I hope to be there soon

Give it a rest already. It is completely obvious you were turned down by CAL. Don't worry, other airlines are hiring. You won't be at express forever. ; )

 

[AWACoff]

Furloughed,

I think it would be a good idea to simply post the quote after every one of PP's posts. I've got her on ignore but too many people keep quoting her current posts and I still have to read her/his rubbish. I don't know what I am going to do with 80k on first year pay in GUM with COLA. Maybe snorkel, scuba dive, travel the orient... Maybe Pocono got turned down at CAL and then got downgraded to FO at COEX because she wasn't able to cut the mustard...?

 

[ERJFO]

Furloughed,

I think it would be a good idea to simply post the quote after every one of PP's posts. I've got her on ignore but too many people keep quoting her current posts and I still have to read her/his rubbish. I don't know what I am going to do with 80k on first year pay in GUM with COLA. Maybe snorkel, scuba dive, travel the orient... Maybe Pocono got turned down at CAL and then got downgraded to FO at COEX because she wasn't able to cut the mustard...?

The crazy thing is... That has happened, just not in that order.

 

[Benhuntn]

Capt Megagirth....that was a low blow against SWA/FO. I think it is time to go change the pad again....

 

[Flopgut]

I only do a LOR for guys/gals I think will actually help raise the mortgage. I don't even have to particuliarly like them. So, if I get jacked up someday about someone leaving, I'll say "hey, I thought they were good and deserved support, you can't keep em? that's your fault!" I'd rather rec somebody good and find out later they want to leave and be a tool, than rec somebody I mostly know as a bud, and have them call in sick half the time and treat the customers like crap.

Let SWA have all the tools! They used to have nearly none...now look at them.

 

[AlbieF15]

There will always be enough COEX pilots willing to take the crap 1st-year package at CAL to "make it to the big leagues." ).

I know some that did and might be captains at 3.5 years on the property. I know others who said "no thanks" and have gone to SWA, FDX, and even UPS.

I don't think someone diving on a low first year wage for 1 year makes them a bad guy or gal...its been the industry norm for years. I think its pretty clear the current CAL guys want to change that--instead of saying "we had to do it" they are trying to pay it forward in 08. I'd give them a chance and see what happens before I started labeling them.

SWA is a great company. Multi-legs domestic ain't everyone's dream, however. Personally--I find at FDX I like domestic, but many of my buds just LOVE going to Europe or Asia on a regular or semi-regular basis. CAL is one of the few places that offer that to guys this junior (although Delta is starting to now..). Find you niche. Follow your heart. There isn't a right answer here.

And...FWIW...rumors are that 1000 PIC + a type will be the new minimums at SWA. Getting called without the type may become more rare in the coming months. If you pay for a type--or pay first year insurance out of your pocket--what's the difference if you are reaching your career goal?

 

[jball2]

I LUV SWA with all my heart. It has been my dream job from day one over 5 years ago. However, I applied to CAL, DAL, UAL, FDX, NWA, USAirways, and Jetblue. I didn't know what was best for me until it landed in my lap. We have great scheds, not all of the layovers are in LBB as General Lee would lead you to believe, and they take great care of us. I enjoy the people I work with, the time I'm at work and I love my time off. My friends at CAL seem to enjoy theirselves as well. IAHERJ and I have talked about it and I know he has a blast at CAL. If you REALLY want SWA then we want you here. However, I can't figure out how to get hired here anymore!

This whole career is exactly what YOU make of it!

Cheers!

 

[SWA/FO]

That's back when their standards were really low. :laugh:

Standards were low? I got hired and you didn't. Maybe you suck more then we all thought?

 

[capt. megadeth]

Standards were low? I got hired and you didn't.

Yep, they did me (and all of you) a HUGE favor.

 

[AV80R]

I know others who said "no thanks" and have gone to SWA, FDX, and even UPS.

Even UPS? What an honor!

Wow Albie, at least you included us in the "winner" circle. Barely but still...

...suddenly I feel you don't love your brown brothers & sisters no more...

Hey, I even turned down a SWA interview for the brown life, how weird is that huh?

Ok, no more beer for me...

 

[Charlie Brown]

Even UPS? What an honor!

Wow Albie, at least you included us in the "winner" circle. Barely but still...

...suddenly I feel you don't love your brown brothers & sisters no more...

Hey, I even turned down a SWA interview for the brown life, how weird is that huh?

Ok, no more beer for me...

I think he meant even UPS in the sense they don't hire as much as most other places and they are difficult to even get interviews with. "Even UPS", the way I read it was like "even UPS!" in a positive way. I have never known Albie to be a chop-buster. Then again, he does work for your competition