Loads picking up for ExpressJet Airlines

[lowery21]

Wait a minute here. You mean to tell me there is a bar on greens road?

 

[gmbpilot757]

Good Job and good luck. Express has always been a class act.

That's one of the funniest things I've heard in a long time!

 

[Booker]

Wait a minute here. You mean to tell me there is a bar on greens road?

Oh yeah. imp:

 

[Superpilot92]

Wait a minute here. You mean to tell me there is a bar on greens road?

Its not "a bar" its "THE" Bar!!


http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e392/christopher_92/hoot.jpg

 

[veneratio]

actually, 30 pax is break even according to the boys downtown...

 

[Britpilot]

So if RJ's are unprofitable, why contaminate mainlines with them? What pixie dust does a major provide that suddenly makes them profitable?

Do a little research there pal. RJ's have never been profitable. They always have run at a loss.
Pixie dust = pay per departure and sometimes a fuel subsidy from the Host Major. In XJT's case, it's the Capacity Purchase Agreement with Continental Airlines.

 

[Bringupthebird]

So why not dump all RJ's? If they're a drag on earnings, replace them with something that generates a profit. PAL

 

[Britpilot]

So why not dump all RJ's? If they're a drag on earnings, replace them with something that generates a profit. PAL

They are, PAL. They are called 70-90 seat "RJ's" and 70 seat Turbo Props. All of them designed to provide feed to the Major's hub not to provide stand alone profit. You have to spend money to make money. Funny is'nt it?

 

[lowery21]

I wish my boss had talked to you before he did this. Could have saved us all a lot of time and embarrassment.

 

[Britpilot]

I wish my boss had talked to you before he did this. Could have saved us all a lot of time and embarrassment.

Your Boss (and my former boss) is doing alright. Time will tell if the Branded operation will make some cash for you. The addition of the Delta LAX flying will certainly help support the bottom line for a while. I wish you all good luck.

 

[TGT]

They are, PAL. They are called 70-90 seat "RJ's" and 70 seat Turbo Props. All of them designed to provide feed to the Major's hub not to provide stand alone profit. You have to spend money to make money. Funny is'nt it?

So then why are some of the Majors still putting out RFP's for 50-seat flying (Continental, Delta, Midwest) if they lose money?

 

[Britpilot]

So then why are some of the Majors still putting out RFP's for 50-seat flying (Continental, Delta, Midwest) if they lose money?

Because they supply feed to the hub. Lose money on the feed, make money on the connection. The original concept of the RJ was to connect smaller cities to the hub which previously had been flown by turbo props.
Continental has reduced it's total 50 seat fleet and will continue to do so in the future. The 50 seat jet was a product of $28 a barrel oil in the early ninties. Continental ordered 275 (with 100 options, that they have not exercised) of the EMBRAER flavour in the guise of Continental Express. They now operate 239 between XJT and CHQ, that would be a fleet reduction.
Delta needed to replace 10 aircraft operating out of LAX, no net gain.
Midwest, who knows, maybe they cannot afford new mainline aircraft.
Compare the CASM of a 50 seat RJ to a 137 seat 737 over a stage length of 300 miles, you will see that the 737 wins by a large margin. The longer the stage lenth the better the CASM number for the 737. As long as the Majors continue to utilize the hub and spoke system they will need feed. However, on shorter stage lengths the turbo prop will make a comeback now that "The all jet fleet" mantra has worn thin. I see Continental will operate Dash 8 aircraft in CLE, makes sense, cheaper, you see. There is is also a scope issue at Continental that prevents it's feeders from operating larger aircraft and right now there is a wait time for 70-100 seat EMBRAER/Bombardier fleet types. XJT's CPA with CAL guaranteed a profit and included fuel. Horizon operates Q400's on the west coast and Frontier will soon operate a few out of DEN. See a trend here?
As the cost of operating a 50 seat RJ's continues to esculate so will they be parked as contracts come to an end. The turbo prop is poised to make a triumphunt return.

 

[erj-145mech]

CAL doesn't exactly follow that business model though. The CoEx flights from LAX to Mexican distinations, and the seasonal service to MTJ from LAX and DAL contradict that.

 

[Skyward]

What a handle you have on the airline industry. Since a 777 has a lower CASM than a 737 how can airtran make money with them?

How are the hotels at airtran?

 

[Britpilot]

CAL doesn't exactly follow that business model though. The CoEx flights from LAX to Mexican distinations, and the seasonal service to MTJ from LAX and DAL contradict that.

Agreed, however the yeild on Mexico operations is significantly better which offsets the high CASM on the 50 seater. I beleive, though, that a 70/90 seater would be a better equipment in that market if only airframes were available and CAL was'nt tied up with 50 seat leases.

 

[Britpilot]

What a handle you have on the airline industry. Since a 777 has a lower CASM than a 737 how can airtran make money with them?

How are the hotels at airtran?

. Thank you. Just reading the numbers. I take pride in understanding the industry in which I work.
. Purchase cost. The 737's were bought very cheap from Boeing in 2001, less than a 70 seat RJ. A 777 does have a lower CASM than a 737, over a longer stage length. The 777 is a long range aircraft, the 737 is a medium range aircraft. Designed for different markets you see?
. The hotels are fine at AirTran, how are yours? Although we don't spend much time in them as we are fly very productive trips.

 

[cobalt]

Because they supply feed to the hub. Lose money on the feed, make money on the connection. The original concept of the RJ was to connect smaller cities to the hub which previously had been flown by turbo props.

but SO many of CAL connections connect you from one RJ to another, you never even set foot on mainline... so your logic says those are losing money.

 

[Avpilot]

50 seaters operate in the red? They lose money? Did you not see any of the filings from Continental Airlines back in about 2003 or 2004? That was back when CAL was losing money, along with almost everyone else. I don't have exact numbers, but many quarters saw something similar to this: CAL Mainline Net Profit: -$225M CAL Express Net Profit (For CAL): $100M Total CAL Net Profit: -$125M. For a long time we were the only part of the business making money, offsetting some of the losses. In fact, we used to say that we were like a healthy tick on a sick dog. That doesn't jive with what you're saying about 50 seaters losing money. They can make money if deployed correctly. So far, XJT is doing just that.
Tim

 

[jtf]

I think it could work if a lot of things go right. The idea of direct to places with no direct competion is huge- people will pay more for that to skip a connection. There are actually quite a few RJs out there making money without just feeding. American Connection out of STL is a big money maker since they mostly don't compete on any direct routes and don't do much connecting. They gouge the customers whenever possible and make some good coin. Delta's various RJs out of CVG is another situation where money can be made since they are able to keep CVG as one of the most costly cities to fly to or through. As long as fuel prices don't have any huge spikes- like Indy got right out of the starting gate (not the only problem with their model)- they have a hope of at least breaking even. It's not like they are going full blast into putting their entire fleet into it. As long as the size of the fleet stays limited and the destinations stay without other direct competion they could make some money. I wish them luck. They are doing their best to be a descent place to work and stand against the whipsaw. I'm not saying they aren't in a tough spot, but at least they have a descent chance of making things work.

 

[Whiskerbizkit]

50 seaters operate in the red? They lose money? Did you not see any of the filings from Continental Airlines back in about 2003 or 2004? That was back when CAL was losing money, along with almost everyone else. I don't have exact numbers, but many quarters saw something similar to this: CAL Mainline Net Profit: -$225M CAL Express Net Profit (For CAL): $100M Total CAL Net Profit: -$125M. For a long time we were the only part of the business making money, offsetting some of the losses. In fact, we used to say that we were like a healthy tick on a sick dog. That doesn't jive with what you're saying about 50 seaters losing money. They can make money if deployed correctly. So far, XJT is doing just that.
Tim

Thats because Express always makes a profit. As long as the flight goes, full or empty, CAL pays Express a 10%. Express in return repays CAL.