Part 135 to major....

[starchkr]

I'll throw my card in the mix...

hired with Frontier a year ago (yes it's a major, by my and the DOT's standards)...

here's the kicker...absolutely NO recconmendations, and only 135 time, sure it was with Airnet in the lear for a couple of years, but it goes to show anything is possible...oh yeah, and it doesn't hurt i spent 3 years bugging the crap out of them for an interview.

 

[Windsor]

happens all the time, jet pic is the trump card!

Why else would we put up with the crap of flying 135.

Southwest hires guys with straight 135 time. Happens more than you might think.

 

[FR8dognit]

Why else would we put up with the crap of flying 135.

Southwest hires guys with straight 135 time. Happens more than you might think.

90% of my time was pt 135 (Cherry Air)....in the three classes after me 3 more of my buddies from Cherry made the leap (2 were not straight from there; but they worked there at one point). None of us had anything but Part 135 time. I don't know about all the other airlines but it seems as if you have the time you are qualified.

Get the interview, smile, and impress them and I would say you have as good a shot as anyone else with us.

To give you an example...the day I interviewed there were 17 of us....3 got the job. Not one of us were former pt. 121 drivers. (2 Air Force and me)

Get into the left seat of something that burns Jet A...don't waste your time with anything else if you want to go to a major. If all else fails you have the time and you can find a corporate or fractional job. SOMEimp: of those places aren't bad at all and would make for a good life.

 

[cherry20's]

We have had three go to SWA in the last two years? I'd say thats says something about 135 time. I actually think some companys like the time because its real flying. Night, hard IFR, cold and hot weather ops, international flying. But then again there are some that frown at 135 time too.

 

[cherry20's]

Damn, you posted right before I did. That proves something, like I said.

 

[CMI]

Careful, some guys flying 135 turbo prop on here might get their fragile ego's bruised. Then resort to calling you names like "dumblover" or something.

I would say not often. And if a guy is hired from 135 to a major, there were probably a couple things involved. 1. Highly connected, lots of recs or a rec from somebody high up 2. Extremely qualified, lots of time as well as large 135 time. Like a G4/5 or Global Express flying international 3. Both. The job market is tough. Demand for the labor of skilled pilots is relatively low, supply of skilled pilots is high.

Airline will hire from a broad spectrum, Military, prior 121, 135, ect. But one thing has ALWAYS been true. Airlines like to hire airline pilots.

I know, somebody will chime in with "I know a guy that got hire be XYZ and all he ever flew was a kingair."

Ok dumbjetdriver AKA "Regional Sucker". I like my 135 jet job it rocks! No bruised egos here, just you sounding like a dumb a$$. Now go drink a beer, and realize you got owned.
:beer:

 

[dojetdriver]

Ok dumbjetdriver AKA "Regional Sucker". I like my 135 jet job it rocks! No bruised egos here, just you sounding like a dumb a$$ saying only airlines hire airline pilots. Now go drink a beer, and realize you got owned.
:beer:

Um, yeah, sure. Whatever dude. Owned? How old are you? I never said there was anything wrong with a 135 job. Are you sure that you don't have some sensitivity issues?

I never said airlines hire ONLY airline pilots. I just said that they are more of a known quantity than a small/unheard of 135 operator. Not as much as a mil guy is a known quantity, but along the same lines. If you could show me the breakdowns of newhires at "majors" proving that the majority had ONLY 135 time and nothing else, I would admit being at fault. I don't think I'll be admitting anything too soon. Like I said, if you took a snapshot of newhires at FedEx/UPS/DAL/CAL/SW, ect, I'll bet that most are prior 121, supplemental/ACMI, or military.

Go ahead, tell me that the majority of new hires had ONLY 135 experience and only 1 or 2 was 121 or mil. Come on, I'd like to see the data.

Click here, I'm sure that CAL isn't the only one;

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=88528&highlight=CAL+Newhires

Or here;

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=94341

Or for UPS, click here;

http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/showthread.php?t=9841

Or for a rough idea on FedEx, click here;

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=84377&highlight=FedEx+Newhires

And more name calling, did you have anything intelligent to bring to the conversation? Again, Owned?

 

[hydroflyer]

Um, could the fact that airlines hire more 121 pilots be due to the fact that a very large majority of pilots at 121 carriers are trying to move up in or stay in 121? Many pilots who go to 135 do so to avoid the regionals and are actually looking to move onto corporate or fractional. In order to make a fair comparison, you would need to compare the number of people who actually got onto a good 121 operator versus those who tried from both 121 and 135 backgrounds. From what I have seen, I doubt those ratios would be a whole lot different. I'll bet the majority of new hires come from 121, and I'll bet the majority of applications sitting in HR at any major 121 company will be from 121 pilots.

 

[dojetdriver]

Um, could the fact that airlines hire more 121 pilots be due to the fact that a very large majority of pilots at 121 carriers are trying to move up in or stay in 121? Many pilots who go to 135 do so to avoid the regionals and are actually looking to move onto corporate or fractional. In order to make a fair comparison, you would need to compare the number of people who actually got onto a good 121 operator versus those who tried from both 121 and 135 backgrounds. From what I have seen, I doubt those ratios would be a whole lot different. I'll bet the majority of new hires come from 121, and I'll bet the majority of applications sitting in HR at any major 121 company will be from 121 pilots.

Um, good point. But that has nothing to do with the orgiginal poster's question. For the 100th time. I NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT WHO WAS BETTER! If a 135 only guy wants to go corporate or fractional, great. Get the job you want and be happy. That has nothing to do with the issue of a guy with 135 experince only trying to get on at a 'major".

Make sense?

 

[starchkr]

Hydroflyer is correct in saying that those who go to the 135 operators wish to avoid the regionals(in a lot of cases)...I know i did, why should i fly for free(practically) when a company will actually pay me well to build my time to move onto a major carrier...i never understood the whole "i want to fly for a regional thing"...oh well, for some i guess they believe that is the only way to move up in life. To each there own..

Also, i still believe 135 pilots are superior to those in the current 121 scene. Skills deteriorate when you come to fly these computers we operate now-a-days...again though, who am i, i am just a past 135 guy now flying 121...what do i know right. So there is my argument for you guys, fire away.

 

[Captain Morgan]

True statement; I flew Barons and C310s on the 135 freight scene and when I made the jump to a regional, there was no comparison. While flying 121 was fun, my skills were reduced to rubble after 6 months behind the yoke of an ERJ. Now I'm not saying that 121 guys are not good pilots. They are just not the best that they could be, in my humble opinion.

 

[Windsor]

Also, i still believe 135 pilots are superior to those in the current 121 scene. Skills deteriorate when you come to fly these computers we operate now-a-days...again though, who am i, i am just a past 135 guy now flying 121...what do i know right. So there is my argument for you guys, fire away.

I'm not going to get into the "who is better than who" fight, but I will say this. Running boxes and checks part 135 at night in old fashioned steam guage aircraft is a lot better for the sitck and rudder skills than pressing buttons on an autopilot. I enjoy this type of flying now because its going to be the last time I get to hand fly most of the flight. 121 lets "otto" do a majority of the work.

 

[hydroflyer]

Um, good point. But that has nothing to do with the orgiginal poster's question. For the 100th time. I NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT WHO WAS BETTER! If a 135 only guy wants to go corporate or fractional, great. Get the job you want and be happy. That has nothing to do with the issue of a guy with 135 experince only trying to get on at a 'major".

Make sense?

I didn't refer to one being better then the other either. In response to the "original" question, 135 guys are probably hired on at a major just as often when you consider the percentage of 135 applicants in the resume stack versus other backgrounds. With fewer 135 guys applying comparatively, then there will be fewer brought to interviews and fewer in classes. Your chances of making a major from 135 are based on meeting the published minimums and how hard you work for it.

 

[Freight Dawg]

dojetdriver...We freight dawgs tend to stick together...were like the mafia of aviation. Disrespect one we all take a shot at ya. I definately was a much better pilot flying 135 on demand cargo in a old beat up Lear Jet. We would fly all night after being up all day, go to unfamliar airports in forgien countries and shoot approaches to mins all on steam gauges. I don't know how many times I went into Mexico, or some other Central America Country shooting an approach to an airport I had never been...by the way usually had a good twenty minutes to analyze the approach an situation. Now flying "121" my hand is held like a baby, dispatchers do all of the work, we never fly to an airport that hasn't been evaluated by check airman, and flown into by chk airman. I will never be as proficent as a I was flying the Lear,....but Brown pays better

 

[johnny taliban]

Okay, can't resist this one. The reason these guys are attacking you dojet is because of the "airlines hire airline pilots" statement. I believe I speak for everyone when I say that while your statement may be technically true, it also sounds like something I would read on some kit darby propaganda rag. But don't feel bad dojet because it is also true that airlines hire COMMUTER PILOTS like you all the time as well.

 

[dojetdriver]

Okay, can't resist this one. The reason these guys are attacking you dojet is because of the "airlines hire airline pilots" statement. I believe I speak for everyone when I say that while your statement may be technically true, it also sounds like something I would read on some kit darby propaganda rag. But don't feel bad dojet because it is also true that airlines hire COMMUTER PILOTS like you all the time as well.

If you click on any of the link, I posted, I'm not the first to say it. Go back and respond to the guys the links if you don't like it. If somebody said that airlines like to hire military pilots and it was said by a mil pilot, would you flame his as well?

Funny, I go to Mexico just about every week. Sometimes I go 2 or 3 times a week. Flying DME Arc approaches in non-radar at nightime at my 121 job. Does that make me less of an aviatior than the 135 guy that goes to the same airports night afer night after night after night? Especially if he is flying in some place like Socal or Florida?

You guys are too funny.

 

[CMI]

If you click on any of the link, I posted, I'm not the first to say it. Go back and respond to the guys the links if you don't like it. If somebody said that airlines like to hire military pilots and it was said by a mil pilot, would you flame his as well?

Funny, I go to Mexico just about every week. Sometimes I go 2 or 3 times a week. Flying DME Arc approaches in non-radar at nightime at my 121 job. Does that make me less of an aviatior than the 135 guy that goes to the same airports night afer night after night after night? Especially if he is flying in some place like Socal or Florida?

You guys are too funny.

Yes you are a pu$$y. Try flying on-demand freight, you would actually deserve the hair on your gonads. Try 20-min callout wheels up in an hour of being called, and having to fly to anywhere in North, Central, or South America on a moments notice. No dispatcher to do your flight planning or fuel planning. No jet bridge to walk down into your aircraft, no flight attendant to get you something to drink. We Fr8 dogs go to airports in Mexico US airlines do not go to. You might be better keeping your yap shut unless you know what it is like to fly freight son!

 

[Hawkster54]

Yea but who gets more pu$$y? "Major" airline pilots, Commuter pilots, or freight dogs? That's the real question.

 

[starchkr]

DOjet...I completely was behind you on the first posts you made, because i saw what you "meant" by them, althought maybe not the correct way to say it, but i knew what ya meant. Now as far as your last post with flying into Mexico with the arc's and all...well, you need to compare apples to apples, and not apples to oranges. Those 135 guys fly into the same Mexico airports you do, plus a few others, and do it all by hand with nothing even close to the instrumentation you have (computer wise). I could by those standards say the same about me flying to mexico versus them flying to CA or FL, but i know that my flying computer handles EVERYTHING on ANY approach including arc's, intercepting and altitude constraints, and will meet them without a problem and all HANDS OFF, now you can NEVER say that about the 135 guys. Now put yourself into some of those airports here in the US that the 135 guys "fly into night after night after night" and see if you could do the same things they do by hand with your computers...of course you could, but now NEVER use those computers and see how well you do hand flying EVERYTHING...are you just as good without them by hand? I would doubt it, but remember, i am not attacking you, because i now fly 121 and could NEVER do most of the things that i used to do in 135 period.

Ok, so what was the original thread...oh yeah, you CAN go 135 directly to the majors, no problem.

 

[dickburns]

I think my coworker forgot to mention that the freighter falcons he and I fly have 2 glass tubes on each side, an fms, and a flight director with a decent autopilot, ooops.