AirTran or NetJets?

[BengalsFan]

AirTran folks

I have a buddy at AirTran who is trying to convince me to come to AirTran. I currently have the goal of going to NetJets. Does anyone out there have an arguement on why AirTrain is better?

It appears to me that the pay is about the same, throughout a career, and I would assume I would work more days at AirTran that the 14 a month I would work at NetJets.

Just looking for input.

Thanks

 

[Phaedrus]

Sounds like its whatever fits you best.

 

[USARET]

The time listed in your profile doesn't meet the min of 2500 total time required for AirTran, and with just the min requirements I don't think you would be very competitive right now. Maybe NetJets would be a better option for you.

 

[AppBrookie]

I spent 19.5 months at NetJets(X Driver) after hitting the street from a major. I have now been at AirTran 2.5 years(single digit #'s from holding left seat).....Absolutley no regrets!!!!!!! I know they got a very well deserved improved contract, but that still would of not kept me there. I'm a 121 guy, who likes to know what I doing a few weeks out and I like the 3/4 on, 3/4 off lifestyle, 7 Full days is a long time away from the little ones!

 

[jimcav]

I have a lot of buds at NJ and a few are the same seniority as I am at AT. They are still on the Citationv making a lot less than me and working more. However Im on 7th yr pay and fairly senior on the 737. Another friend started on the X a year ago and is still looking at a few yrs to upgrade on the V. AT upgrade apprx 2.5 yrs right now. Tough call because NJ is a good place to be but if you dont fly the BBJ you probably wont do quite as well as you would at AT. Real senior guys at NJ may beg to differ.

 

[XRMEFLYER]

The time listed in your profile doesn't meet the min of 2500 total time required for AirTran, and with just the min requirements I don't think you would be very competitive right now. Maybe NetJets would be a better option for you.

Dude, that screen name is taken!

 

[Lake Alice]

Airtran.

Switching jobs is never easy but I will give you my perspective. Going to Airtran will give you a lot of flexibility. You will know when and where you are going. That is huge. You can trade or drop trips and bid a schedule. This is also huge.
At NJA you will probably get a Sunday start which means you will go to work on Sunday and come home Saturday. It will be quite some time before you could ever have a weekday start and then you still will NEVER have the opportunity to have weekends off.

You could commute if you dont live in ATL and NJA could make you move. NJA will fly you to/from your home base which is nice but having the potential for weekends off is better for me.

At NJA you will get good benefits, a lot of free food and hotel benefits. Airtran will give you flexibility and QOL. 7 days on the road is a long time as well.

I am pretty sure you will make a lot more money in the long run at Airtran as well.

Ultimately for me it boiled down to QOL. Having the flexibility to work certain days and not others was huge. Also, not having to shlep some owners bags around was a plus as well.

Good luck with your descision.

 

[BengalsFan]

Thanks for the replies all. Its tough, and seniority is everything...

Is there much of a turnover rate at AirTran? With guys going to Southwest, UPS, FEDEX... looking for more money?

Also, a few of you have mentioned that I would work less at AirTran. How many 3-4 day trips would one have every month... ie How many days do you work in a month?

 

[Lake Alice]

One other thing. Seniority is everything at an airline. At NJA is counts for very little. For example, say your 7on/7off line falls with your 7 days off over X-mas. If someone else bids into your airplane and they are senior to you, you cannot be bumped off your line. In short, if you bid it and get it you own it. Good or bad thats the way it works.
So if you get stuck in an Ultra and have X-mas off and you want to bid a different plane you may not get the same holidays or vacation days.
Obviously at an airline things are more flexible. Depends on what you are looking for.

 

[be-400xpdriver]

I have a lot of buds at NJ and a few are the same seniority as I am at AT. They are still on the Citationv making a lot less than me and working more. However Im on 7th yr pay

If your buddies have been at netjets for 7 years than they can hold any aircraft they want, ultra, encore, 400xp, excel, 800xp, X, g200, giv, f2000, but maybe not the f2easy and the bbj.

 

[Steeler Fan]

Tough decision. Lots of good info from others to help you make the decision that works best for you. One thing I will say is that I hope your Bengals get crushed this weekend (even though I think Marvin Lewis is a great coach).

 

[johnsonrod]

I am tired of 121. It's like Groundhog Day. The same destinations over and over again. While I am a fan of both the 717 and the 73G, I personally would want the ability to fly more advanced aircraft like the Sovereign and Falcon 2000Easy through the end of my career - that's my opinion and probably not shared by others. Some people couldn't care less.

At the end of the day, I'd rather fly Tiger Woods or a movie star in a Citation X from Santa Monica to Jackson Hole on a 7/7 schedule than fly Floyd and Cletus from ATL to Gulfport or Pensacola. Sure, not every Netjets flight would be a glammor flight and the Citation X crews, for example, are worked very, very hard from what I hear, but that would still be an improvement over the monotony of 121 flying in my mind. I am sure ex-Netjets guys will beg to differ. By the way, I wouldn't mind getting tipped for throwing bags every once and awhile either - I need the exercise.

That's just my opinion and I haven't made the change yet - but I am seriously looking at it... Regardless, both Air Tran and Netjets would make fine choices depending on your own preferences. Horses for courses...

 

[kansas]

Sure, pay is an obvious issue here, but...

Of course in this business, like many others in life, start with who you know, and work from that. If you don't know anyone at NJ, then your chances of getting on there are most likely far slimmer than having a shot at AirTran.

I think this one really comes down to the type of environment you want to work in...because they're different as night and day in this case. And of course, the usual schedule and location issues.

 

[-9Capt]

At the end of the day, I'd rather fly Tiger Woods or a movie star in a Citation X from Santa Monica to Jackson Hole on a 7/7 schedule than fly Floyd and Cletus from ATL to Gulfport or Pensacola. ...

Don't talk that way about our Chief Pilot!!

 

[a10hogplt]

if you like cleaning the lav, stocking the airplane, loading all the damn bags, getting the coffee, ice, and newspapers, and sitting endlessly in fbo's go to net jets...i spent a year in the fractionals and it sucked....bad. i'd go to air tran anyday over any fractional.

 

[Lowrider717]

Also, a few of you have mentioned that I would work less at AirTran. How many 3-4 day trips would one have every month... ie How many days do you work in a month?

Line holders average 15 days off a month, mostly 4 day trips, lately seems like a mix of 3 and 4 day trips, some 2 day back to backs.

 

[Whine Lover]

Bengals,

Let me add this on top of the PM I sent you...

Personally, I would go with an airline job rather than a fractional for all the reasons mentioned above.

Schlepping bags, fetching coffee, hanging around FBO's, and never knowing when and where you are going would drive me nuts.

But then again I'm an Anal-Retentive, Obsessive-Compulsive, Control Freak.

I also like to plan my Beer drinking accordingly...Thats tough to do when you don't know when you're flying.

YKW

 

[On Your Six]

Bengals,

Let me add this on top of the PM I sent you...

Personally, I would go with an airline job rather than a fractional for all the reasons mentioned above.

Schlepping bags, fetching coffee, hanging around FBO's, and never knowing when and where you are going would drive me nuts.

But then again I'm an Anal-Retentive, Obsessive-Compulsive, Control Freak.

I also like to plan my Beer drinking accordingly...Thats tough to do when you don't know when you're flying.

YKW

I would go with Netjets. I have done major airline flying and I far prefer the corporate/fractional alternative. I enjoy the varied destinations and the interaction with my passengers - I had neither in the airline world. I know a few Jet Blue pilots who were former Netjets drivers and they regret moving over to the 121 side for the above reasons.

I have heard that the QOL and pay at Netjets have improved markedly given the new contract - I think many of the former Netjets drivers who have responded to this post were probably there during the difficult pre-new contract period where it got a bit ugly and many people left... I have heard life is much better there now than before.

Both are good choices but I would go to Netjets in the end.

 

[Heavy Set]

Netjets. The same old routine would drive me nuts. If you want to just enter the aircraft and immediately turn left and close the door, go to AirTran. I'd rather sit at a comfy FBO in Florida or Eagle than sit in that congo line several times every day at ATL. Flying in and out of that airport every day would be a big downer. That's my $0.02.

 

[Caveman]

Personally, I like the 121 world. I don't buy the same old destinations argument that the frax guys use to disparage airline flying. At my last airline we had over 100 destinations. It takes a while to get bored with that many places to go, especially since you can bid to go to the places you haven't been to yet. Granted, it may not be Aspen or St. Croix, but for every time a frax guy goes to those places they also go to Peoria, Gallup and Bemidji.

I'm not knocking the frax. There are many things about the frax world I find appealing. Some exotic destinations for one. Interesting pax for another. When I weigh the pluses and minuses of 121 vs frax the airline business fits me better, but I'm positive I would enjoy working at NetJets too. If NetJets would lose the 5 domicile thing it would sway my decision heavily. Their new contract looks pretty good and although I'm not crazy about the 7/7 schedule I could probably live with it.

 

[skiandsurf]

I have been at NJs for almost a year now. Would not go back to airlines. They 2 worst things about the NJ job is.....airlining and taxi cabs.

If you like to drive to the airport 4 times a month....go airline.
if you like going thru security lines .....go airline.
like McDonalds....airlines.
like schedules.....airlines
like reserve....airlines.
like bad management....airlines.

The pay at NJs, isnt that bad. Benefits are much better (free medical insurance). The customers (owners) are very nice. The variety is great.

I do miss the travel benefits, but I dont miss the crowded terminals.

 

[skiandsurf]

Airtran.

At NJA you will probably get a Sunday start which means you will go to work on Sunday and come home Saturday. It will be quite some time before you could ever have a weekday start and then you still will NEVER have the opportunity to have weekends off.


Also, not having to shlep some owners bags around was a plus as well.

Good luck with your descision.

I have had Wed starts right out of training. And I didnt even bid it, was by default. Every other weekend, I have a 7 day weekend.


As far as "shleping" bags. At most you will only have 3 passenger flights in one day. Usually light on the bags. Not that big of deal. Granted there are those flights that have a full load with tons of bags, oh well. I would rather throw 4 or 5 bags, rather than wait for an hour for the rampers.

 

[Lake Alice]

I'd say you got lucky on the wed starts and congrats. You can't be bumped. As for 3 legs per day I don't know what fleet your in unless its the 2000. EVERYONE humps it at NJA except for the falcons.

 

[Guppiedriver]

skiandsurf,

Most of the people here responded to BengalsFan with well though out, sincere responses. You on the other hand can't resist a smart arse, highly exaggerated, and obviously biased post that doesn't help anyone. Some of your points are valid and I am glad that you are happy at NJ's, but shut the he!! up if your not going to post something useful.

 

[skiandsurf]

skiandsurf,

Most of the people here responded to BengalsFan with well though out, sincere responses. You on the other hand can't resist a smart arse, highly exaggerated, and obviously biased post that doesn't help anyone. Some of your points are valid and I am glad that you are happy at NJ's, but shut the he!! up if your not going to post something useful.

Not sure what you mean. I only try to post factual points. They might be slightly biased, but factual none the less.

On the X.

This trip....day 1....1 transcon flight w/5 pax and a repo....6 hrs overtime.
Day 2.....2 pax flights and a repo....3 people total....5 bags....wow...tough. .2.5 hrs overtime.
Day 3.....hotel till 2pm. hang at FBO on the computer and nice Crew lounge with recliners......better then any terminal.

Sorry, just the facts.

 

[Guppiedriver]

I have been at NJs for almost a year now. Would not go back to airlines. They 2 worst things about the NJ job is.....airlining and taxi cabs.

If you like to drive to the airport 4 times a month....go airline.
if you like going thru security lines .....go airline.
like McDonalds....airlines.
like schedules.....airlines
like reserve....airlines.
like bad management....airlines.

The pay at NJs, isnt that bad. Benefits are much better (free medical insurance). The customers (owners) are very nice. The variety is great.

I do miss the travel benefits, but I dont miss the crowded terminals.

This is the post I was referring to, along with the other NJ vs. Airline post about a month ago.

You go through security at least twice a week.
I still don't get the McDonald's crack.
Just because you were on perpetual reserve at Fly I and Mesa, doesn't mean it's the norm for airlines.
Explain to me how all airlines have bad management and NJ management is good. You didn't drink that Kool-Aide they were passing out, did you?
Free medical is good, but are you sure all of your combined benefits are better than mine?
Come on, nice passengers? Hardly a reason to jump ship to the frac's. Not dealing with passengers at all is better than nice passengers.
Don't forget, you still go to those crowded terminals and ride in the back of that crowded airliner at least twice a week.

 

[Lake Alice]

Lets not get into a pissing contest.

Comparing NJA to AirTran is, to borrow an old phrase, comparing apples to oranges.

Saying that one is exciting while the other is routine or comparing flexibility to consistency is not a fair comparison.

Neither one is better they are simply truly different. You also have to look at who is giving you the information on the particular company. Is a 121 guy telling you the frax are bad because he/she did corporate once in their life. Is a frax guy/gal telling you the 121 world sucks because they came from a bottom feading regional or were furloughed? I had airline guys at NJA telling me to get the hell out and go get a flying job instead of the "everything else" NJA job. I also had 121 guys say they wouldnt go back if they had the chance.
From my experience the 121 guys I knew who were furloughed or had retired said go. The lifestyle was better and for me it has been that way.

Which ever way you choose just make the descision and don't look back. Second guessing your descision will only frustrate you more.

 

[Quimby]

Go with what's gonna make you happy. There's plenty of pro's & cons to both companies. Whatever you do, try to avoid commuting. QOL is so much better.

And this stuff about taxi lines & such.....don't let that sway you. I've waited as long or longer at HPN or TEB with crap weather on a Friday afternoon than at some of the major 121 fields. It's all part of the job, whether you're in a Super-Flycorpwhizjet, or a McAirBoeingpeopletube.imp:

my .02

 

[skiandsurf]

I will admit that not everyone likes the fractional flying. It is a different type of flying. For me, it is right up my alley. But then again I was happy at my previous airline job as well.

For me, I explain it like this.....how many of you used to go out building flight time by renting a plane and flying to off the wall places with a friend or two, just to build time. If you did that, was it a good time. I know I did that a few times and had a blast going to places I never heard of, just for somewhere to go. Well that is what this flying is like. One day you are in an uncontolled airport in BFE. Later that day you are flying a transcon to SFO. Then maybe off to Hawaii.

I did the IAD-BUF-IAD-ROC-IAD-BUF for too many years. This is a nice change.

But it may not be for you or the next guy.

 

[Hawker800]

I don't know your age, but AirTran age 60 get fired by the Federal Govt. At Netjets keep on flying.