DoinTime said:
The reactivation of this LOA was discussed a few years ago and ALL parties (even Wychor) agreed that it did not apply to the situation at hand. In fact like circumstances had been discussed a couple years earlier then that when XJ moved Avro's into MEM and further decimated our Saab and Jetstream fleets.
The closest we have come to a situation that fit the wording and intent of the LOA 21 was when 9E handed over the 11 B model Saabs about four years ago. 9E did not pursue activation of this LOA for obvious reasons.
Its not like this was a real sweetheart of a deal anyway. A limited number of captains got a 3:1 date of hire integration (2:1 if they were qualified in the equipment they were being transferred into) and FO's got a staple job.
Not true on the FOs, they were not stapled. As I said they came in with better seniority than some pilots who were already on property. Over all, it was a lot better than a preferred interview.
Those FOs, who didn't become Mesaba employees until Nov. '97, had August 1, 1997 seniority dates. That 'small' difference right now could mean holding onto an Avro left seat.
If the situation arises where 9E gets delivery of a larger class of aircraft in the future and the Avro's are out of service I do believe we may have something that applies to the intent of the LOA.
If you believe it to be true that 9E has no obligation to XJ under the terms of this LOA why are you so bent out of shape about it? Or is this just another opportunity to bash 9E pilots, an activity you seem to relish so much. What was that you were saying about brand unity?
I am not really bent out of shape about it, and I hardly relish or enjoy bashing 9E pilots. I count many friends on the 9E list.
What I have trouble stomaching is the lack of desire on the parts of some 9E pilots to help out without being forced to do so.
And before I go any further, I will acknowledge that the majority of current 9E pilots probably have no idea what this is all about, and I harbor no ill will towards any of the pilots at 9E.
My frustration comes from missed opportunities, from failing to make a change in the way this industry works, from going to battle for a higher cause and finding out that the ones you were fighting with couldn't care less about the cause.
When the Mesaba pilots, the rank and file, voted to approve the LOA they made an awesome gesture. They were setting the stage to show management what band loyalty was going to look like, and that when we worked together we could counter the NWA whipsaw.
When the pendulum swung the other way, and it was time for someone other then the Mesaba pilots to do something altruistic, it didn't happen.
I find it frustrating, and sad, that those 9E pilots who responded to both this thread and the previous discussion on the subject fail to see the possibilities, the intent. Instead I continue to see the line about not meeting the triggers.
As you suggest, "under the terms of the LOA" there is no obligation yet, and I agree, currently there is no legal obligation. But what about a moral obligation? What about doing something that benefits the greater good of all red-tail pilots?
Our profession is under attack from management, and from internal division. If we only ever act on what is in the best interest to our own groups, we will fail and this downward spiral will continue, to the delight of union-busting lawyers and boardrooms. Saving this thing we love, keeping it a viable, respected occupation will take some sacrifice. If no one is willing to make those moves, to show management that we will look out for each other in the face of their shell-games, we will fail.
Mesaba management was the driving force behind getting this LOA pushed through. They needed trained pilots....fast. Both MEC's were lukewarm to the proposition.
I wasn't around for the genesis of the LOA, so I cannot fully speak to Management being behind it. But what I do know is that even with the LOA Mesaba had to wet-lease 9E crews and planes to cover the flying. This is the origin of the August 1, 1997 seniority date for the FOs who came over, as this was the day the wet-lease started. Given that Mesaba had to pay for a wet-lease arrangement anyway and had to send all the pilots through training regardless of their experience from 9E, I doubt this LOA saved Mesaba any money. In fact I would venture that it costed Mesaba more to have the LOA (the captains who came over all ended up higher up on the list than the guys who were upgrading at the time-more $).
But regardless of whose idea it was, it took approval from the rank-and-file Mesaba pilots to make it happen, and they voted to take that first step.
