type rating with atp

[wannab0133]

i am going to get my atp soon, i have taken the written and all i need to get is some more x-c to satisfy the 500 hour requirement. Would it be a bad idea to pay for a lear or citation type rating and skip all the money i'd be paying for dual instruction in a duchess in order to get my type rating and my atp in one fail swoop. No, i do not have time in either a lear or citation and i dont expect to in the very near future, but is it worth it to get the type now when it can get me the atp? I of course would spend more for the type, but would employers care at all b/c there is no significant time in type?

 

[JetPilot500]

This was something I considered as well many years ago, but chose not to do it.

There is always the time in type issue. But, having the rating can't hurt. Small operators or Part 135 operators might like to see this if they operate an aircraft you are typed in.

I chose not to do it because I was so current in the Duchess already from instructing in it, that I didn't need any additional training before the checkride. So I just had to pay for the rental and the examiner fee for the checkride. It was the least expensive Certificate I ever got!

A Citation is a very easy jet to fly. Only 2 levers to deal with, very simple systems, and landing speeds of 100 knots. It would be a relatively easy transition, at least if you are instrument current already. There are also a LOT of Citations out there that a CE-500 type rating would allow you to fly. Not that you would be allowed to just go out there and fly one, but you would at least be certified to do so. The models included in the CE-500 Type Rating include:

Citation 500
Citation I
Citation II
Citation SII
Citation Bravo
Citation V
Citation Ultra
Citation Ultra Encore

I wouldn't recommend doing it in a Lear. They are more difficult to fly and it would be harder to get through a quickie course in my opinion.

If the cost isn't an issue, I would say that it couldn't hurt. If you are on a tight budget, then forget about it! Also, it would give you some new experience. Just make sure you are real instrument proficient before you do the course. Some time in a Frasca ahead of time will be a lot cheaper than extra time in the Citation!

Good Luck,
JetPilot500

 

[Rick1128]

It wouldn't hurt to get a type along with your ATP. It is the same checkride. See the ATP/Type rating PTS. Stay away from the Lear for this. It is one of the more difficult aircraft to do this in. Unless you have significant flight time and time in jets and/or aircraft more difficult to fly that the Lear, you are just spinning your wheels. The Citation is like flying a CE400 series aircraft straight forward. A little easier in that you only have two engine controls, instead of 6.

As for time in type, you are not going to fly PIC until the insurance company accepts you, which normally means sim based training. But there are operators that could use you as a contract FO. It also tells prospective employers that you are trainable. A quickie course is not very easy. You have to work hard and study well in advance to make it work.

Its just another checkmark on the plus side of the column. In my case, many years ago I got my Turbojet FE. I have never used it, but it was that extra checkmark that got me hired for three jobs after that.

 

[NJA Capt]

Keep in mind, if a person does not have any time in type, or a previous type rating, a limitation will be placed on the certificate. This limitation PROHIBITS acting as PIC until 25 hours of "supervised operating experience" have been accomplished.

Also, many insurance companies will only recognized training from somewhere like Flight Safety or Simcom.

 

[Rick1128]

The limitation on your type would only apply if you did your type in the sim and you didn't meet the full requirements of the FARs. If you did your type in the aircraft, this limitation would not apply. That is why many people will do their initial type in the aircraft then go to FSI or Simuflite and do a recurrent.

 

[HMR]

Can you do an ATP ride concurrently with a type ride in the sim at FSI?

 

[BeckyAnne]

Yes you can,

I just did my ATP and Lear 60 type consecutively at FSI in Tucson and I found it to be easier than I had expected. The curriculum was well laid out and the instructors were top notch which made for a relatively trouble free course.

I had just less than 40 hours in the 60 prior to my arrival at FSI and about 30 hours in both the 31 and 35.

It was my first time at FSI and my first full motion sim it was quite exciting. I had a good sim buddy and we study grouped every night.

I am now sold on this avenue for the ATP. Had I had the money and know what I know now I would have gone the ATP + type rating route most likely the CE-500 way back when.

Becky