TurboProp PIC or 170 SIC?

[Gigiddy Goo]

I'm trying to weigh my options here. I will be upgrading to captain on a turbo prop soon and got a call to interview for a 170 job. Probably looking at 3 years to upgrzde in the 170. Anybody have the same decision to make before? What did you do? Would you do the same again?

 

[LJDRVR]

I would get the turbine PIC. If your goal is to be able to put food on the table with your piloting qualifications, get the command experience.

 

[CoolSidePillow]

I turned down 3 interviews with 3 of the better liked regionals because I was making Captain. I dont think there is a right or wrong path. For me I wanted to be PIC and wanted and needed to make more money sooner as opposed to later. In the end. It is a job and it has to be treated as such. It is great to enjoy what you do but how shiny and new the plane is really shouldnt be the deciding factor. My opinion is try to keep moving up and avoid moving sideways. The industry will make you move backwards but you cant predict or control that as much as you can making sideways moves. Just my humble opinion.

 

[Arrow11]

What kind of turboprop, King Air 350? PC-12? Piper Meridian? Are you 91, 135 or 121? I'd weigh your decision based on your age and career expectations, if you're young and can hang out at a regional until you upgrade, I'd probably go that route. If you're older, married, kids etc. PIC in a TP might give you a better QOL, pay etc. sooner.

 

[CFIse]

If they're both the same "quality of time" - e.g. 121, I'd take the PIC time.

If they're different (say PIC Part 135 King Air against Part 121 in the 170) that's a tougher question.

 

[Ski-N-Fly]

If it's 121 turbine PIC, take the upgrade.

 

[CJCCapt]

Agreed. If it's part 121 scheduled turbine PIC - take it, without question.

 

[JessMan]

Here's one for you. Does anyone think it matters whether you're flying 121 domestic/flag or 121 supplemental? Or does it not make a difference to an interviewer since the only difference appears to be routes and flight & rest limitations?

 

[BenderGonzales]

Here's one for you. Is that "three year upgrade" on the 170 still going to BE a 3-year upgrade, 3 years from now?

Things change too quickly in this industry to take a gamble like that just because you have a minor case of shiny-jet-syndrome.

A burp in the economy (or the fortunes of that carrier) and you could find yourself an f/o for 6 or 7 years plus -- or worse, furloughed.

Stay where you're at and leave the 170 to the kids who have something to prove.

 

[Avi8tor2000]

You think there is going to be a 3 year upgrade in three years???! Don't do it! Take the PIC time! Republic, Shuttle, CHQ is in for a BIG downfall... And this is from someone who is presently there....

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

Cash is King, PIC is King.

 

[Chronic Jetlag]

Take the PIC upgrade, never turn down a captain upgrade

 

[saviboy]

suppose this guy takes the upgrade.now he will meet one of the major airlines requirements. some airlines might want jet time. he could then work at a regional to get the jet/glass time on top of the 1000 turbine pic 121 he already has.
will a regional hire a guy lke that? would they take the risk of losing him as son as he gets around 1000 jet/glass?

 

[rspilot]

If it is 135 Single pilot than Id go to the airline.......I am now taking a FO RJ job after 2000 hours PIC Turbine because that is all that there is available. Guys that jumped into an airline when I took the turbine time are now Captains making much more. I now have to take a big pay cut for an opportunity to advance my career. It seems like the regionals are the only way to advance unless you wanna fly corporate and this is no picnic either. Corporate, the top pay isnt great and you can sit at an fbo for eight hours waiting for customers that were supposed to show up six hours ago. I'd go for the regional job.

Good Luck......it'll alll work out whatever you decide.

 

[spiffomatic]

suppose this guy takes the upgrade.now he will meet one of the major airlines requirements. some airlines might want jet time. he could then work at a regional to get the jet/glass time on top of the 1000 turbine pic 121 he already has.
will a regional hire a guy lke that? would they take the risk of losing him as son as he gets around 1000 jet/glass?

at least currently, many of the regionals seem to be happy to add more experienced pilots to the payroll - I've seen pilots with high 135 PIC (single pilot) time happily picked up by Republic and others - many of the pilots are doing this exactly for the 121 experience that is helpful to eventually land a spot in the majors - but... keep in mind there aren't many hiring right now anyways so there's not a great risk of them leaving quickly.

 

[avrodriver]

Guys that jumped into an airline when I took the turbine time are now Captains making much more. I now have to take a big pay cut for an opportunity to advance my career.

Those guys happened to get hired at the right time. I can't name one regional at the present time that looks like it has a smooth road ahead of them in terms of growth that will give a new hire any type of fast track better than 3-4 years. After Delta, Northwest, and CAL get there sh*t sorted out things may look a little clearer...so while your waiting. Take that upgrade.

 

[Popeye0537]

You think there is going to be a 3 year upgrade in three years???! Don't do it! Take the PIC time! Republic, Shuttle, CHQ is in for a BIG downfall... And this is from someone who is presently there....

HuH?? What crack pipe you smokin? What BIG downfall are we in for...the loss of Delta as a code share.....

Anyway, you gotta look at QOL and where you want to be in 5 yrs. Not too many turboprop guys getting hired at the majors/Cargo with all the qualified jet time guys out there comming out of the regionals/military. In time (2-3yrs) your gonna make more $$ on the jet(first year will suck)

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I would get the turbine PIC. If your goal is to be able to put food on the table with your piloting qualifications, get the command experience.

That way you will be competetive when the majors start hiring in a year or two.

:laugh:

 

[Thedude]

I would say get your 1000hrs of PIC turbine then get out. T'prop PIC aint worth doodle squat anymore

 

[30West]

Not too many turboprop guys getting hired at the majors/Cargo with all the qualified jet time guys out there comming out of the regionals/military.

Hmmmm, really? What is your source? Guess someone forgot to tell Air Tran, Jet Blue, Southwest, Gemini Air Cargo, North American, Continental and Kalitta.
That list represents 22 former Colgan pilots, or approximately 12% of the pilot group at the time, with no previous jet experience, including myself. But we all did have plenty of 121 PIC experience. Doesn't matter what you're driving. In fact, glass RJ time wouldn't have done anything to prepare me for the type of flying I'm doing now on the DC-10.

 

[Popeye0537]

Hmmmm, really? What is your source? Guess someone forgot to tell Air Tran, Jet Blue, Southwest, Gemini Air Cargo, North American, Continental and Kalitta.
That list represents 22 former Colgan pilots, or approximately 12% of the pilot group at the time, with no previous jet experience, including myself. But we all did have plenty of 121 PIC experience. Doesn't matter what you're driving. In fact, glass RJ time wouldn't have done anything to prepare me for the type of flying I'm doing now on the DC-10.

Look at the latest classes in the past year.....and you will find your answer.

 

[capt. megadeth]

I would say get your 1000hrs of PIC turbine then get out. T'prop PIC aint worth doodle squat anymore

That's bull$hit. PIC is PIC, TP or TJ

 

[c-wood75]

I would not go to Republic. at all!

my buddy has been there about a year now is still holding a crappy reserve schedule and not going anywhere soon, probably another 6 months of reserve for him, 11 days off a month goes quick when you are commuting, he hates it. saab guys took all growth at company and capts could care less about what the FO's have been through. also cpts are now making this a carreer destination as sad as that is.. 5 to 6 year upgrade...... without growth

stay where you are or go corporate like me, i dont miss the airlines...

 

[capt. megadeth]

Not too many turboprop guys getting hired at the majors/Cargo with all the qualified jet time guys out there comming out of the regionals/military.

Reaaaaaaly????? Ya don't say?????

Everyone I know that has gotten hired/interviewed recently at CAL, UPS, Fedex, SWA, Airtran and JetBlue all got their 1000+ PIC hours in a turboprop. You are dead wrong.

 

[Popeye0537]

Reaaaaaaly????? Ya don't say?????

Everyone I know that has gotten hired/interviewed recently at CAL, UPS, Fedex, SWA, Airtran and JetBlue all got their 1000+ PIC hours in a turboprop. You are dead wrong.

Haha ha, lay off the acid my friend. Are you still bitter because MetallicA booted you out of the band?

 

[surfnfly]

PIC is KING. Does not matter TP or TJ. I have many many friends at all the majors pax and cargo that got on with no jet time. Having the 1000 pic that many require let's them know that you can be in command and not screw things up. I on the other hand have seen many of my fellow furloughees not able to even get an interview because they can't check off the 1000 pic requirement even though they have 1000's of hours jet time (not RJ's either)

 

[BlackPilot628]

I would not go to Republic. at all!

my buddy has been there about a year now is still holding a crappy reserve schedule and not going anywhere soon, probably another 6 months of reserve for him, 11 days off a month goes quick when you are commuting, he hates it. saab guys took all growth at company and capts could care less about what the FO's have been through. also cpts are now making this a carreer destination as sad as that is.. 5 to 6 year upgrade...... without growth

stay where you are or go corporate like me, i dont miss the airlines...

If your buddy has been there for 1 year and is still on reserve something is wrong. He's either telling you a lie, he likes bidding a senior base, or he's bidding RSV. I have been here for almost 1 year now and I only sat Reserve 1 month. The only guys from my class that are sitting RSV are the FO's that want ORD because they live in the area. ORD is a very Senior E170 base.
Even after the SF34 guys came over we're still holding lines. There were a few SF34 guys that quit and went other places too, among the Capt's flocking to JetBlue and COA. If he's on the E145 tell him to get out of GSO,MCO or STL where there are senior FO's.

As far as Upgrade; I would plan on 3 years to the E145/135

 

[Clyde]

Agreed. If it's part 121 scheduled turbine PIC - take it, without question.

If it is any PIC time - take the upgrade.

 

[NoBathroom]

I had the same decision to make. I was hired by a regional and was offered 1900 upgrade the same day as I was offered a class at the regional. I chose to stay and upgrade. However, a couple of months after I upgraded I interviewed and was offered a job with a regional that would allow me to move home and was one I had always wanted to work for. So, with only a few months of 1900 PIC, I left. But, I moved to the city that I want to live in, have bought a townhouse, and am a senior RJ FO waiting for upgrade. I chose to leave for quality of life. Also, in this day and age, in most cases it will take quite a bit of total time and some jet time to get to a major. I also have a friend who got her PIC in the 1900, flew an RJ for about 8 months, and now is sitting at Continental on the 757.

 

[eight8kcabpilot]

You guys that think majors only want jet pic are just mad cause there are TP guys getting to the majors faster than you. They are at majors while you are still wating for your upgrade bid. It is true that some Majors want to see some jet time...this time does not have to be PIC. Get your PIC and then do six months at a regional and start sending your stuff out. Or you can tough it out and wait for something better. I work at Great Lakes (which is probably the crappiest company out there) and we loose a lot of guys to majors (Alaska, FedEx, Frontier). My advice is to get your 1000PIC and then leave. At least you will have that in your back pocket if you get furloughed from your next job. Plus, a lot of the guys doing the hiring at majors are ex TP guys and they know about the piloting skill it takes to hand fly eight legs a day with every approach down to the nuts.