Skywest...serving Birmingham?? What the?

[bssthound]

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but since DAL codeshares with Skywest wouldn't it behoove DAL to expand Skywest since it wouldn't fall under the scope?? Looks to me like that's why Skywest is growing where we, ASA, should be. By expanding
Skywest in ASA's region is DAL circumventing the scope??

Like I said, correct me if I'm wrong. I look forward to reading
everyone else's inputs.

 

[snowback]

Correcting your wrongness

All Delta Connection flying is covered under the scope section of the PWA. American Eagle, ASA, Comair, Skywest and whoever else are all included in the ratios. That being said, even with the reductions in mainline flying, Delta Connection still has a fair amount of room to expand before the caps are hit. Any return towards previous levels by mainline and subsequent expansion beyond that will mean more expansion room for all the Delta Connection carriers as well as more major airline jobs for those who want to move on. Sounds fair.

 

[Two-9-9-TwoSet]

Hey EMB guy,


You're not that F/O I flew with last week with the big mouth are you???

 

[Twotter76]

I suspect that without the enforcement of scope clauses I probably will still be at a regional in five years (as will most of us). I do agree that we need to do something about current conditions at the regionals but not at the expense of our future jobs.

 

[Two-9-9-TwoSet]

Twotter,

You're exactly right.

Many guys at the regionals are guys that had other careers, with the hiring boom in the 90s, they decided to give"the good old dream" a shot..they're quite happy with retiring with a commuter.

 

[FlyingSig]

It's amazing to me that so many guys at the majors don't see the foolishness of allowing the substandard wages at said "regionals" (plainly national carriers flying smaller aircraft) to perpetuate. It's only going to get worse.

I'm just curious how the paycheck of the regional pilot is "allowed" by mainline pilots? Who negotiates those rates? Oh yeah, Skywest doesn't have a union...oops.

Seriously though, it's a legit question.... just how is it that pilots at majors "allow the substandard wages"?

You get what you negotiate and why do you need me to negotiate for you...can't you do it yourself? (as a pilot group)

 

[Anaconda]

so...can one of you skywest guys confirm my earlier posting about the prescence of comair gates in salt lake?

 

[Smoove Ride]

negative.... no comair brutha's (or gates) out here.
but who know's? give it another year or two and all the delta connection carriers will be running each other over trying to park their planes. -sr.

 

[skydiverdriver]

To FlyingSig

Sir,
To answer your question, the mailine pilots help write the regional's contracts by the way they help, or fail to help them during negotiations. Just like Delta pilots helped Comair pilots very little during their recent strike, they allow Delta to pay Comair pilots far less, which makes their expantion more likely. ALPA has a policy against allowing alter-ego airlines to exist, and so do most mainline agreements. However, when the airlines create or purchase smaller airlines to feed them, the mainline pilots don't do anything to take care of this problem. That is how they allow the regionals to be a lower paid alter-ego airline.

 

[FlyingSig]

Re: To FlyingSig

Just like Delta pilots helped Comair pilots very little during their recent strike, they allow Delta to pay Comair pilots far less, which makes their expantion more likely.

I'm guessing you're not a Comair pilot, because if you were, then you would be well aware of how much money Delta pilots spent (out of DALPA dues money...not Comair dues money...and not the MCF) setting up strike centers for Comair. And you would be well aware of how many man hours were spent delevoping software to monitor Comair struck work, man hours standing by the phones to track potential struck work, and man hours spent updating the Delta pilot group daily via code-a-phone and email. If you were a Comair pilot you would also be well aware of all the Delta pilots that spent time walking the line and all the personal money donated to the family awareness fund above and beyond the ALPA assesments.

If you are a Comair pilot and were aware of how much Delta pilots did to help the Comair pilots with the strike and still made the above statement then I really don't know what to say.... I guess nothing could please you.

or fail to help them during negotiations.

I was not aware of a request for aid by the Comair MEC or the Comair Negotiating committie to DALPA? Did the Comair MEC want Delta's help? I doubt it...

However, when the airlines create or purchase smaller airlines to feed them, the mainline pilots don't do anything to take care of this problem.

The Delta pilots, nor the Delta MEC own Comair. We do not have a voting seat on the Delta BOD. Just how is it that DALPA or any Delta pilot could change the way Delta Air Lines runs its business? Should we have not negotiated the best possible contract so as to "leave some money for Comair pilots"? Why would ANY pilot group not go after the best deal possible?! No thanks Delta...we don't want United plus...just give us a little raise but make sure the Comair guys do real good, ok? Gimme a break....

ALPA has a policy against allowing alter-ego airlines to exist, and so do most mainline agreements.

Besides the fact that you probally send too much of your paycheck to the RJ Deffense.... are you aware of the differance between ALPA and Delta pilots?

The DALPA contract is what allows Comair to even carry Delta passengers. The dreaded-harm-my-career scope section is what allows Comair to carry Delta ticketed passengers on airplanes OTHER than Delta mainline jets. If the DALPA contract did not allow for this then Comair would have to find its own passengers (or another major airline who's contracts ALLOW them to carry THIER passengers.... I'm not saying they couldn't, but do you think it would be as big as it is now?

Wholy-owned alter-ego thing? I agree, it sucks....but you guys are picking a fight with the wrong side. Even if you forced ALPA to merge the lists....how do you force the corporation to acknowledge that list/single contract/payscales/workrules/etc... If they don't sign their names to that contract they don't have to honor it. Besides, management just loves lawsuits against unions.

Delta pilots created scope in their own interest so ALL flying couldn't be code-shared away. Comair pilots and ALL REGIONAL pilots should be doing the same thing. Right now Comair is getting scopped out of their own flying (ironically, which they took away from ASA) by non-union Skywest because Comair forgot to put their own noose on a scope clause for 70 seat and under flying.

So really all this ranting I'm doing boils down to this: Regional pilots negotiate their own contract. If they vote yes on the thing, then it's their own fault what they get paid. Mainline pilots shouldn't have to negotiate (read: pay for) for another airline's contract.

It is not the fault of a pilot that works for Brand A (major) that a pilot at Brand B (regional) gets paid substandard wages.