SkyWest or Air Wisconsin?

[Calpilot]

I'd love to hear from some SkyWest and AWAC pilots about perceived/actual differences on :

1. Money (1st, 2nd, 3rd year, etc.)
2. Quality of life (days off, schedules)
3. Upgrade times
4. Length of time on reserve for a new hire
5. Growth and expansion

I live in the SF Bay area, so SkyWest seems more local but I'll probably have to commute for either job (unless someone opens a bay area base). I know that SkyWest has Sacramento, but that'll probably be gone as they retire the brasillias.

I know that both companies are great and that I should be thrilled with either (especially in this age). But I believe that I'm going to have to choose between them and would really appreciate any insight. This will hopefully determine my home for a long time so I want to choose wisely.

Thank you all for your help!

 

[Davi8r]

I know that SkyWest has Sacramento, but that'll probably be gone as they retire the brasillias.

I fly Brasilias for SkyWest. My wife and I are buying a house in Sacramento, so I hope you're wrong on this point. SkyWest currently flies RJs to LAX and SLC from Sacramento. Some of our SMF-SFO departures could fill 50 seats. No one knows if Sac will ever be an RJ domicile, but some of us are hoping!

First year pay is $19.02/hr plus $1.60/hr per diem. Policies favor pilots, in my opinion. For example, you're scheduled to fly from SFO to MRY and return but both flights are cancelled due to fog at MRY. You're still paid for flying both legs even though you never left SFO. Another example, you have to hold for 20 minutes on leg A but complete leg B five minutes early. You'll be paid for the extra 20 minutes on leg A and don't have to give anything back for the five minutes saved on leg B.

A lot of SkyWest pilots put quality of life ahead of pure go-anywhere, do-anything career advancement. I'm one of them. I'd rather stay home and hold a comfortable line on the Brasilia for now, than move or commute to SLC to hold a reserve line on the RJ or upgrade in the Brasilia. A lot of our lines are 100% local trips, some are two day and the rest are 3-4 day trips. In contrast: For someone hot to start flying RJs, SLC recently is looking like a fairly junior domicile.

Days off are generally good once you hold a line. At Sacramento they usually vary from 12-20 days off per month. Needless to say, the higher your senority, the more likely you'll get the line that offers 20 days off. We are currently short on FOs due to upgrades and transitions, so we have less days off in October. I'm holding a decent line but will have only ten days off next month. Hopefully we'll be back to normal strength when the new hire class that started earlier this month graduates.

I started at the beginning of this year and was on reserve through August. Part of that is my fault for picking a more senior domicile. I've moved up six places in the past two months, though: Three to RJ transitions and three to Brasilia upgrades. Brasilia reserve lines are 10-11 days off per month, 12 hours on each day with a 90 minute call out.

It's taking awhile to upgrade in the Brasilia (2-4 years) because all of SkyWest's growth is in the RJ. My current thinking is to hold a decent line as a Brasilia FO and wait for opportunities in the jet. If you want turboprop PIC time right now, you probably want to take a pass on SkyWest even though it's a good company. The number of Brasilias will gradually decline, meaning less and less opportunities to move up in them. Meanwhile, RJ deliveries are cooking. We're expecting 16 of Canadair's 50 seaters between September and early January, and continuing beyond that.

Growth and expansion are tied to Delta and United's plans. SkyWest is continually operating new city pairs for its partners as quickly as it can take delivery of RJs. Denver is rumored to be our next RJ pilot domicile. We just opened Tucson with 30 crews moving there.

Hope this helps. Good luck with your decision. -- Dave

 

[VFR on Top]

Some great info. Thx, Dave!

 

[Beechnut]

Right now I don't think you can go wrong with either company.

Good luck!

S.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

Air WI is the best regional-better pay, duty rig, trip rig, company funded retirement than SkyWest. However, SkyWest is also great, just not as good.

Since you're from the West Coast (& I presume want to stay) it would make more sense to go with SkyWest. I have been trying to get into AWAC, and haven't applied at SkyWest, just because I live in the Midwest and the SkyWest commute is too difficult.

Good luck!

Cliff
GRB

 

[rightrudder]

1. Money (1st, 2nd, 3rd year, etc.) based upon being hired today.

1st year FO: DO328 $21.75; CRJ & 146 $24.00
2nd year FO: 328 $28.12; CRJ $36.24; 146 $43.48
2nd year CA: 328 $46.87; CRJ $60.40
3rd year FO: 146 $46.61
3rd year CA: 328 $50.21; CRJ $64.73

Per Diem $1.50, will increase to $1.60-1.65 nest year or so.
75 hour guarantee for all aircraft, whether lineholder or reserve.
Paid uniform bank after 2 years, pay for headset at initial hire, then $300 every 5 years. FAA Medical reimbursement.

2. Quality of life (days off, schedules)

Pretty good, minimum of 12 days off per month (even on reserve), depending on the aircraft and time of year, up to 17 days off or so per month (i've had more than 17 a few times).
Schedules mixed, right now mostly 4 day trips, but at times a mis of 2, 3, 4 day trips. Rarely have just 1 day trips. Very good for commuters, I don't need crash pad. Mostly later commutable show times, and done by mid-afternoon most of the time if not earlier.

3. Upgrade times

Right now 328 upgrade at 1 year 3 months, about to decrease to much less than that; CL-65 most junior during latest vacancy award, 2 years 3 months. This will be decreasing rapidly as well with the onslaught of deliveries.

4. Length of time on reserve for a new hire

New hire class of 9-9-02, DO328, linholder award 12-02; they will probably get out on the line toward end of OCT, so for them about 1 month; on the CL-65 it will probably be only 2 months or so, I predict, with the scheduled deliveries. 146 - who knows? I will probably be quite a bit longer than the others.

5. Growth and expansion

Right now we have 26 CRJ's, will have 38 by FEB. I've heard we will have 60 by June, but that's not the official word yet. We are awaiting a "Big Announcement" which will likely be of substantial new growth.

Our bases are DEN (328, 146 and CRJ), ORD (CRJ) and ATW (146).
Rumors of an east coast (IAD) and west coast (LAX) domicile are floating around as well.

I haven't any real complaints in my time here. I have been treated fairly and very well. I think this is a great place to be, I used to work at Horizon and this is a much better place.
I am a West Coast person and have found it very easy to commute to Denver, even Chicago wasn't too bad when I had to do that. I am sure folks at Skywest are happy as well. I have a friend who was offered class this month at both Skywest and here, and he chose AWAC, and he lives in CA.

Anyhow, i'm sure you wouldn't regret either choice.

 

[everyonedoa360]

Hey ATPCLiff,

You might want to wait until you are ACTUALLY HIRED by an airline to tell us what is the better one!

 

[Wiskey Driver]

I think what Cliff is attempting to say since he lives very close to our head quarters and has been researching AWAC for as long as I have been here, is that both places are great but what it all boils down to is quality of life ie commute... No harm no foul.

WD.

 

[Socalplt]

I'll try to answer some of your questions about SkyWest.

Growth: Between now and December of 2003 we will take delivery of approximately 50 RJs while retiring 7-10 Brasilias. With a net gain of approximately 40 aircraft and 5 crews per aircraft, we'd need an additional 400 pilots or so. Another 30 or so RJs in 2004 I believe and options for up to 119 beyond that. Attrition has dropped to practically zero so future hiring is dependant on growth.

Upgrades: Junior Brasilia Captain will have a hire date of 4/2000 when they go to upgrade class in a few weeks. It's the first Brasilia upgrade class they've had in over a year and there are only 10 people in it. Junior RJ captain I believe is around a Feb. 2000 hire date with the class that starts in about a month. With the growth we have I'd expect many upgrades in the jet out of the early 2000 hire dates in the next several months. RJ captain is going into the low 700s in seniority (out of 1200). I would have to guess that anyone hired at this time would have at least 3 years till upgrade.

Schedules: If you on the jet plan on 4, or even 5 day trips after you get off reserve. They encompass about 80% of our regular lines. I haven't been in the Brasilia in 2 years so I'm not sure what their schedules are like. Complaints about our schedules are probably at the top of the list among the pilot group.

Pay: You've probaby been to www.skywestpilot.com and seen the rates so you can compare them to Air Wisconsin. Overall pretty good work rules, but we don't have a trip rig and have 4 day trips that pay less than 20 hours. Reserve is 1 1/2hr. callout for a 12 a hour period. No long callout which I believe AirWis has. No retirement plan beyond 401K. Our current pay rates don't go beyond next June so negotiations will need to be done before that. Our management in the past has committed to keep us among the top in the regional industry, hopefully this will continue.

Commuting: No commuter policy, but the opinion is we don't need one from the majority. A large number of our pilots commute. In your case we operate our own equipment out of OAK, SJC, and SMF to SLC, and Delta has a number of flights as well which we now have ID100 (fly for free) privelages for. Fresno will undoubtly continue as a domicle as we have MX there. Plenty of flights to SFO daily or you could drive. SMF still seems to be a good size EMB base, however MRY seems to be shrinking.

Overall, SkyWest is a good company to work for as I'm sure Air Wisconsin is as well. I've been here 2 1/2 years so I hope the information helps. If anyone from SkyWest has a different opinion or believes some of my information is wrong I welcome them to comment here. If your intent on commuting I'd probably pick based upon the easiest commute.