Seminole Gear

[RipCurl]

Having a brain fart here - is the nose gear on the Seminole locked down via overcentering and a spring, or a downlock hook? I can't find the answer here and I just can't seem to remember... I'm getting different a/c mixed up I think.

Also, when the gear is retracted, is the pump shut off by the 3 up limit microswitches or by a 1800 psi pressure switch?

Thanks.

 

[mayday1]

downlock hooks, and i think the microswitches on retraction.

 

[Northern Lights]

Yeah, microswitches, but the PSI also has to be above 1800. For example, if the gear was up, but the pressure dropped, the pump would kick on for a second. You wouldn't get any horns or lights in the cockpit as long as the gear hadn't shifted off of the uplimit switches.

 

[Frmr Avro Drvr]

Hate to throw a wrench in the works, but I seem to remember the Seminole and Arrow had Overcenter down-locking. Someone may want to check that. I may be wrong though.

I have slept since I last flew one of those so I can't remember.

 

[BoilerUP]

WOW, that's pretty in-depth systems knowledge for a Seminole. Who wants you to know that, school or examiner? I'd hate to see the explanation for a constant-speed propeller.

Shouldn't "electrically powered hydraulic pump with mechanical gear downlocks, and is held up by hydraulic pressure" along with an explanation of the emergency gear extention procedure and theory be sufficient to test your understanding of the Piper retractable gear system? After all, Arrow = Seminole = Saratoga = Seneca.

 

[Frmr Avro Drvr]

Let see, there is:

Rote Knowledge
Understanding
Correlation
(I seem to be missing one. Can any of you CFI candidates fill in the FOI blank in my brain?)

Which one are we required to exhibit for a check ride?

Which one do we need to have when it comes to being PIC of the aircraft we are flying?

Rote Knowledge doesn't cut it in either case when it comes to systems knowledge. V-speeds and limitations--yes, systems--no.

 

[minitour]

Let see, there is:

Rote Knowledge
Understanding
Correlation
(I seem to be missing one. Can any of you CFI candidates fill in the FOI blank in my brain?)

Application

 

[BoilerUP]

Rote Knowledge doesn't cut it in either case when it comes to systems knowledge. V-speeds and limitations--yes, systems--no.

No offense, but you do not need to be a systems engineer to understand how the landing gear works on a Piper retract. Knowing specific minute details about a system does not mean you have reached either the application or correlation phase of knowledge. How does saying "the gear is locked down with mechanical locks" differ from saying "the gear is locked down with an overcentering mechanism"? The latter makes you sound like you know what you are talking about, it doesn't mean that you know what you are talking about. In this example, how would knowing the more specific definition benefit you as a pilot other than to stoke your own ego? Can you think of any situtation? I can't.

 

[Frmr Avro Drvr]

Application

Thanks. It has been a while.

 

[Frmr Avro Drvr]

How does saying "the gear is locked down with mechanical locks" differ from saying "the gear is locked down with an overcentering mechanism"? The latter makes you sound like you know what you are talking about, it doesn't mean that you know what you are talking about. In this example, how would knowing the more specific definition benefit you as a pilot other than to stoke your own ego? Can you think of any situtation? I can't.

No offense taken. Both of your quotes sound like rote answers though. It sounds like it is read out of the textbook. The logical question to follow a response like that is "What does all that mean?" There is a lot of technical talk in there that may not mean anything to the person who recited it.

I tried to think of a case where it matter when I made the original post but couldn't either. I just saw a huge hole for the examiner to walk through with a question like "What does all that mean?" It is a an easy question for the examiner to follow-up with if he/she thinks the candidate is reciting and the candidate will have a "deer in the headlights" look. That doesn't help the case. If the person is making the effort to memorize a statement, a little walk out to the aircraft will make that statement make a whole lot more sense.

I guess it is the engineer in me coming out. My students and I would take a tour of the aircraft during a ground lesson and talk about some of the systems. A picture (the tour) makes memorization a whole lot easier too.

What is the best way to convince a student that the batteries don't power the magnetos? Show them a magneto and ask them to show you which wire comes from the battery. It is the same kind of approach to learning.

Good point though. I guess it is all perspective.