RVSM Is Finally Here !!

[kilroy]

All this talk of RVSM and its hard to believe its actually here. So how much of a cluster F()ck do you think 01/01/05 is going to be. Better yet how many operators are not going to be ready . My current employer will not be RVSM qualified by then . They are waiting for the prices to come down . Mean while I,ll be stuck in the mid 20 flight levels like all the rest of no certified aircraft and all the turbo props.. Now thats going to be a mess all these .80 airplanes flying around at turbo prop altitudes

New Equipment Suffix For FAA Flight Plans


Reduced Vertical Separation Minimum (RVSM) will be implemented in Domestic U.S. airspace between FL 290-410 (inclusive) at 0901 UTC on 1/20/05.

Effective 1/5/05, when filing an FAA Flight Plan, with the exception of operators filing through DUATS and Flight Service Stations, RVSM-compliant operators/aircraft are expected to file /Q or /W, as appropriate, for flight between FL 290-410 (inclusive).

Effective 1/20/05, RVSM-compliant operators/aircraft must file /Q or /W, as appropriate, or be denied clearance into RVSM airspace.

A full explanation of the revised equipment suffix table is located in the "Area of Operations Specific Information" section at http://www.faa.gov/ats/ato/rvsm

 

[banned username 2]

So how much of a cluster F()ck do you think 01/01/05 is going to be.

None, it's January 20th that might have some issues...

I for one, am VERY glad DRVSM is finally on our doorstep, the additional altitude options will be a welcome arrival!

 

[C-150ETOPS]

Careful what you wish for.

I am aware of RVSM in Europe and the Atlantic. I am on edge waiting for the results of RVSM in the USA.

We watched a TCAS target slide across our nose one time on a smooth as glass day in the mid-atlantic. The closest they got was 35 miles on a perpendicular (sp?) track to ours and 100' above.

A couple of minutes later we hit his wake and it felt like hitting a log while in a car on the interstate. I had a full drink cup in my hand and it was completely emptied.

Good luck keeping the seafood and cheese tray off "Mr almost Bigbucks" lap while cruising along in a CE-500

 

[The Av1ator]

I really don't see how RVSM will help the USA. It's more airports we need not more congested airspace. You don't think so? Then you don't fly in the Northeast or into Chicago very often. RVSM is going to be a big mess. I am not looking forward to the holds going into the Northeast on a weather day cause New York approach is saturated. Atlanta has holding every afternoon even on good weather days. WE spent a lot of time and money getting our airplane up to speed for RVSM, but I am NOT looking forward to it.

 

[kilroy]

So DRVSM will open up almost double the airspace and so many more airplanes can be in the sky at one time utilizing more routes and saving fuel.. Were are all the extra airplanes going to land. Are they going to lay more concrete ?? And how about climbing up to the these altitudes > With the increase in non RVSM planes in the mid 20's the saturation in that airspace has got to be a major issue.

 

[ultrarunner]

So DRVSM will open up almost double the airspace and so many more airplanes can be in the sky at one time utilizing more routes and saving fuel..

Uhh, where all of a sudden are all these airplanes coming from?

Heck, I'm thinking by January 20 airspace above 290 is going to be LESS congested since overnight non-rvsm jets will not be there.

I got no problem with that.

 

[kilroy]

You are right there airspace above fl290 will be alot less congested . Especially in the midwest and other typically less congested areas. But places like North east is going to be a nightmare. If lets say a third of the aircraft are not RVSM equipped so now you have over 1000 more aircraft on a busy day that will be stuck in the mid 20's and every one of them will need higher so they can non- stop Fll to Teb. The problem will most likely be in the 20's were all the saturation will be.

Uhh, where all of a sudden are all these airplanes coming from?

Heck, I'm thinking by January 20 airspace above 290 is going to be LESS congested since overnight non-rvsm jets will not be there.

I got no problem with that.

 

[TCA]

I think the one thing that everyone will need to be on their toes for (or the headliner) is wake turbulence @ altitude! I belive there will be an increase in occurences of inflight injuries during cruise.

TCA
Still Climbing

 

[cosmotheassman]

We went through a dc10 wake turb that was 50 miles in front of us one day. It turned our aircraft into almost a 90 degree bank turn then swung back the opposite direction to about 55 degrees. I could not believe it happened as fast as it did. Thank goodness no passengers on board. ATC was waiting for the 20 miles separation to climb us above him and we requested 50 miles or a turn. they gave us the 50 miles which in hind sight....


My question is: is there any point in reporting turbulence of this nature because after RVSM, it is going to happen quite frequently as stated before.

 

[The Av1ator]

So DRVSM will open up almost double the airspace and so many more airplanes can be in the sky at one time utilizing more routes and saving fuel..

Not going to be saving fuel while I am holding 200 miles south of TEB waiting for approach to work the mess they have on a weather day. Also, if my climb is delayed due to all the congestion that there is sure to be in the 20's there goes more fuel. I honestly don't see how anyone that flys into the major hubs of the USA can say that RVSM is going to help anything.

 

[Bandit60]

None, it's January 20th that might have some issues...

I for one, am VERY glad DRVSM is finally on our doorstep, the additional altitude options will be a welcome arrival!

I don't understand why this is going to be a good thing. I cant think of any advantage to it that doesnt have a major dissadvatage.

I have never had a problem with flight levels causing me delays its alway when I get into the lower alt going into major cities. RVSM is not going to help this problem at all.

More alt =more aircraft but the terminal areas cant handle what we have now.

 

[Bandit60]

I think the one thing that everyone will need to be on their toes for (or the headliner) is wake turbulence @ altitude! I belive there will be an increase in occurences of inflight injuries during cruise.

TCA
Still Climbing

That is a good point. However you can ask to side step the course for that very reason.

 

[TonyC]

I really don't see how RVSM will help the USA. It's more airports we need not more congested airspace.

I don't see how RVSM is going to create more congestion. Congestion would require either increasing the number of airplanes airborne, or decreasing the space they have to fit in. RVSM does neither. Inasmuch as it will eliminate the airplanes that are not RVSM compliant, it will do the opposite.

The big advantage I see, though, is the increased routing options. Today if I'm stuck at an altitude behind a slower aircraft going the same general direction, I can descend 4,000' (and burn more gas), climb 4,000' (if I'm even able, and burn more gas), slow down (and burn more gas), or get vectors around the slower airplane (and - - you got it - - burn more gas). With the additional options of descend or climb 2,000, I have more options, better options, and a far greater chance of receiving more direct routing. Even if traffic is not an issue, the greater variety of flight levels means I get to fly at an altitude closer to my optimum altitude.


If that gets me to my destination sooner, that ALSO means less congestion of the friendly skies.

 

[AA717driver]

Just wait till all those small jets with zoomy avionics and RVSM certification out of the box start clogging up the airspace. An arrival to Morristown or Stewart still f***'s up the arrivals...

Only 15 years to go... TC

 

[Bandit60]

Just wait till all those small jets with zoomy avionics and RVSM certification out of the box start clogging up the airspace. An arrival to Morristown or Stewart still f***'s up the arrivals...

Only 15 years to go... TC[/QUOTE

We are already there now. So how are we going to clog it up more. Most arrival are operating below fl290 so rvsm has nothing to do with arrivals.

 

[THE Flying Ace]

Most of the time when you are flying on the east coast, ATC doesn't even let you above FL290.

 

[FracCapt]

The biggest problem that will be caused by RVSM is the fact that the RVSM airplanes will have a harder time getting to 290 and above due to the congestion at the lower altitudes with the non RVSM airplans. This will cause the most trouble between the northeast and Florida...but will cause problems to a lesser extent near all busy airports. Starting Jan 20th...we'll find out how well it works.

 

[2000flyer]

I concur with the other folks in that to create congestion, you need more volume. Where the congestion is going to occur is below FL290. There are more operators than not who will be be compliant by 1/20/05. You're going to see everything from Ciations to JetStars to older Gulfstreams who, for what ever reason, lagged in getting compliant.

Climbing and descending could be a problem but the FAA has already addressed that. Also, unless it's changed in the very recent past, non-RVSM compliant aircraft will be allowed to climb and descend through RVSM airspace. If traffic doesn't permit, they will be vectored and delayed, not RVSM compliant aircraft.

One concern I have is the owner/operator on SP Citations and new "light" jets who don't fly that often getting into the flight levels and really mucking things up. If they keep up with their training (including RVSM procedures), no problem. However, I've seen more than a fair share of "weaker" owner/operators out there who just blast off and go. These new light jets are as or more affordable than a new Baron or Seneca so Joe M.D. or Esq. will now have affordable access to them.

 

[Metro752]

RVSM sounds like a jelly donut waiting for me to sit on it........accidently.

 

[Daveman]

If that gets me to my destination sooner, that ALSO means less congestion of the friendly skies.

It's been five months since my RVSM class, and for the life of me I could not think what ALSO meant (regards to rvsm). To many acronyms and to many late nights.
Picking up our LOA from the FSDO very SOON.

Edit:ALSO=adverb.