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regional pilot to ATC

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aland504

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 7, 2004
Posts
57
hey there, so just a quick question for you controllers. old and new would be great. thinking of getting into ATC and leaving flying, but as with every job in the aviation industry seems to come with frustration and unfair work rules...whatever it is. what do you all think about getting into ATC now? do you really get to pick where you go? i have read multiple posts on here saying that is true and not true. just overall really, are you happy or not happy with your choice to do this?
thank you
 
I've got another question to add. Back a few years ago when I was furloughed from my airline job, I looked into becoming an Air Traffic Controller. I quickly found out that I was too old ( i was 32 at the time), the age cutoff being 31 I believe. I find it strange that we (pilots) can be hired up until our 60th (soon to be 65th) birthday, but controllers can't be older than 31. I am not saying that one job is harder or easier than the other - rather that they seem to be along the same lines and require the same skill sets and abilities.

What are your thoughts?
 
hey there, so just a quick question for you controllers. old and new would be great. thinking of getting into ATC and leaving flying, but as with every job in the aviation industry seems to come with frustration and unfair work rules...whatever it is. what do you all think about getting into ATC now? do you really get to pick where you go? i have read multiple posts on here saying that is true and not true. just overall really, are you happy or not happy with your choice to do this?
thank you

I am in ATC, and I keep looking at getting out and going back into flying.
 
Im a controller at a busy facility (top ten) and I love it. To a point you get to choose where you want to go. The FAA offers you a facility (first they might offer you a state and then an option, enroute or terminal) and you get to choose if you want it or not. Simple as that.

Regarding the Age...
We're required to retire at 56...no idea why. 25 years of service subtracted from 56 is where they get the 31 number from.

ATCT
 
Im a controller at a busy facility (top ten) and I love it. To a point you get to choose where you want to go. The FAA offers you a facility (first they might offer you a state and then an option, enroute or terminal) and you get to choose if you want it or not. Simple as that.

Regarding the Age...
We're required to retire at 56...no idea why. 25 years of service subtracted from 56 is where they get the 31 number from.

ATCT

They did a study back in the day and found that by the age of 31 the amount of time to grasp and learn the atc system it gets too difficult or too long to train, unlike the younger whipper snappers.
 
circletoland: agreed! the younger you are, the quicker you can probably grasp it.

next time you see missile, tell him I said YEYEYYEYEYEYEYEYEYEYEYEYEYE.

or as DB always jokes, "bin, strips, scope....yeye db, just go in dere and go BIN, STRIPS, scope" his famous last-minute advice from missile before the pv.
 
thanks for the replies. i just cant tell what to do. i know several controllers who cant stress enough to me to not get into and others say it is great. guess its just like any other job. also can you go straight to OKC or do you have to go to a college first? i already fly for a regional so dont know if they take that into consideration that you already know a great deal about it....
 
I think you can just get hired off the street now and go to OKC. They are hurting for people just like the regionals. With the new pay rules. A new trainee at a center now gets paid about half of what they used to. They get the equivalent of what a 1st year regional FO makes. The pay raises to rise up sharply, however, because once you get fully qualified, you'll be making the dough. Again, this is considerably less than "pre-contract adjustment" days.
 
My brother-in-law was also looking to make a career change without military or college ATC background. As a result, in the last month, I have made many phone calls and emails trying to find the how-to details for someone off the street. I was told that there have been NO off the street bids out for awhile, however an HR person in OKC told me that there may be some out near mid-to-end of Spring. You'll just have to follow the job advertisements on the jobs site at FAA.gov. The series # for controllers is 2152. There is a requirement to be hired by age 31. All of the folks we've gotten have been previous military controller (there have been a number of these) or a CTI (we've gotten 3).

Go look at both www.faa.gov and www.natca.net, both sites have info on the job.

Many of the new folks were getting are thrilled to be making what they're making, even though its a lot less than our original pay scale.

My hubby flies a CRJ for ASA, and I can assure you that our (ATCers) QOL is significantly better than his, its just not as great as it used to be....when we could wear jeans/shorts and sneakers, have a radio in the Tower, and go out for lunch! But I will say that I am home every night (almost, except for an occasional midshift), and can plan my life around the schedule given to me....unlike my hubby - with hard and soft days off and all sorts of crazy flying schedules. He's ALWAYS tired an worn out.
 
Qol?

What's the typical schedule like? 5 on 2 off 8 hour days? I fly for the regionals too and have thought about it. But I really don't know much about it? Any info on QOL would really be appreciated, thanks.
 
I am married to an ASA pilot (prior to that he was with with Comair and Skyway...before furloughs - btw, they're all basically the same), and I am a controller at ATL. Trust me, even with our imposed work rules, our QOL is tenfold better than what y'all got going on.

With any job, its what you make of it. Some people will tell you ATC sux these days. The bottom line is that we don not have the freedoms that we used to have, but b/c I see daily the difference in what hubby must tolerate compred to my job, I can certainly say that I prefer ATC to being a pilot.

Before the staffing shortage, it was 8 hour days, 5 days a week. Dependent on your facility, you might have permanent days off or rotating, but you always knew your schedule about a month+ in advance. Since everyone starting to retire, I work almost consistantly 6 day work-weeks (not voluntarily as the FAA would like you to believe), and several 10-hour shifts within a pay period. The OT money is nice, but I'd rather be at home. I am always tired these days.
 
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So after the 6 days off do you get 2 off or just one? I hear they're not hiring off the street right now but its possible soon? How difficult would it be or how long to get a spot working in Denver? I guess they send you anywhere initially but I suppose if they have a shortage like they say it might be easier to get the spot you want? Thanks for the reply I appreciate all the info.
 
You only get the one. This is not like your pilot work schedules with hard and soft days. Its more like a sked that a normal perosn would work - a Monday thru Friday gig, with the exception that your Sat and Sun are most probably on some other set of days off based upon seniority (for example: we have guys who have 1989 seniority dates and the best they can hold is Monday-Tuesday as their days off). Don't forget that some facilities have rotating days off. Just depends on where you work.

Then the FAA schedules you, in current times, for your OT on one of those days you have as a weekend. Where I work it can be either, no telling which until it comes out.

Our rules are also a bit easier to manage than what y'all do:
1) Controllers cannot work 7 days in a row - you must have at least one day off.
2) We must have an 8-hour break between shifts.
3) We cannot work more than a 10-hour shift without an 8-hour break before the next shift.

And as for your other question about location, I haven't a clue. Its seems with the military controller bids (VRA), that they are having them apply by state and can be hired into any facility within the state.
 
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Awesome thanks a lot for all the information, it all helped me understand it much better!
 
What's stressful about it? Why don't you like going to work?

Its knowing that everyday your going to get your but kicked, (atleast wile training). Going to the same place for 20 years +, I just don't think i can do it. I rather be doing something more crazy, like i was before ferrying airplanes all over the place. Its more adventurous.
 
Yeah I can see if you want something like that it could get old. I really want stability, I want to go to the same place everyday and come home to my family at night, where I don't have to commute, and don't have to be on the road 19 days a month hoping I don't get furloughed or my company go out of business. The key for me is stability and family, I'd like to have an everyday normal boring lifestyle.
 
I hear ya, I and I think everyone else wants stability also. I am just not exactly happy, nor the FAA constantly lying and their bait and swap with the salary. Even if they went back to the old rules.
 
I retired from the FAA and was a controller for many years at several centers. The FAA was only hiring college students from CTI schools and military controllers for the last few years, but with the controller shortage the door is sometimes opened for a few days for outside hires. My daughter obtained an FAA offer and will be going to OKC with this 'off the street hiring'. We found her opportunity on USAJOBS.GOV 3 months ago. The FAA only opens the bid for a few days for a few locations at random times, so it takes some patience.
The age 31 rule is a congressional law tied to the Air Traffic Control early retirement law which provides an early retirement after 25 years of active 'on the boards' air traffic control, but no later than age 56. 56-25=age 31 maximum entry age for the early retirement. Another retirement law provision provides an early retirement after 20 years on the boards if age 50 or more. Some controllers move into other FAA work and retire under the civil service retirement like any other federal employee. FERS is the federal employee retirement system, if you want to check it out at OPM.GOV.
Stress? As always it is usually self induced. After 5 years the job will be boring, mundane and routine with occassional spikes in excitement. AFter 15 years on the boards, I moved on to other things in the FAA, flew in the reserves and had a great career with 5 weeks vacation, dependable scheduling, understanding management and great fellow controllers. The QOL was outstanding and far better than I understand the regional/major world is these days. Plus, if you become an FAA certified controller, a solid job forever will be your reward. I would do it again, in a heartbeat and I encourage my children to give it a try.
The are some sour controllers that will give you the doom and gloom. Misery loves company and they are always searching for a shoulder to cry on. MOst complainers went into the military after highschool then entered the FAA as controllers. These personalities are the same as before the PATCO strike and they never had a real, break you back job in the real world. Personally, I believe the NATCA union is stronger/smarter than PATCO (the last ATC union I was a member of) and better pay, working conditions will come in time. 40,000 replacement controllers were hired after the 1981 PATCO failure. 15,000 completed the training and became controllers. Now they are hitting the 25 year end of the line and there will be another spike in hiring. If you want to do it: Keep tabs on FAA hiring and look for openings or become a military Air Traffic controller and sign up for as few years as possible and then enter under a VRA bid or go to a college CTI. The CTI (College Training Initiative) is a 1 or 2 year activity after your associates degree, but then a 100% gurantee of hiring by the FAA. All three methods require attendence at the OKC ATC FAA school, a 2 year training activity and your successful completion of training....
I hope this helps.
However, if your heart is in the cockpit-don't leave it. Money isn't everything and only you can decide what the balance will be for your best QOL.
 
The 'off the street bid' for Air Traffic Controller just opened and will close 2/15/08. If you want to try, go to this FAA bid:

Announcement Number : AAC-AMH-08-PUBNAT1-08232Opening Date : Jan 23, 2008Closing Date : Feb 15, 2008Position : Air Traffic Control Specialist TraineeSeries : 2152Business Component : Air Traffic Organization. Duty Location(s) : Throughout The Nation, United States - Vacancies: Many Salary Range : $17,046 - $22,591
FG-1 Information about Locality Pay
Information about COLA
Information about Citizenship Who May Apply : All Sources We are not accepting applications from non-citizens.Job Status : Full TimeAppointment Duration : Temporary NTE - 13 months
 
The Failed Aviation Administration is trying to hire back retired controllers and pay them 24k. They took pay from the new hires and now trying to pay the retirees money so they can come back. Leaves no incentive for new hires to deal with the Bull and training and rear kicking you get during training. Just my 02[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]¢. F U F A A
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What are your options if you are interested in working at one or two facilities and are applying off the street? If qualified, do you have the option of bypassing the assignment until a position opens up at your desired facility?
 

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