Pinnacle Street Captains?

[BoDEAN]

I hear Pinnacle is looking for street captains. is this true?


Would this be a wise move for a 2 yr FO at an airline with upgrades at 5+ years? I don't see this as a lateral move, and I see a lot of majors want turbine PIC time, and this would be a pay raise, and a good way to get it. Try not to flame the thread.

 

[McNugent]

Doesn't look that great of a deal to me. http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=104789

 

[arthompson]

Dude if you want to be a Street CA. I would suggest XJ or Big Sky.

 

[BoDEAN]

Thanks

 

[norskman2]

There are several threads on this both here and on airlinepilotforums.com

There are many issues involved here:

- Street Caps have to I believe go through OE as FOs and then bid cap
- Horrible reserve for new captains
- Contract negotiations

among others.

Choose wisely Young Skywalker.

 

[Flyer1015]

- Street Caps have to I believe go through OE as FOs and then bid cap

As of right now, 100 hrs on the line as an F/O (OE counts towards the 100).

 

[arthompson]

the bid can happen in NH, but yeah 100 on line as an FO to get you familier with PCL and then to the left seat. Believe me go somewhere that will appreciate you.

 

[Quack]

I wouldn't do it...the grass is definitely not greener over there. it's a shade of light brown that's getting drier everyday. if you do make it through upgrade (not saying you won't), being on the bottom list at pncl is about the last place that you want to be as a cpt. not that rsv is good anywhere, but there is MISERABLE!!! coming from a different airline, let me repeat MISERABLE!!!! plus they lowered upgrade times to 2000 total. if you live in base, maybe, but other than that NO WAY!!! Go to XJ before pncl.

 

[PCL_128]

Would this be a wise move for a 2 yr FO at an airline with upgrades at 5+ years?

No. Go to Mesaba. They're hiring street Captains. Much better company, better contract, and even a flow-through with NWA should you decide to stick around for your number to come up. Pinnacle is a bottomless pit of misery, and that's not hyperbole.

 

[arthompson]

PCL.....wouldn't the description you give be a step up?

 

[PCL_128]

PCL.....wouldn't the description you give be a step up?

Hey, I don't want to sound too cynical.

 

[PinnacleDude]

Just don't do it. I just flew with a guy who had guys in his new hire class trying the off the street captain thing a few months ago. Didn't go so well for those guys.

 

[sinkrate]

Going to PCL for a 'street CA' job does have some considerable career risk. The two big risks are a training failure on your permanent PRIA records and an LOI on your FAA records for some time.

PCL's initial ground schools are not taught by pilots. The ground school instructors run the gammit from ex schedulers to ex mechanics. Once in the procedures trainer and simulator it is normal to have a different instructor every session, and not have any one instructor twice. Most of the instructors have never been line pilots and several of them have no airline flight experience at all. Your initial oral and PC will be with a line qualified CA/Check Airman, and to the standards required by Appendix F of FAR 121.

Everyone in the last new hire class recorded at least one failure on a checking event, some had two failures and a few had three. A single failure in initial new hire generaly won't hurt you when you interview for another job. The last upgrade class had a failure rate of 80% on their intial type rides. Prior to that the rate had been running 30 to 50 percent. A type ride failure takes a lot of explaining in an interview. After all, the interview process at a major is designed to do two things. Find the applicants that will complete training on schedule and be good employees.

Once on the line the 'pilot pushing' by dispatch, maintence, crew scheduling and ramp/gate personnel is legendary. One pilot who had flown at every poor boy 1900 operater I knew refused to upgrade at PCL. He had 3000 PIC in 1900's and the engine failures to go with that time. His astute observation was everytime you sign a release at PCL you put your certificate on the line. He did not need the PIC time and would not take the risk.

If you go to PCL for the fast upgrade and PIC time you better be focused and have your A game on. If you don't you may be at a regional a lot longer than you planned.

 

[Bruno82]

Sooooo, you're saying there is a reason they are hiring street captains... hmmm... what a concept.

 

[DeucesWild]

I hear Pinnacle is looking for street captains. is this true?


Would this be a wise move for a 2 yr FO at an airline with upgrades at 5+ years?

Yes, it might be a good move if your career aspirations require 1000 turbine PIC. The sooner you have those qualifications, the sooner you will be on the seniority list of your choice - or at least able to apply for that dream position. That last part is the kicker. Being qualified to apply and being selected are two different things. You had better be happy with your current job while waiting for the dream job.

I worked at Pinnacle and was happy there - until I landed my dream job. It is what it is - a regional - no better and no worse than the others. Currently no contract - hopefully that will soon change - but plan on the wage and work rules that are in place (and anything more will be a bonus). Go with a good attitude, don't let the vocal minority like those on this board drag you down. Go to work, do what you love, and go home. Being happy is a decision. Plan on reserve at the bottom of the seniority list for a long time.

Training was adequate. If you are average or better, and apply yourself, you will do fine. If you bust, it will be most likely because you deserved to bust. They won't give it to you, but it is not that hard, and obviously you have been through a 121 program and know what it is like.

If I hadn't landed my dream job - I would still be happy at Pinnacle - but working to make it better.

 

[BCpilot81]

I say keep the street Cpt. thing. Chasing upgrade can bite you pretty hard in the A$$. All carriers are different, but last fall at ASA upgrades were 5.5 to 6 yrs. Now it is down to 2.5 3 yrs. Things do boil down. Grass is not always greenerererer on the other side

 

[SaturnPilot]

Going to PCL for a 'street CA' job does have some considerable career risk. The two big risks are a training failure on your permanent PRIA records and an LOI on your FAA records for some time.

PCL's initial ground schools are not taught by pilots. The ground school instructors run the gammit from ex schedulers to ex mechanics. Once in the procedures trainer and simulator it is normal to have a different instructor every session, and not have any one instructor twice. Most of the instructors have never been line pilots and several of them have no airline flight experience at all. Your initial oral and PC will be with a line qualified CA/Check Airman, and to the standards required by Appendix F of FAR 121.

Everyone in the last new hire class recorded at least one failure on a checking event, some had two failures and a few had three. A single failure in initial new hire generaly won't hurt you when you interview for another job. The last upgrade class had a failure rate of 80% on their intial type rides. Prior to that the rate had been running 30 to 50 percent. A type ride failure takes a lot of explaining in an interview. After all, the interview process at a major is designed to do two things. Find the applicants that will complete training on schedule and be good employees.

Once on the line the 'pilot pushing' by dispatch, maintence, crew scheduling and ramp/gate personnel is legendary. One pilot who had flown at every poor boy 1900 operater I knew refused to upgrade at PCL. He had 3000 PIC in 1900's and the engine failures to go with that time. His astute observation was everytime you sign a release at PCL you put your certificate on the line. He did not need the PIC time and would not take the risk.

If you go to PCL for the fast upgrade and PIC time you better be focused and have your A game on. If you don't you may be at a regional a lot longer than you planned.

This is one of the most accurate posts I have seen in a long time...spot on.

It is what it is - a regional - no better and no worse than the others.

not true...better regionals: Expressjet, Mesaba, Horizon, CHQ, etc...

Training was adequate. If you are average or better, and apply yourself, you will do fine. If you bust, it will be most likely because you deserved to bust. They won't give it to you, but it is not that hard, and obviously you have been through a 121 program and know what it is like.

This may have been the case when you were here. The training here improved after 3701, but now that that accident is no longer in the spotlight, things here have regressed tremendously. If you want to come to PCL, be prepared to explain on a future interview some type of failure of a 121 event.

 

[Flyer1015]

interview some type of failure of a 121 event.

Got a question for ya'll Pinnacle folks. [No, I haven't had a TTP, but I'm wondering]:

Is a Train-To-Proficiency during initial CRJ SIC type ride considered a failure? As in, will this show up on your PRIA report?

 

[PCL_128]

Your PRIA report shouldn't show it, because your PRIA summary sheet that Pinnacle sends to future employers only shows pass/fail. A TTP is still considered a pass. However, if you leave for another airline, many majors require you to bring copies of your last several PC/PT forms. I had to bring the last three for my AirTran interview. Any TTPs from those will be listed on the PC form.