Northern Airlines - Syracuse, N.Y.

[piperpilot2001]

There is talk of a new airline starting up in Syracuse, N.Y. I heard on the news that they will be flying heavy metal to over 30 cities. It also said that they expect to begin operations by April of 2003. I think that they are trying to model Jet Blue or SWA it sounds like.

This was on the news. I don't know what the real facts are but I think that it is something to be on the look out for if you're job hunting. Just a little FYI.

 

[Humblepilot]

Something in the water?

What is it about Syracuse? Now after months and months and months of Legacy not getting off the ground, we have another dreamer on the field?

I guess people see what things use to be like when Piedmont had a small hub there and they see potential. But with times being tough in the industry, who really is going to invest the kind of capital it takes to start up an airline successfully.


Humble

 

[eaglefly]

I believe this outfit has been trying to get under way for several years now. WAY too much capacity out there as it is. Even low-fare carriers. If they do finally start up they'll most likely belly-flop within a year.

 

[piperpilot2001]

Not really a dreamer

I don't really see myself as a dreamer. Frankly, I doubt you'll ever see it fly. You never know though. I am always amazed. I am not from SYR, but I do ocassionaly fly into or out of there, commercial, and I am always amazed to see how full the planes are leaving there. I have gone SYR to ORD two times this year and both times were packed full. On the other hand, the other night I flew in with a guy from SYR from a yankee game to drop him off. They had me 3rd in line and the guy turned to me and said " wow, this is pretty busy". All of upstate NY is stagnant. Lets cheer them on.....they neen something like this. Besides that, every time I buy a ticket out of there, I get skined knees and a sore ass if you know what I mean. The big carriers prison rape you on a ticket out of SYR....except for Jet Blue....they are great!

 

[LearLove]

What I've herd.....

being based in syr I got some info on both Northern and Legacy.

Legacy - about a month ago (middle of aug) the local news tried to track them down. They found nothing at the syr airport and then went to their HQ in Rome by Utica. The office was shut lights off with a pile of mail about a foot high inside the glass door. Rumor has it from an old Empire Airline guy I know is that the CEO split town w/ the cash. I haven't seen any Legacy painted a/c at utica, Rome (old Griff AFB) or SYR.


Northern - The news had these guys on about a week ago saying that they got 1 million from the state or something and they have another year to get like 30 mil to start. They showed plans with 717 and such. These guys (from what I've been told by an old Saturn pilot who does mx in these parts) are left over from Mohawk (a once very fine airline destroyed by U and their pilots) management and have been at this for a few years now. Its kind of like their pet project.

 

[piperpilot2001]

So you're based in SYR??

I also heard on the news that AA and UAL are pulling the big stuff out of there. They are just going to fly the reg.jets and Beech 1900's and such out of there. Are you getting moved out? The airlines are really putting the screws to the small towns, not just Syracuse. They are pulling out the jets and ending direct flights to other cities. Everyting is connecting through hubs. That would be fine but the majors are so poorly run now that they never make it on time, loose your stuff, etc. I hate flying commercial as a passenger. I hope that some of there smaller discount carrires make it and keep putting the hurt to the majors. If SWA and JB can do such a good job, why can't the rest of them?

 

[wafu39]

Just because the majors are pulling out of a city does not mean they are putting the screws to that city!

If the city can,'t support big aircraft then why should the majors fly there?

As for your STUPID comment, gloating over the troubles at some of the major airlines right now, get over your big jet envy!

The majors are the ones that set salary/work rule standards for the whole aviation industry, and if those standards drop then the domino effect will impact everyone.

 

[Humblepilot]

Re: So you're based in SYR??

[. Everyting is connecting through hubs. That would be fine but the majors are so poorly run now that they never make it on time, loose your stuff, etc. I hate flying commercial as a passenger. I hope that some of there smaller discount carrires make it and keep putting the hurt to the majors. If SWA and JB can do such a good job, why can't the rest of them? [/B]

Piper Pilot,

I guess with all the reading you are doing you haven't look lately at the DOT statistics. I believe for July that on time performance UAL was first and USAIR was number two. If I am wrong someone correct me. But I heard this on Capt Forte's (UAL Chief Pilot's Daily Announcement)

Shrinkage after 9/11 has increased efficiency and the statistics are showing it. Now to the rest of the quality of service. Customers are paying the same price for an advanced purchase weekend ticket (Saturday night stayover) that they paid in the mid 1980s. Check the Cost of Living index for what has happened in 20 years and its increase.

Considering that the price of doing business (labor, fuel et al) has risen since the 1980s how do you think the airlines can stay in business when they are charging these prices. They make cuts in service and you complain.

What do you want? Lots of service or a cheap ticket?

If you don't like it may I suggest you continue to support my brothers and sisters at SWA and JetBlue.

Humble

 

[piperpilot2001]

Arging on the internet

I appreciate all of the comments. I thought for a minute about how to respond to "big jet envy" and some of the other things. Then I remembered something a friend once told me about these message boards. "Arguing on the internet is like running in the special olympics....even if you win, you're still retarded."

Fortunatly I have never had to rely on flying for a living. Yes, I do make money at it, but it is not mu living. I admire those who do it, but it is not for me. I fly because I love it and I have been fortunate enough to pay my way and own a few nice planes. I do fly what I consider to be big jets, granted, not a 320 or 747, but I routinely sit left seat on some pretty nice corp planes, and that is all I want to do. Hell, if it all came to and end and all I could fly was my frineds Waco or 152, that would be fine as well.

And thanks, I will continue to fly JB and SWA. I don't care what the statistics say, most of the majors are run very poorly. Sure the pilots are great and amazing people, but the companies suck. That is the GREAT thing about capitalism....I have a choice!

 

[LearLove]

piperpilot2001,

Yes I'm based in Siberia I mean SYR. Although the wx lately has been awsome, winter is still about 3 weeks off. I't a great time to fly around here everythings deep green and coller temps, a good time to buzz the lakes and valleys (hey jetsnake can I borrow that RV-4?).

As far as I've herd AA will go all RJ with just ORD service No JFK.

Cal does CLE w/ RJ and some EWR but they used the ATR which I haven't seen in a long time (several months) so I guess they replaced it with the RJ. Cal connection (commutair) does alb with a 1900. I've never seen Cal mainline here.

UAL is pulling out according to the news and I guess it will continue ACA rj to IAD and ORD.

As for delta they still have a 727 in here and a Comair RJ to CVG. The 727 goes to ROC then ALT. Flagstop.

Northwest unchanged with the good old Diesel 9 to Detroit that wakes my a$$ up at 6:10 am every weekday when they use rwy28. Thanks also to the delta 727 at 6am.

AS for Usair Mainline does CLT, PHL, and PIT with mostly 737 and sometimes an A320. Allegheny one of the whollyscrewed has all Dash8's and is the largest operator here. We do DCA, PHL, LGA, BDL, and BOS. Trans States scabbed BWI from us with their J41.
I here next month Colgan managed to scab some BDL and BOS flying from us. This is why we are loosing yet another Dash. Down to 45 from 52.

And of course JB to JFK 2 or 3 times a day with the TV A320.

So I see you own a Duke, is been along time since I flew one of those rwy hog's. Just kidding, nice plane.

See yah.

 

[piperpilot2001]

Duke

Yep, I have one of those beasts. I love it. It is one of the most fun planes that I have ever owned. Perfect for short little hope to Boston for dinner then a show in NYC or even blast out to Chicago for some fun up in Wriglyville. I love it. I am in SYR about once a month on business. Personally, I love it up there. Armory Square, that AHL hockey team you have, fun town!! And Super People at that Piedmont hanger! Real great bunch!!

 

[rodeopilot]

As a Siberacuse native, I am also hoping that SWA starts into SYR. The city fits our model, and would draw well from Watertown, Utica, and Binghamton. Rochester could split with BUF and SYR. We usually start a city with 10 flights or so a day. Most to BWI from there, a direct or two to MCO, and a direct to LAS possibly. (considering what ALB and BUF get) Maybe to MDW who knows. Man it would be nice to get to see the folks on a regular basis again. Bundle up kids, the rumor has it that snow will fly before Halloween up there. I would say that SYR would be in the top five cities we are looking at expansion, just by looking at the population and potential. My finners are crossed!(mostly from the frostbite I got up there as a kid riding snowmobiles)

 

[piperpilot2001]

SWA....go go go

I'd love to see you there! A few times in the last year I ended up trying to get last min. flights SYR to Chicago, either MDW or ORD, I don't care. Both times the ticket would have been over $1000. I Flew the Archer to ALB and got to Chi-town on SWA for half that. I love SWA! GREAT COMPANY! Syracuse needs you. I don't live there but I do a lot of biz there. I like that town and I think that SWA could clean up! Good luck!!!

 

[LearLove]

I agree lets just hope they don't start in here before I get on with them. It'll be the end of allegheny in here.

 

[Beechball]

I wish they'd start in here too....it'd make it an easy commute for me. But guys/gals....this airport is charging outrageous amounts for gate rental and other fees. That's why the ticket prices are so high and passengers flock to Rochester even if they are going on Airways. I don't see SWA coming in here anytime soon. JMHO.