New ACMI Agreement Between ABX Air and DHL.

[Mach88]

And for what its worth, the other board is wrong. The 15 year Astar captain rates are $229.03/hour. Pretty juicy for the few guys lucky enough to hold that position.

 

[nitefr8dog]

So ABX continues to fly 13 planes for DHL and DHL gets the concessionary rates (whatever they are). Not a great deal but not too bad either under the circumstances.

Im not trying to stir the pot. Im just curious. Are the ABX pilots happy, unhappy, or apathetic about this?

I am thinking realistic might be a better word. Tough finding a job these days...would I rather have nothing to do with DHL after they bought us, then ruined the Airborne Express business that alot of us spent the major part of our career helping to build yes. But 150K plus benefits are tough to beat. Plus the 767 is a hoot to fly and some great layovers.

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

Those are ABX's old rates. The new concessionary rate (the 12 yr scale) has been bantered about here and on other boards unofficially.

If you're playing stupid, shame on you. If you have been cruising the boards with your eyes closed, then I suggest you make use of the search button.

It's not that big a deal to me, I don't have a dog in ABX's fight. APC is usually pretty accurate, sometimes they're not. I recall seeing something about a $160+/hr rate, didn't know it had been implemented.

Since we're talking about "someone always willing to go lower" what's you're new rate for flying a DC-8 vs your old one? Are you "lowering the bar" or just doing what you need to do to feed your family?

Astar's present $229/hr rate has no bearing on anything this side of MARS. I suspect that within the next few months, Astar management will ask those pilots remaining on the property for deep concessions, to "bring Astar's total crew costs inline with those of our competitors" That's when we'll start to see where "the bar" is really at.

 

[Fly Astar Jets]

Since we're talking about "someone always willing to go lower" what's you're new rate for flying a DC-8 vs your old one? Are you "lowering the bar" or just doing what you need to do to feed your family?

Apples to oranges A$$WIPE. I won't even dignify that question with a proper answer.

Except for one other person who's handle sounds like a children's cereal, I try really hard not to be offensive to anyone on this board. But for you and her, I will gladly make the exception.

You were a leach then and a poser now.

IGNORED

 

[rotor&wing]

FAJ,

Pay no attention to "Whistle britches", aka Jim M.. He will never see the inside of a cockpit of anything ever again, which is a real service to anyone who actually holds a pilot certificate.

Jim isn't aware of the real payscales in the airline industry, but you can rest assured he can tell you what it cost to hang drywall.

 

[DC8CRIVER]

FYI, Astar mgt has not asked for concessions and they have announced that they do not ever plan to do so.

However, our sky brothers in grey (ABX) have not only furloughed, but they have dropped the bar for a price cut at over $80/hour! Congrats for the deepest dive of any existing carrier! You are now almost exactly on par with ATI at $160/hr!

They will say "well we've still got a job and it's worth it - the Astar guys got furloughed" ...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that ABX not only took the massive cuts, but they have more guys on the street than any DHL carrier including Astar.

Way to set the bar and take care of your fellow ABX pilots.

If it were me, I'd be ashamed...

Driver

ps - jim mcmahon, slink back into your bitter hole - you no not of what you speak and it adds nothing of value of accuracy to any of these discussions.

 

[nitefr8dog]

FYI, Astar mgt has not asked for concessions and they have announced that they do not ever plan to do so.

However, our sky brothers in grey (ABX) have not only furloughed, but they have dropped the bar for a price cut at over $80/hour! Congrats for the deepest dive of any existing carrier! You are now almost exactly on par with ATI at $160/hr!

They will say "well we've still got a job and it's worth it - the Astar guys got furloughed" ...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that ABX not only took the massive cuts, but they have more guys on the street than any DHL carrier including Astar.

Way to set the bar and take care of your fellow ABX pilots.

If it were me, I'd be ashamed...

Driver

ps - jim mcmahon, slink back into your bitter hole - you no not of what you speak and it adds nothing of value of accuracy to any of these discussions.

Driver, not even close. Captains at 161k per year, works out to 17% not 35%. Ashamed of 130-145k as an FO? My family likes sleeping inside under a roof, yours might enjoy sleeping in a van by the river...when it gets cold tell them at least we did not take a pay cut! DHL made the decision to dump US flying NOT ABX/Teamsters,...I know this is a tough concept to follow but I will try. Less freight = fewer airframes = fewer pilots. Get the facts before you spout off and sound like a bigger a$$ than you already do.

 

[DC8CRIVER]

nitefr8dog wrote: “Would not have any idea as ASTAR pilots are still using it. Astar is still operating 6-8 DC 8s out of CVG and using "your" crew room.

Actually the Astar and the ABX crewrooms at CVG were one room when Astar moved there in 2003 so you ARE in what was about half of our old room.

nitefr8dog wrote: “( I guess I could have said how do you like using our runway when ASTAR was operating out of KILN but that would have been a little childish)!”

Childish, yes. But, truth be known, we never did like the potholed runway, the thieving sort crews, or the ignorant welcome you all gave us there.

nitefr8dog wrote: “ Truth be told there is not much any of "us" like about the operation in CVG, small, no room for any expansion, poor design, late every nite do to a totally dicked up loading system...”

OK. I’ll assume you meant “due to” not “do to” ... but I digress - the sort is plenty big enough for the operation there today. There were substantially more packages being sorted prior to the move up to pigtown. There is a master plan agreed to by DHL and the CVG airport authority to expand both the sort building and the ramp to (approximately) double the size of both. The tilt tray sort system was designed and installed by Siemens and is still state-of-the-art today (not quite like the "state-of-the-art crush-it, lose-it, steal-it tractor powered hand sort system you had up in pigtown). It is the baboons that DHL trucks down from pigtown that have no idea about how to operate it and the “totally dicked up loading system” of A containers - the global standard for freight - is a far better, lighter, and more common system than the porta-lets that you all - for some God-only-knows reason - think are slicker than tobacco spit.


nitefr8dog wrote: “ Captains at 161k per year, works out to 17% not 35%. Ashamed of 130-145k as an FO? My family likes sleeping inside under a roof, yours might enjoy sleeping in a van by the river...when it gets cold tell them at least we did not take a pay cut! DHL made the decision to dump US flying NOT ABX/Teamsters,...”

For some reason, the ABX kids seem reluctant to publish their new pay scales and work rules so facts are hard to come by. There is a “Summary of Company Proposal 9/1/09” floating around out there somewhere which is where we have been getting our numbers, so enlighten us with the official pay scales you all dropped down to and post it for all to see. The numbers from your company show FO’s making $112,000 not $145,000.

Also, thanks for your concern, but we’re not in the van by the river. Furloughed AStar pilots are still getting paid for the next six months. Not perfect, but better than your junior brothers whose backs you walked over on your way to sleeping inside with your family.

And BTW, it was Teamsters who made the decision to take it up the tailpipe, not ALPA or ASTAR or even DHL. Enjoy your new German husband. He may not be smart, but he knows how to make you do what he wants.

8

 

[nitefr8dog]

nitefr8dog wrote: “Would not have any idea as ASTAR pilots are still using it. Astar is still operating 6-8 DC 8s out of CVG and using "your" crew room.

Actually the Astar and the ABX crewrooms at CVG were one room when Astar moved there in 2003 so you ARE in what was about half of our old room.

nitefr8dog wrote: “( I guess I could have said how do you like using our runway when ASTAR was operating out of KILN but that would have been a little childish)!”

Childish, yes. But, truth be known, we never did like the potholed runway, the thieving sort crews, or the ignorant welcome you all gave us there.

nitefr8dog wrote: “ Truth be told there is not much any of "us" like about the operation in CVG, small, no room for any expansion, poor design, late every nite do to a totally dicked up loading system...”

OK. I’ll assume you meant “due to” not “do to” ... but I digress - the sort is plenty big enough for the operation there today. There were substantially more packages being sorted prior to the move up to pigtown. There is a master plan agreed to by DHL and the CVG airport authority to expand both the sort building and the ramp to (approximately) double the size of both. The tilt tray sort system was designed and installed by Siemens and is still state-of-the-art today (not quite like the "state-of-the-art crush-it, lose-it, steal-it tractor powered hand sort system you had up in pigtown). It is the baboons that DHL trucks down from pigtown that have no idea about how to operate it and the “totally dicked up loading system” of A containers - the global standard for freight - is a far better, lighter, and more common system than the porta-lets that you all - for some God-only-knows reason - think are slicker than tobacco spit.


nitefr8dog wrote: “ Captains at 161k per year, works out to 17% not 35%. Ashamed of 130-145k as an FO? My family likes sleeping inside under a roof, yours might enjoy sleeping in a van by the river...when it gets cold tell them at least we did not take a pay cut! DHL made the decision to dump US flying NOT ABX/Teamsters,...”

For some reason, the ABX kids seem reluctant to publish their new pay scales and work rules so facts are hard to come by. There is a “Summary of Company Proposal 9/1/09” floating around out there somewhere which is where we have been getting our numbers, so enlighten us with the official pay scales you all dropped down to and post it for all to see. The numbers from your company show FO’s making $112,000 not $145,000.

Also, thanks for your concern, but we’re not in the van by the river. Furloughed AStar pilots are still getting paid for the next six months. Not perfect, but better than your junior brothers whose backs you walked over on your way to sleeping inside with your family.

And BTW, it was Teamsters who made the decision to take it up the tailpipe, not ALPA or ASTAR or even DHL. Enjoy your new German husband. He may not be smart, but he knows how to make you do what he wants.

8

I guess you meant "crew rooms" not "crewrooms".... but I digress-it is still too small at twice its size. Late because of Saber which is ridiculous if any change pops up you have to Control Central print new paper work!....you guessed it.... DELAY. And this state of the art loading system is only used by who.... again you guessed it. DHL/ASTAR. (I am talking about Saber not A containers, you would think ASTAR invented A containers WTFO).

As far as pay goes Captains pay is 161K...FO pay is 113K. I said making 130K to 145K as an FO was not something I was ashamed of. (now follow along , I will go slow) My base is 113K with International override and lines with more than 65 hours pay guaranty and credit for deadheads etc, I will actually be on the north side of 145K.

Anyway you package it and try to sell it, you signed the deal and got screwed! The old saying if it sounds to good to be true it probably is just never goes out of style.

 

[Clipperskip]

My base is 113K with International override and lines with more than 65 hours pay guaranty and credit for deadheads etc, I will actually be on the north side of 145K.


Slight error...Try 68 hours gaurantee per month now not 65. We gave that away too!