Need help "ASA specific"

[PooPooPants]

Question: Just had a four day trip taken away for ROE. I understand I'm basically on call with a twelve hour call-out. Is that on call period hand in hand with the original footprint for each day, example: (tuesday duty in at 6am-2pm. Is that my reserve window with a twelve hour call-out) And more importantly, am I required to call back within 15 minutes of their call? I am not on reserve, I am a regular line holder who just got my trip taken away for training. I can't find this anywhere in our contract.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

Yes, it's day for day referencing the original duty times of your trip. You are required to call back within a reasonable time period, which in the past has been considered one hour.

 

[PooPooPants]

So say on tuesday my original duty day was from 6am-2pm. They have to call me within that timeframe. But with the twelve hour call out, can they make me fly if it's outside that window (later that night) or would they basically call me on tuesday to fly for wed, thurs or friday?

 

[sweptback]

They could call you at 6am and have you report for a 6pm show. Of course the report time would be 12 hours from when you talked to a scheduler, not from when they left you a message.

 

[PooPooPants]

That sounds a little too long. It's been awhile since I've been on reserve but that would make for a long ass duty day (unless they called at 6pm for just one leg) I thought it was great to have the trip taken away and to get paid for it...but now I'm not so sure.

 

[socrates1]

It's not too long. If they called at 1800, like you said above, don't respond. You are only on call from 0600 -1400. If they call at 0601 you must respond (within a "reasonable amount of time"). What they will do is put you at rest for the next 12 hours. You were on call from 0600 - 1400. At 0600 you start your 14 hr duty period. They will put you at rest, but you are not required to show up for work until 12 hrs after you speak with a scheduler. After that, they can schedule you to work until the time you were to duty out at the end of the four day. I have never been called in to work after the trip has be ROE. You will not find an answer in the contract. It is a side letter. Reference the side letters on ALPA or OURASA. Hope that helps.

 

[TOOL CRIB]

Don't forget LOA 28. It specifically prohibits that. You must be given a trip within your originally scheduled trip duty period + 90 min on either side. So your first 6am-2pm day, you virtually have off. You just have to answer the phone, but they can't give you anything until the next day. If your next day's duty period was 9am to 3pm, they can make you be on duty from 7:30am to 4:30pm.

 

[TOOL CRIB]

You were on call from 0600 - 1400. At 0600 you start your 14 hr duty period.

Nope, reserve is not duty time nor is it rest. You are merely available for assignment. When you duty in is when you start duty time. Reserves have to be vigilant making sure they have at least 8 hrs rest in the last 24 hours.

 

[socrates1]

I agree it's not duty time. I might have worded that wrong. But, if he is on call at 0600, he can't be scheduled to work past 2000. That's his 14 hour "duty time." Maybe "duty" is the wrong word, but he is not at "rest" after 0600. Do you agree?

 

[socrates1]

Tool Crib

I don't have LOA28 in front of me, but I don't think it's + or - 90 mins of your duty period. I believe it's + or - 90 mins of the foot print of your original trip. If he was to work from Tue-Fri, they can reschedule him to work up to 90 min's after he was to finish Fri. What they reschedule him to do from 12 hours after they establish contact until 90 mins after his original foot print is open game.

 

[socrates1]

Anyway, I don't post here very often. I finished a four day late tonight. I just finished my post flight Jack and Coke. I probably won't look up LOA 28. I thought I might try and help a fellow pilot with ROE. Good night.

 

[701EV]

Call Pete Davis on the scheduling hotline that is why we have it. So you don't get 5 different inturpitations and then guessing which one is correct.

701EV

 

[AV8700]

Don't forget LOA 28. It specifically prohibits that. You must be given a trip within your originally scheduled trip duty period + 90 min on either side. So your first 6am-2pm day, you virtually have off. You just have to answer the phone, but they can't give you anything until the next day. If your next day's duty period was 9am to 3pm, they can make you be on duty from 7:30am to 4:30pm.

This sounds about right. But as posted above I'd call PD on the hotline. I know LOA 28 makes it very hard for them to use you.

 

[PooPooPants]

Soc, this helps greatly and I appreciate the help, hopefully I don't get called at all. And TC, I looked up LOA 28 and found exactly what you were talking about, it sounds too good to be true but I will give Pete a call, thanks for all the help!

 

[Leroy Smith]

This may become more of an issue when the IPs start bidding normal lines. There will be some FO's with big chunks of their month taken.

 

[sweptback]

This may become more of an issue when the IPs start bidding normal lines. There will be some FO's with big chunks of their month taken.

If you're talking about the new contract, then there's a whole different set of procedures for when trips are taken for training.

 

[SiuDude]

I agree it's not duty time. I might have worded that wrong. But, if he is on call at 0600, he can't be scheduled to work past 2000. That's his 14 hour "duty time." Maybe "duty" is the wrong word, but he is not at "rest" after 0600. Do you agree?

Nope, in this case they can work you until 2200 (16 hours) because your duty time does not start until you check-in.

 

[legalalien]

Tool Crib

I don't have LOA28 in front of me, but I don't think it's + or - 90 mins of your duty period. I believe it's + or - 90 mins of the foot print of your original trip. If he was to work from Tue-Fri, they can reschedule him to work up to 90 min's after he was to finish Fri. What they reschedule him to do from 12 hours after they establish contact until 90 mins after his original foot print is open game.

Try looking on the ALPA website, the LOA is there, and it says +-90mins of duty period and must be within the original trip footprint (no 90 mins allowance in that).

 

[TOOL CRIB]

Try looking on the ALPA website, the LOA is there, and it says +-90mins of duty period and must be within the original trip footprint (no 90 mins allowance in that).

Alright I get it now. They can't make you duty in in ATL on the first day earlier than your original duty in time, nor can you be extended past your final duty out time on the last day. It's the duty out/duty in times at the overnights that can be changed +/- 90 minutes.

Here's that part of the LOA28: (by the way it has a typo on the asacontract.com website)

In the event that a regular or relief pilot has been displaced in accordance with Section 13.0., the following language shall replace the existing language in Section 13.J.3., for regular or relief pilots who have been displaced:

1. any subsequent trip or flight assignment shall be scheduled or rescheduled to remain within the original trip hour period;
2. all report times within the trip hour period shall not be scheduled or rescheduled more than ninety (90) minutes prior to the original report time(s);
3. all release times within the trip hour period shall not be scheduled or rescheduled more than ninety (90) minutes after the original release time(s);
4. the Company shall not require a pilot to report for duty unless for the purpose of a specific flight assignment.