Need advice: Relocate?

[Typhoon1244]

I'm based in DFW, and we live on the Ft. Worth side of the metroplex. Every year, we get a friendly little note from the county outlining our property tax burden: slightly over $6,000.

Now I'm not going to go into detail about our household income, so let's just say that six-grand is something we can't afford anymore. (This was our first house, and we weren't very smart!)

In my ancestral home in central-east Tennessee, we can get the same house on more land for about 65% what we paid for our current residence...and the annual property taxes are in the $800-$1,000 range. Plus you have the Smoky Mountains for entertainment. And it's cooler, for Chrissake!

The downsides are (a) uprooting my wife and kids (age 1.5 and 0.4) from their friends, (b) being based in Atlanta* with it's infamous ramp, and (c) commuting from TYS to ATL. (NOTE: It's not a real bad commute. Eight flights a day, and if necessary the drive is about 3.5 hours.)

So we can stay in Texas and live like paupers, or we can heard for the hills and maintain a little better quality of life.

Now believe it or not, this is a decision my wife and I have to make, but I'd love to hear y'all's ideas about this, if any. Does anyone who's lived in either or both places have any thoughts?



*Commuting between TYS and DFW would be next to impossible. Trust me.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Now Im no airline guy but my airline buddies say commuting is the PITS!!

One thing to keep in mind...those little ones will be going to school soon, where are the better schools? schools also rule propery values..

also...

You might worry about Juniors bald friend who skips school to sit on the porch and play the banjo all day....

 

[EagleRJ]

You live within the Ft. Worth city limits? What were you thinking?

Come out to the 'burbs. The taxes are lower, schools are better, and if you plan it right, you can live in a more "country" setting and still have easy access to DFW.

I don't know about uprooting the clan and moving to Tennessee. Rural schooling can be kind of hit and miss, and central Tennessee has some of the poorest counties in the nation. I'm sure the cities have more choices, but then you're looking at higher taxes again.

Texas may have high property taxes, but the flip-side is that there's no state income tax. The state has to get its money from somewhere! Moving is always tough, especially for kids, and having a <1 hour drive to work is worth a lot in my book, too.

I don't know if TYS-ATL would necessarily be an easy commute. I don't know how the loads are- if the flights are usually open, that may indicate a future drawdown of the market. Also, ATL can fall apart due to weather just like DFW. They get winter, too!

 

[Typhoon1244]

You live within the Ft. Worth city limits? What were you thinking? Come out to the 'burbs.

We are in the burbs! Keller. $6000...I can only imagine what it'd be like if we lived in the city!

I don't know about uprooting the clan and moving to Tennessee. Rural schooling can be kind of hit and miss, and central Tennessee has some of the poorest counties in the nation. I'm sure the cities have more choices, but then you're looking at higher taxes again.

Sorry if I gave you the wrong idea...I didn't mean central Tennessee. I grew up in Maryville, Blount County. Just ten minutes southeast of the TYS (Knoxville) airport. That's where we're looking. It doesn't have the hustle-bustle of New York or San Fran, but it's not quite Deliverance either!

Texas may have high property taxes, but the flip-side is that there's no state income tax.

Tennessee doesn't have one either...unless I'm very much mistaken. (It's been a while!)

Don't get me wrong...I'm not trying to be argumentative. I need all the Devil's advocate talk I can get. Thanks for the input!

 

[UM#1]

I've lived in Dallas and Knoxville, both are nice but Dallas is hella expensive. I would recommend Knoxville, you have all the nice resevior lakes, the mountains to the south, along with white water rafting (nanahalla sp?), knoxville is growing at a good rate, plus the sports teams (football) are pretty good, Titans and Vols. my vote is TYS.

 

[Flyingtoohigh]

Your kids are pretty young. Since they're both under 2 years of age, I think they will weather a move and separation from their friends better than if they were 5 or 6. Hope that tidbit helps.

Just thinking of the kids... hope your little one's foot is getting better! Did he land with his personal landing gear still tucked up in the wells?

 

[wildbill]

Check your PM

 

[njcapt]

I wouldn't put up with a commute unless the quality of your home life increases by several hundred percent. I commuted for ten years (simple one-leg commutes to vicious three leg ones), and am now finally driving 20 minutes to work. The quality of my life, and golf game, have improved dramatically without the commuting.

Besides the obvious savings from not having a crash pad and an extra airport car (and insurance, home-airport parking charges, excessive crash pad beer consumption, athlete's foot treatments required by grommy crash pad showers etc.) you can't measure the amount of free time you have by living in your crew base. Got an early morning show tomorrow? Better start looking at the weather this morning to see if you should leave a couple of flights early to make sure you don't get jammed up by the obligatory ATL afternoon thunderstorms. Or worse, you have a 10AM show so now you have to decide whether to risk leaving the morning of, or the day before your trip. Better check that weather again. Let's say that because of the weather ASA cancells a flight. That leaves you fighting with a couple of senior Delta guys for the jump seat on the MD-80. Guess who wins that battle? So you decide to drive it. Better pound a ton of coffee before you try and drive home after your trip ends at 2200. You don't want to get groggy when the interstate gets windey up near Chattanooga. Oh yeah, you kids are still going to wake you up at 0600 after only four hours of sleep.

So, I'm obviously on the side of putting up with the high tax rates of Tarrant County and spending more time at home. Remember, high taxes generally result in better quality schools, but the previous comment that the high County rates are just making up for the lack of a State income tax is spot on. Our taxes in the Chicaga area are pretty stiff (DuPage County especially), but they make you cry when you figure we get nicked for three percent of our gross in State income tax. At least we have some of the best public schools in the nation to show for it (not that it directly helps this childless homeowner).

I hope you can arrive at a decision that will benefit your family. Just don't think that by sacrificing your own quality of life you will be doing your family any favors.

 

[FL000]

As an ATL capt. junior to you, I highly recommend you stay rooted in the wonderful state of Texas. I can send you some Chamber of Commerce materials, season Rangers and Cowboys tix, whatever!

In all seriousness, I personally would jump at the chance to live in eastern Tennessee over Texas, especially if I were from there. Best do it now before the kids get old enough to remember their friends. I was uprooted when I was 8, and although it worked out fine in the long run, it wasn't fun at the time.

On a side note, how long do you think it would take you to get over here, I mean bid-wise?

 

[wingnutt]

wow, as one who has lived in both, i cant understand whats to decide. the scenery alone is worth the move. i spent 5 years in Tennessee, and right at 5 years in DFW. if not for my wife making really good money in DFW, i woulda uprooted the family in a heartbeat and run, not walked to Tennessee.

-cooler climate (nuff said)
-lower cost of living (as mentioned)
-lower cost of housing (same to some)
-water water everywhere (only in Tenn is a river called a lake, but then in some places, it a few miles wide) then what DFW calls a lake, Tennesse calls a mud puddle.
-no 3 hour traffic jams (cause some fool in the northbound lane cant resist slowing down to see the yahoo in the southbound lane who rearended a 1971 GMC pickup truck)
-trees galore (i dont know if maybe i got desensitised to the color green from living in DFW, but dam its green out there)

from what i recall, theres quite a few commuter flights outa TYS, dunno how many go to ATL, but thats probably your only real downside.

...if you need help laoding the furniture, lemme know

 

[JJJ]

I would vote for quality of life. If you commute there will be less days home with the wife and kids. Plus there would be crashpad/additional car expenses or a monthly hotel bill to deal with.

I don't know what kinda schedules you would have in ATL. I suppose if you had 18 days off and 4 day trips, commuting wouldn't be as bad.

If I were you, I would try and relocate to another area around DFW (if there are any).

 

[enigma]

We are in the burbs! Keller. $6000...! [/B]

Man, what were you thinking. Keller, home of half of the AA Captains and 3/4 of all their ex-wives. Why not move to a cheaper place in the metromess?

enigma

 

[SDF2BUF2MCO]

If you make any move it will cost you especially if you utilize a real estate agent (5%-7% of sale price) to sell your home. Do The Math. Also have to consider other things such as utilities, water, property taxes, car insurance, etc. For example, when we lived outside Louisville in Southern Indiana our water bill was $100 (due to the taxes, thank you guberment) a month. Yet our utility costs were $200 max and sometimes as low as $125 a month. Not bad for all electric. Property taxes were $1500 a year. Indiana had a 3% wage tax and then Louisville tacked on their 1.5% wage tax.
Like I said try to estimate what all the costs would be. The real estate costs alone, if you go that route, can offset any tax "savings" for a while.
Should try to also attach some monetary value to your time if you decide to commute.
Have to agree about Knoxville area. It is beautiful. Can't believe more people don't live there. Must be all that Orange .

 

[labbats]

Two reasons against:
-$6000 will equal your moving expenses, not to mention setting up a family in a new home comes with hidden expenses.
-Spaghetti Junction in ATL

Two reasons for:
-You'll feel more comfortable being in the environment you grew up in.
-The kids are still young, and it's a better place for them, the flipside is they may want to see you more often than you'll be allowed.

Either chose has pros and cons. Just make sure your wife is 100% on your decision or she may hold it against you a bit. Whatever you choose, best to you and yours.

 

[flywithruss]

DFW

I know I'm biased as a former Metroplex resident, but every day I regret ever leaving and am desperate for the job that would bring me back to the Lone Star State.

One thing you don't mention is the wife's job (if any ... perhaps she's home with the little ones) and how easy/difficult relocation would be for her. Something to consider.

All things being equal, my decision would be to remain in the Metroplex. Shop around in other areas of town for a better deal on property taxes and a little more value for your homeowning dollar. I was a renter in my DFW days so I can't make any suggestions on which burbs would be an improvement over Keller taxes. A friend used to live in The Colony and liked it pretty well; not sure how Denton County would compare to Tarrant tax-wise, but the drive to DFW would be comparable.

I will agree with those that say avoid the commute if you can help it. The time you have with your kids when they're little is something you can never get back. Even the easiest commutes (as it sounds like TYS-ATL would be) can make you want to scream sometimes.

Just my $0.02. Good luck with the decision.

R