My short Delta Connection Academy Experience

[bloodwashed]

So I just completed my commercial and was invited down to tour the the DCA multi-million dollar facility and enroll for the CFI course. I'm not sure which part they considered "multi-million" but it looked just like any other flight school. They took us out to the flight line to show us a couple of their planes... a state-of-the-crap 70's/80's 172 that looked just like any other 172 that you can find at practically any FBO, except in Comair paint. Then they showed us a 2000 model Seminole, which was very nice, with dual Garmin's and all that good stuff.
So after the tour, I met up with my DCA "advisor" who apparently made a mistake of thinking I had my multiengine rating. So now, I had to have a multiengine rating to enroll for the CFI - single course. News to me, I haven't read any written documentation nor was advised that one had to have a multiengine rating prior to starting for the CFI. So I was offered the multiengine rating course, which at the time costed $7,185 and about 20 hours in the Seminole. It was too much for a rating, so I informed the advisor that I'd go to ATP to get it cheaper and then come back. I was given the lecture about why I should get it at Comair and even was sat down to speak with a suit-n-tied marketing manager who told me all about the difference between quality & podunk flight training.
After another refusal I was led out by my advisor who said to give him a call when I was finished with ATP "but I don't think you're going to make it there at ATP." Those were the words that brought me outta the clouds to see that DCA was all about my money. So after those pleasant remarks, I decided to not return to DCA. If little things like this were going to happen, then I know for sure that I was going to meet more like this gentleman down the road and with more financial mishaps. To be honest, I was lured strongly to DCA because of the "guaranteed interview" but you can get all the interviews you want and still not be guaranteed a job.
I ended up getting my multi, and all the flight instructor ratings at ATP and consider it the best flight training I've received so far... and all less than the cost of the multiengine rating alone at DCA. At the time, the CFI-A course at DCA was $7,288, CFI-I $2,372, and MEI $4,801. I know of a whole class at DCA that ended up spending over 19 grande just for the CFI-A course recently, and a few didn't bother getting their CFII and MEI.
I'm not intending to start a flame, but just sharing my short experience. I'm sure there are tons of successful pilots that made it through DCA and to where they wanna be. If it turns out to be a good school for you, then go for it. I just couldn't afford that commitment after being told that I wouldn't make it another school. Besides, it appears that after you're hired with the airlines, it doesn't matter where you got your flight training, just as long as you have the hours/experience, a bachelor's degree in anything, healthy, and a good person.... but don't hold me on that, I'm no where near reaching that point.

 

[labbats]

To be honest, I was lured strongly to DCA because of the "guaranteed interview" but you can get all the interviews you want and still not be guaranteed a job.

glad somebody finally realizes this

 

[OviedoBob]

Bravo, Bloodwashed;
You have seen through the hype.

 

[Vik]

For $20,000 right now, I will guarantee an interview with someone at United Airlines right now. $1000 non-refundable deposit required, and round trip airfare for both of us to fly to Denver.

PM if interested.

So I just completed my commercial and was invited down to tour the the DCA multi-million dollar facility and enroll for the CFI course. I'm not sure which part they considered "multi-million" but it looked just like any other flight school. They took us out to the flight line to show us a couple of their planes... a state-of-the-crap 70's/80's 172 that looked just like any other 172 that you can find at practically any FBO, except in Comair paint. Then they showed us a 2000 model Seminole, which was very nice, with dual Garmin's and all that good stuff.
So after the tour, I met up with my DCA "advisor" who apparently made a mistake of thinking I had my multiengine rating. So now, I had to have a multiengine rating to enroll for the CFI - single course. News to me, I haven't read any written documentation nor was advised that one had to have a multiengine rating prior to starting for the CFI. So I was offered the multiengine rating course, which at the time costed $7,185 and about 20 hours in the Seminole. It was too much for a rating, so I informed the advisor that I'd go to ATP to get it cheaper and then come back. I was given the lecture about why I should get it at Comair and even was sat down to speak with a suit-n-tied marketing manager who told me all about the difference between quality & podunk flight training.
After another refusal I was led out by my advisor who said to give him a call when I was finished with ATP "but I don't think you're going to make it there at ATP." Those were the words that brought me outta the clouds to see that DCA was all about my money. So after those pleasant remarks, I decided to not return to DCA. If little things like this were going to happen, then I know for sure that I was going to meet more like this gentleman down the road and with more financial mishaps. To be honest, I was lured strongly to DCA because of the "guaranteed interview" but you can get all the interviews you want and still not be guaranteed a job.
I ended up getting my multi, and all the flight instructor ratings at ATP and consider it the best flight training I've received so far... and all less than the cost of the multiengine rating alone at DCA. At the time, the CFI-A course at DCA was $7,288, CFI-I $2,372, and MEI $4,801. I know of a whole class at DCA that ended up spending over 19 grande just for the CFI-A course recently, and a few didn't bother getting their CFII and MEI.
I'm not intending to start a flame, but just sharing my short experience. I'm sure there are tons of successful pilots that made it through DCA and to where they wanna be. If it turns out to be a good school for you, then go for it. I just couldn't afford that commitment after being told that I wouldn't make it another school. Besides, it appears that after you're hired with the airlines, it doesn't matter where you got your flight training, just as long as you have the hours/experience, a bachelor's degree in anything, healthy, and a good person.... but don't hold me on that, I'm no where near reaching that point.

 

[Pugh]

Good post blood.

 

[Snakum]

Vik - Will you take a check?



Minh

( )

 

[fizzerpilot23]

Timmmmmmmmmma!!!!!

 

[bobbysamd]

DCA - the instructor interview

Great post, blood. One of the major aviation sophistries is the "guaranteed interview." Somehow, people equate "guarantee" with job. Once you're in the interview, you are all alone. It becomes up to you to get the job - assuming, of course that the interview in question is conducted in good faith and not just to fulfill some promise or obligation.

Your post has prompted me to rerun my story about my CAA interview of several years ago. Once more, I ask that those who've read this story before to please bear with me. I feel it should be repeated in light of the current context.

I interviewed for an instructing job at Comair in 1991. I traveled two-thousand miles on my nickel for this interview. After traveling this distance, my time on the property must have totaled three hours max. Maybe twenty minutes with the Chief Instructor. Not one question that I can recall about my background and experience, instructing philosophy, or safety. Then, I had an hour flight with this older, tired curmudgeon in an older, tired 152. I suspect both were survivors of when the school was known as Airline Aviation Academy.

I remember well how some student was taxiing in with his landing light on. The man I was with saw it and went ballistic. He steps into the taxiway and starts carrying on like crazy. "TURN IT OFF!!!!! TURN IT OFF!!!" I was not impressed. Is that how Comair students are always treated?

I was not hired. Ya know how I found out? By silence. I was never sent a rejection letter or even given a phone call. The Chief Instructor surely knew that I had traveled from Prescott, Arizona to attend the interview because he had my resume. Granted, no one likes to receive rejection letters, but not sending one to me, especially after I had traveled a long distance at great expense, was simply rude, inconsiderate, discourteous and unprofessional.

And that's how CAA (DCA) "impressed" me. I realize fully that things can change in thirteen years, but I doubt much has changed in this regard at Comair. The way I was treated during my interview and thereafter was a complete turn-off to CAA.

Compare it to my interview three months later at FlightSafety. The place truly rolled out the red carpet for me. It put me up in one of its bungalows on campus. My interview did not take three hours but was conducted over a four-day period. It was far more thorough than any airline interview I had attended. First day was several writtens and a sim. Second day was a flight with an assistant chief pilot and an interview with the Center Manager. Nothing the third day, which was Saturday. On Sunday, the Chief Pilot interviewed me and offered me the job. The whole process impressed me.

I don't quite agree with opinions that one interviews a company during a job interview. I understand the point, but, to me, it borders on the arrogant. I am old-school. I am going to a job interview with my hat in my hand, just grateful to be called, asking for a job. My point is a job interview can provide a valuable glimpse into a company's culture - and my CAA interview certainly provided a glimpse of its culture.

 

[pilotman2105]

This thread

This is an excellent thread. Lots of good information to be taken about the whole interview/hiring scam process.

I don't quite agree with opinions that one interviews a company during a job interview. I understand the point, but, to me, it borders on the arrogant. I am old-school. I am going to a job interview with my hat in my hand, just grateful to be called, asking for a job. My point is a job interview can provide a valuable glimpse into a company's culture - and my CAA interview certainly provided a glimpse of its culture.

I would tend to agree with you to a point, bobbysamd. But let's, hypothetically speaking, entertain this idea for a second. What is CAA HAD offered you a job? Would you have taken it, given the way you were treated while you were a visitor there?

In nearly all interviews, applicants are given an inside look at the company culture, like you said. Subconsciously, we ask ourselves if this is a place that we'd like to work. While I can't say whether you would have taken the hypothetical job offer from CAA, I would bet that someone would have turned them down on the basis of "I don't like how they run their business."

The application and interview process is all about information gathering. At no point in the process should an applicant stop gathering information about a company, and that includes AFTER they are hired.

 

[bobbysamd]

Comair offer v. FlightSafety employment

What is CAA HAD offered you a job? Would you have taken it, given the way you were treated while you were a visitor there?

Absolutely not. Although I was coming to them with my hat in my hand I was still a guest. Is the way I was treated any way to treat a guest? Especially a guest who paid his own way two-thousand miles for the interview. I am not complaining about having to pay my way there; that comes with the territory. It was the treatment during and thereafter that I did not like. That is simply not how to treat people.

Subconsciously, we ask ourselves if this is a place that we'd like to work. While I can't say whether you would have taken the hypothetical job offer from CAA, I would bet that someone would have turned them down on the basis of "I don't like how they run their business."

The application and interview process is all about information gathering. At no point in the process should an applicant stop gathering information about a company, and that includes AFTER they are hired.

(emphasis added)

Absolutely. I couldn't agree with you more. My FlightSafety experience supports your point.

While my interview was certainly impressive, my employment experience there certainly was not. I had the same assistant chief pilot who had taken me on my interview flight pull students from me without notice on my days off. I would come to work after submitting a schedule and find that I had no work. When I asked why no phone call, he would say he did not want to bother me on my days off. I had put up with enough. A month after I started at FSI I already was looking for another job.

In fairness, perhaps, this man had been seriously ill with cancer and might not have been entirely rational, but it was indicative of how FSI treated flight instructors in the early '90s.

During my interview, the Chief Pilot had promised a certain salary upon assignment to a foreign airline program. At assignment, my salary did not happen. I was lied to and horsed around about pay several times at FSI, and I was not the only one. The Chief Pilot was instituting an acro and spin program and asked for volunteers to be trained to instruct it. I volunteered and he said he was interested in me teaching it. I checked back with him several times; it went to someone else.

Management's offices were in glass-lined walls with glass doors. It was called "the fishbowl." There were any number of times I would wait outside the Chief Pilot's office to speak with him for, seemingly, hours at a time, and be ignored.

You are entitled to your opinion if you feel the problem is with me. But you can rely on my word that morale at FSI was nonexistent and other instructors could not stand the place. It was like a plantation mentality. I was over forty at the time and knew better about work and proper treatment, as opposed to younger instructors where FSI might have been their first job and did not know better. The atmosphere bordered on the hostile at times. At the very end, when the Chief Pilot announced that instructors who were on salary, such as me, would be put on flight tags (hourly) and their next paychecks would be docked to reflect the pay reduction, the uproar was palpable. One senior instructor walked out without giving notice. I can't say that I blamed him.

I did get another job. Curiously, three months later, the Chief Pilot was ousted. Go figure.

You live and learn. Best advice would be, as a prospective student or prospective employee of any school, is to keep your eyes and ears wide open and always beware.

Important PS, Disclaimer and Epilogue!! FlightSafety offers a great program and great value for the money in terms of name recognition, facilities, equipment and training, one that I recommend highly. I worked with three of the people who now run the place now and they are first-class gentlemen. For these reasons, I am absolutely sure the FSI is a much better place at which to work. It has always offered good health and a 401-K. In addition, aircraft maintenance has always been superb and the place has obtained new Seminoles.