More RJ's more ATC delays?

[Singlecoil]

Does anybody remember the summer of 1999? Horrific ATC delays all over the country due to the saturation of the United States ATC system. No, it wasn't all the UAL pilots slowing down.
Now it seems the industry, meaning the majors, are moving to a strategy of more, smaller planes to cut costs. What do people think will happen in a couple of years when the economy rebounds and the system is maxxed out again? The country doesn't seem to be investing in ATC efficiencies, and the majors are still sticking with the hub and spoke system. Will we see mounting delays and too many small planes in the future?

 

[dkwid]

The #'s are really not that high. Let's not forget there are also large reductions in mainline flying. many of these RJ's are merely replacing them.

My forecast: the RJ boom has happened....only moderate growth and more efficient fleet utilization.

 

[Andy Neill]

Since it is more economical to fly 1 737 than to fly 2 CRJ-200's, I would bet that the market will solve the problem. For any given market, an appropriately sized plane will be used to serve that market. It's true now and will continue to be true in the rebound.

 

[Captain X]

Personally, I kinda like clogging the jet routes at FL370 and MMO of .78M.

 

[ATCER]

You guys make some interesting points... Believe it or not we are back at or above pre 9/11 #'s at many facilities. LGA is as busy as ever... where I work a 24 hour period will see between 8000-9000 A/C on average... I kid you not. It's busy, even the mids have gotten busy again.


The summer of 99' was a whole different animal... I could go on a while about that but a lot had to do with Flow Control (TMU) very bad weather, UAL pilots (a bit) and don't forget that was when LGA had the slots lifted for a short time, scheduled flights outnumbered hourly capacity X2 ! That summer we were in SWAP (Severe Weather Avoidance Plan) what seemed like every day... the wx was extremely bad.

There is a lot of new stuff in the works... URET for centers (helps determine conflicts for shortcuts) ATOPS is coming for oceanic control, NYICC to be built in NY ==> The Center and the Tracon in one building with an entire airspace redesign. Approach controls getting new STARS equipment, Nexrad radar coming to ARTCC DSR displays, new long range radars at locations like BDA.

The next 5-10 years may turn out to be very interesting... or maybe not... we'll have to see. They are selling us on all this equipment... soon we will start to see if the stuff works...

 

[Singlecoil]

The next 5-10 years may turn out to be very interesting... or maybe not... we'll have to see. They are selling us on all this equipment... soon we will start to see if the stuff works...

Thanks, ATCER for shedding some light on those dark rooms of ATC.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Hey ATCER,

You kinda slid by the RJ issue. I respect your opinions, and I'd like to know how you feel about RJ's. Are regional jets really causing you guys as much trouble as the talking heads say they are?

It's my understanding that back in '59, ATC "experts" were screaming about how the new jets (707, DC-8, etc.) were going to bring about the end of the world...but the system adapted. Can't the system adapt to RJ's too?

 

[AVI8V1]

Thanks for the info ATCer, you guys are the $hit! I'll be looking forward to your posts.

 

[ATCER]

Hey ATCER,

You kinda slid by the RJ issue. I respect your opinions, and I'd like to know how you feel about RJ's. Are regional jets really causing you guys as much trouble as the talking heads say they are?

It's my understanding that back in '59, ATC "experts" were screaming about how the new jets (707, DC-8, etc.) were going to bring about the end of the world...but the system adapted. Can't the system adapt to RJ's too?

LOL ... I slid by because I know of no issue... the RJ's don't pose any real problem... at least I haven't seen any. They are fast, climb well, pilots all seem sharp, they have good equip, etc. Some people just don't adapt well to change... there is just as much private jet traffic out there as RJ's ... they (private) are harder to deal with in some ways because of the numerous types of A/C. We treat RJ's as a same basic type of A/C (wake separation, etc.) but an old Lear cannot be handled in the same manner as a GV ...

One thing I forgot to add about airspace... in about a year the US will go to DRVSM (Domestic Reduced Vertical Seperation Minima). Between FL290-FL410 1000' vertical sep. will be used. It is already used over the ocean.


Just FYI ...

 

[AeroDMB]

I really don't think the RJ's are the issue at all. The ATC system is the problem that is lagging and from what ATCer mentioned, it sounds like things are going to pick up.

You could say the same for all these new personal light jets coming out, are they going to saturate airspace? No, not if the ATC system keeps up with the other party's pace.

I would really like know more about what changes are coming from ATC. Any one have any additional info? Any more ATC guys/gals on the boards?