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Mesa doesn't hold short in LAX

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LoveGun

Well-known member
Joined
May 6, 2004
Posts
212
Planes come within 50 feet of colliding at L.A. airport

Jennifer Oldham
Los Angeles Times
Jul. 29, 2006 12:00 AM
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]LOS ANGELES - In what controllers are describing as the closest call they have seen at Los Angeles International Airport in seven years, two small airliners on the ground came within moments of colliding earlier this week.

The pilot of one of the planes, which was taking off, averted disaster by pulling up suddenly - risking a stall - to avoid a regional jet that had just landed and strayed onto its runway. He cleared the aircraft by less than 50 feet, according to initial reports from the control tower.

A system designed to alert controllers to potential collisions was not operating properly at the time.[/FONT]


The incident began about 4 p.m. Wednesday, after America West Flight 6008 from Phoenix landed. Controllers instructed the pilot to leave the runway on a taxiway known as "Mike" and stop short of the inner runway.

Even though the pilot read back the instructions correctly, he drove onto the inner runway and into the path of a departing United Express turboprop Flight 6037, said Laura Brown, a Federal Aviation Administration spokeswoman.

Horrified controllers watched the incident unfold from the control tower.

"Traffic unauthorized crossing downfield!" a controller yelled into the radio to warn the United Express pilot, who told authorities he pulled up early after hearing the transmission.

Brown said the United Express pilot was "past the point where he could have stopped."

It's likely that the close call will be classified by the FAA as a Category A or Category B, the two most serious designations, Brown said. Officials attributed the incident to an error by the America West pilot, who told investigators he "got confused."
 
LoveGun said:
Officials attributed the incident to an error by the America West pilot....

By that reasoning I'm a Delta pilot, and that would mean I've been tremendously underpaid for the past 4 years. Looks like I'm due one heck of a retro check!
 
Sh!t happens. Good job by the Skywest guys for stopping the chain.

Any pilot from any airline can screw the pooch. Be careful out there.
 
pulled up early......our instructors advise against that??????? right?????
 
Flyer1015 said:
It was a premature rotation... ;)

whoop, whoop...pull out.
 
They just closed 25L for 8 months as of yesterday at LAX for construction (they are moving it 55 feet south of the current position). Maybe he thought he was on 25R and just made the right turn?

Bye Bye---General Lee
 
Any one else flying America West Express with a regional jet?
 
xjhawk said:
pulled up early......our instructors advise against that??????? right?????

Sure! We teach our pilots to hit the other aircraft instead because we're at VR - 5 kts! It's not safe to rotate early! Give me a break.

What do you think is a safer decision? Get the aircraft off the ground a little earlier or slam right into the other aircraft at over 100 knots? Skywest crew did a great job averting that disaster!

"Clear left... Clear right"...Words and actions to live by when crossing a runway.
 
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I flew into LAX... 25L... exited at m... got a runway incursion.

It was the captains landing. It was also his first time going to LAX. I warned him the off of 25L that they are not techinclly " highspeed" turns. The hold short is really wierd.

Well after landing, he takes a the "highspeed"... long story short, I tried to come on with the brakes to keep us out of trouble, but there just was not enough time.

25L / R in LAX is a terrable setup. Could happen to anyone, and I'll bet that it happenes about 10-15 times a day at least, and most are probably at night!

x
 
It can happen to anybody. Be careful about throwing stones, even at Mesa... Karma can be a real b#tch.
 
xkuzme1 said:
I flew into LAX... 25L... exited at m... got a runway incursion.

It was the captains landing. It was also his first time going to LAX. I warned him the off of 25L that they are not techinclly " highspeed" turns. The hold short is really wierd.

Well after landing, he takes a the "highspeed"... long story short, I tried to come on with the brakes to keep us out of trouble, but there just was not enough time.

25L / R in LAX is a terrable setup. Could happen to anyone, and I'll bet that it happenes about 10-15 times a day at least, and most are probably at night!

x

You're not kidding. I had to check out the airport diagram to see what you're talkking about, and it is a pretty bad set up.
 
OPECJet said:
You're not kidding. I had to check out the airport diagram to see what you're talkking about, and it is a pretty bad set up.

Even if it is a bad set-up it's not really an excuse for a runway incursion. If you're exiting at a high-speed you should be able to stop short of anything even though the way it is set up gives the impression that there is a paralell taxiway in between the runways. That's what the diagram is for, thats why we brief the runway exit and taxi plan, thats why we read-back all hold short instructions. I'm sorry but even though it's a bad set-up no one should make this mistake. I bet this doesn't happen 15 times a day, I hope there are more professionals out there than that.
 
...

That part of the point dude. It's not a high speed, and it appears to be one. It is angled like a high speed.

Thats all!
 
ummmmm a joke?

SKYW Pilot said:
Sure! We teach our pilots to hit the other aircraft instead because we're at VR - 5 kts! It's not safe to rotate early! Give me a break.

What do you think is a safer decision? Get the aircraft off the ground a little earlier or slam right into the other aircraft at over 100 knots? Skywest crew did a great job averting that disaster!

"Clear left... Clear right"...Words and actions to live by when crossing a runway.


cannot you tell a joke when you see one? jeeze! i will refrain from using joke expressions or sarcasm from now on to make it simple for all of you.....

(another joke! by the way)
 
xkuzme1 said:
That part of the point dude. It's not a high speed, and it appears to be one. It is angled like a high speed.

Thats all!

What is a high speed then? A taxi-way that you can turn-off at a high rate of speed. Something that you can do here if cleared to cross the other runway.
 
Folks are used to high speed taxiways leading onto parallel taxiways, not leading across the parallel runway. LAX is one of the only airports in the world with this setup, and it does pose a safety threat to anyone who overlooks it in their brief. That is all that xkuzme1 is saying, and I agree....its an easy mistake to make.
 
SkyBoy1981 said:
Folks are used to high speed taxiways leading onto parallel taxiways, not leading across the parallel runway. LAX is one of the only airports in the world with this setup,


but anyone flying into LAX should know there is no parallel taxiway and plan accordingly. I brief this on every approach into LAX. The runway/taxiway set up is no excuse.
 

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