Look Who's on the Majors Board.

[Brown Cow]

I love getting upset about the crap which finds it's way on the Majors Board. Please keep junk like Virgin America off of here. This space should be reserved for real airlines with real issues serving real people. Not foreign crap "non-existent" airlines which want to cause more bad issues and plan to serve an ever cheapened public. Branson's show was a total flop which barely lasted the full season. Now he wants to bring a few 320's into our market serving pasty "knock-off" Wonderbread sandwiches and salad-cream and all the other tooth-rotting garbage from across our Ocean. Do not glorify this. Things are tough enough over here. Some people complain about the JetBlue folks. Before you do, have a look at the Easyjet and Ryanair whores. Those airplanes are so stripped down, they make a 1960ish Yak look luxurious.

"Virgin hiring", "what's the pay at Virgin"..................give it a rest.

 

[32LT10]

What is the difference between JBLU and Virgin? Same pig just different color of mud.

 

[shon7]

Get a life.

 

[CaptainMark]

this will be the start of globalizing airlines...boycott virgin

 

[Fins Up]

Go Virgin! Go JetBlue! Go Delta! Go EVERYONE!!!!!!

 

[32LT10]

this will be the start of globalizing airlines...boycott virgin

Why boycott Virgin? It is just a name. If you are going to boycott American companies that are globalizing their brand, then put down the Starbucks and stop shopping at Wal-Mart and Sam's Club. All the imported Chinese products at Walmart and Sam's is sickening. I wonder how those products get to this country? In the cargo areas of large cargo airlines that are squezzing out the competition? I want to make sure I don't contribute to a company that is trying to put a strong arm around the world with its marketing and prescence like your employer is attempting to do. With both the postal contract and global service it appears FDX is morphing into a monster of limited choice by the consumer. It appears FDX has done in air cargo exactly what Branson has tried to do with the airlines but you think that is OK for Fred Smith to do it. (honestly I don't have a problem with Fed Ex but your shortsightedness on the VA issue is the reason I make the point)

Perhaps they have what it takes to turn an upstart into a long term success. However, if you want to limit global branding start by looking at the tail of your own airplane.

 

[sat74]

If you were on the street looking for a job I highly doubt you, or anyone else, would turn down a job offer from Virgin America. We went through this same sort of dribble when JetBlue and National started up. Besides, VA is not a foreign company, but mostly financed with American investors leasing the Virgin name from Branson.

 

[CaptainMark]

It is ok for fred to do it...and he has supplied almost 5000 pilots with hi paying salaries...but are u ok with a foreign airline coming into this country to hire SOME u.s. pilots at peanut wages until they pass laws in congress that allows foreign pilots to operate over here..? that is a lot different that FRED.

 

[Frank Lorenzo]

What's this? Another "upstart?"

I smell low wages!

And Don CAArty is on board too?!

I LOVE IT!

I want in!

 

[Bjammin]

If you have a problem with foreign airlines then you are going to have to get mad at America.

Our airplanes are ALWAYS full coming from Hong Kong and very light going back. As long as Americans don't buy products from within the country foreign cargo airlines are going to flurish. Foreign airlines also have picked up ALOT of furloughs. What's wrong with that? Amercian pilot's families are being fed because of many foreign airlines. You've seen ANC, It's a foreign airline party.
As far as PAX, because Americans have decided to save a buck and not airlines, the compitition for oversees flights isn't there like it used to be. Remember Pan Am, TWA, Eastern, People's Express, Delta, American, and United. We left a gap and Branson will have no problem filling it.

FedEx and UPS are going very strong, you have absoululy nothing to be grumpy about.

 

[Bjammin]

.but are u ok with a foreign airline coming into this country to hire SOME u.s. pilots at peanut wages until they pass laws in congress that allows foreign pilots to operate over here..

Peanut wages? I make more then any 1st year I know. Cathay has hired more Americans in the past years then Dal, United, and American combined. Do you think the bunch of TWA guys that have been hired by Cathay should say, "No thanks. I'd rather work at Home Depot because your foreign."

 

[FlyAuburn]

What is the difference between JBLU and Virgin? Same pig just different color of mud.

Relax buddy. Take a deep breath, go take a walk, or even have a beer.
Have a great day.
Yours truly,
"Blue Pig"

 

[CaptainMark]

i didn'y realize cathay flies all across the u.s. totally different..point to point is one thing...flying inter-america is another...not the same thing..

 

[RedDogC130]

.....

 

[Fins Up]

Upon further consideration, this thread is STUPID. Goodbye.

 

[CaptainMark]

If real airlines are like AA Delta NWA USAIR UNITED, then I dont want to be a real airline pilot. I want to work for a fake airline that makes real money being a fake airline pilot. Come on.

unfortunately there are no real airlines making real wages anymore..pilot salaries have dwindled to nyc trashman wages...and they make over 100 grand...my salary is viewed as high nowadays and that is sad...flying tigers pilots were making way more in the 70's and 80's..our salaries our now based on the cost to replace us...there are hundreds of guys who would take my seat for half pay...or no pay...just a fact...guys bitch and complain about low salaries but then sign up for them...and i know we have to feed our families and all..but the point is it will get worse with foreign carriers over here using foreign pilots...just an opinion that's all

 

[Purpledog]

unfortunately there are no real airlines making real wages anymore..pilot salaries have dwindled to nyc trashman wages...and they make over 100 grand...my salary is viewed as high nowadays and that is sad...flying tigers pilots were making way more in the 70's and 80's..our salaries our now based on the cost to replace us...there are hundreds of guys who would take my seat for half pay...or no pay...just a fact...guys bitch and complain about low salaries but then sign up for them...and i know we have to feed our families and all..but the point is it will get worse with foreign carriers over here using foreign pilots...just an opinion that's all

Very true. We are our own worst enemies.

 

[Bringupthebird]

What is the motivation for someone, from whatever country, to start an airline here or elsewhere? Are airlines around the world supremely profitable because they pay significantly lower wages? Warren Buffet and Donald Trump couldn't run away from the airline business fast enough. How many real money men are leaving the biotech, energy and financial services worlds to go to the airport in search of riches? I mean look at the awesome Southwest and see how little they make for the amount of capital they have tied up.

No folks it's cash pure and simple. The airline loses millions, but if you can make a penny off each bag of peanuts your company sells the airline or you can skim a little off in a regional airline feed, you still rake in the dough while the airline employees begrudgingly agree to salary cuts with the naive hope that someday things will be different.

 

[AA717driver]

Sat74 is right. I dare ANY one of us here to turn down a job at JB or VA or any other LCC (or even a "dirtbag" charter outfit) when they are on the street after being at a "major" for 10-15 years.

If YOU haven't been there, you aren't qualified to comment.TC

P.S.--Bjammin has the best gig out there right now.

 

[32LT10]

It is ok for fred to do it...and he has supplied almost 5000 pilots with hi paying salaries...but are u ok with a foreign airline coming into this country to hire SOME u.s. pilots at peanut wages until they pass laws in congress that allows foreign pilots to operate over here..? that is a lot different that FRED.

Mark,

Your shortsightedness is expected. Have you been following cargo cabotage? Once Fred is able to get his freight moved at a lower cost by a code share partner or other means he will. You say scope and other restrictions will keep you in the lead. Fred will negotiate with you as long as you are willing to throw each other under the bus. Once you get some solidarity and put the brakes on a group of 5000 individuals you might have some leverage. However, it is my opinion that Fred will be looking to outsource as much flying as possible. Ever wonder why there is no 727 replacement on the slate or order book? That will be the first to go. I am willing to put money on it. Someone will be willing to sell scope for wages and once that happens the tent will come down.

As for Virgin. It is a US company using the Virgin name. The pilots at Virgin will be certified by the FAA just like you. In fact you could perhaps take some time off from the Klan meeting to go pass muster on the new pilots. Make sure they are just the right color for your liking.

Get over yourself. Cabotage was first approved at the cargo level. We will most likely see it in the pax sector sooner or later. Those that are willing to adjust may survive. However, you might have to drop some prejudices to do so.

To further discuss the issues you brought up. Should the foreign carriers fire all of the US citizens they might employ? Cathay for one has hired significant numbers of US pilots, not to mention Jalways and others. Many of these are furloughed from US carriers. Should all these guys look for a different line of work because YOU don't like it?

 

[32LT10]

.and i know we have to feed our families and all..but the point is it will get worse with foreign carriers over here using foreign pilots...just an opinion that's all

Amazing!! It has not happened yet in the pax ranks. Cargo cabotage is already approved so you might see it in your neck of the woods real soon.

You complain about your wages as compared to the Tigers wages. Who's fault is that? How solid is your pilot group? How many times have you guys been in and out of ALPA. How many of your pilots are willing to hold the line and fly only their schedule? You want a contract? Don't blame everyone else. That sort of thing has to be done at home and from the sound of the post I read here your group is very fractured.

 

[Bjammin]

I fly more in the states then I do oversees. The cargo goes from JFK, LAX, or ATL. Then through ORD, SFO or YVR, and DFW then all through ANC when another crew takes it accross to HKG. Then the reverse for cargo coming from HKG. You can have months where you just fly around North America. It helps the american economy in 2 ways.

1. By making goods cheeper for average americans and forcing american companies to compete.

2. By employing hundreds of ramp monkeys, pilots, and maintenece workers.

If there ever is a shortage of pilots again US airlines are going to have to offer competitive wages and schedules to compete with the expanding foreign airlines.

I'm convienced there will be a turnaround some day. Luckly Boeing/Airbus have not been making single pilot airliners. Alot of pilots are getting out of flying and doing other things while at the same time more cargo and PAX are getting airborne. How can there not be a turnaround? The best way to speed up the process is keep discouraging people from pursueing aviaiton.

 

[FN FAL]

Cargo cabotage is already approved so you might see it in your neck of the woods real soon.

Yea, I'd love to see some zipper head buying the farm in a Caravan on a dark night during the Great Lakes winters. I'd buy that for a dollar.

 

[CaptainMark]

i don't disagree totally with all of you..fred tried to use other airlines during self-help a few years ago..it did not work..the "cheaper" cargo carriers were not reliable and the customers complained..fedex aircraft were back the next day..many aircraft missed and went to alternates due to the fact they were not cat2 or 3..they also broke and had no relief...many japanese customers told fred they were paying fedex prices and want fedex pilots and fedex aircraft...so i don't buy cheaper airlines flying our freight around the world.. but there are some boxes on other airlines where the markets are soft..it does not justify our size aircraft until the load reaches a certain point...we still want that freight in our system....and i do not disagree with your points about wages and salaries..but it is true...just a fact...not blaming anybody..it is just the nature of the industry at this point..i hope it all changes..i am the first one to defend this profession and say we all deserve more for our services..i am not bashing anyone..and 32lt10...who's blaming anyone..do you disagree that a line would form if fedex offered jobs at half pay..or swa..or ups...i hope it all changes..and yes fdx pilots are at fault for the back and forth with alpa but we achieved a good 1st contract ...i'm done sorry about no paragraphs

 

[CKJET]

unfortunately there are no real airlines making real wages anymore..pilot salaries have dwindled to nyc trashman wages...and they make over 100 grand...my salary is viewed as high nowadays and that is sad...flying tigers pilots were making way more in the 70's and 80's..our salaries our now based on the cost to replace us...there are hundreds of guys who would take my seat for half pay...or no pay...just a fact...guys bitch and complain about low salaries but then sign up for them...and i know we have to feed our families and all..but the point is it will get worse with foreign carriers over here using foreign pilots...just an opinion that's all

Your salery is high!! But let me ask you this what are we supposed to do?
One second I think I have the job that will take to my golden years, the next second I look around and I am way junior and layed off! I've been laid off for four years now! What are guys going to do work at Burger King? This is all I know how to do and all I want to do. I make decent money if I decide to fly my ass off... What would you do if you somehow found yourself in a position like this? Pilot salaries fall because pilots really have no choice right now. Delta for example they could say enough is enough and I would have a great deal of respect and thanks to them if they do, but if they do they will put the company out of biz. We are screwed anyway you look at it.

Maybe if we all stuck together instead of blaming Southwest, Jet Blue, Air tran for all our problems we could make progress. Just my two cents.

 

[Resocha]

This space should be reserved for real airlines with real issues serving real people.

My, what a lovely HUGE head you have. That noggin's so inflated you'll float away if you're not careful.

 

[climbhappy]

quote:" the ever cheapened public" by BROKEBACKBROWNSUIT!


Brokebutt:

I amazed at your inept, flat out ignorant commnet. I ask you this.

Do you ever look for a deal?
Do you like buying crap at full price?
Do you shop at exclusive men'e shops and buy $1000 suits?
Do you drive a Ferrarri?

Are you prone to eat steak every night.

Why is it a sin to want a low priced airline ticket?

The goal of any business is to figure out what the publice will buy, build it, or serve it, make a profit, then go home and kiss the wife.

I think your company has alot of overpaid Browntruck driving, brownsuit wearing terdnippers

BY the way, your company slogan sux! couldn't even copy FedEx half A$$.

"syncronizing the world of commerce" yeah right!

Try this one! " Delivering Boxes and Other Crap" that would look good on the planes.

 

[Purpledog]

Your salery is high!!

Four years ago our salary was not considered high. Nor was SWA or UPS. We are all high by default, not even cost of living increases or raises that outpace inflation. The reality is that things get more expensive as time goes on, including pilots. I know that is tough to grasp (<-sarcasm). Hell I wish I could pay '98 prices for gas, or my house, or my car, or my.......................

 

[CaptainMark]

Your salery is high!! But let me ask you this what are we supposed to do?
One second I think I have the job that will take to my golden years, the next second I look around and I am way junior and layed off! I've been laid off for four years now! What are guys going to do work at Burger King? This is all I know how to do and all I want to do. I make decent money if I decide to fly my ass off... What would you do if you somehow found yourself in a position like this? Pilot salaries fall because pilots really have no choice right now. Delta for example they could say enough is enough and I would have a great deal of respect and thanks to them if they do, but if they do they will put the company out of biz. We are screwed anyway you look at it.

Maybe if we all stuck together instead of blaming Southwest, Jet Blue, Air tran for all our problems we could make progress. Just my two cents.

are you reading what i wrote..read it again..not blaming..it is just the state of the industry...like i said our salaries are based on our replacability..and i also said our salaries are considered hi..which is a joke...see flying tigers comment...

 

[Brown Cow]

My, what a lovely HUGE head you have. That noggin's so inflated you'll float away if you're not careful.

You are the one who lives on an island flying for that Rosacea airline. I thought rosacea was only a disease that women dealt with.