Logging SIC time......

[English]

JohnnyP,


Are you being asked to fly right seat part 91 or 135? Does the PIC have a CE525 or CE525s type rating? (Big difference). If he/she has a CE525 type rating, then you are a required crew member (if part 91), and you can log the time legally. If he/she has a CE525s type rating, there are still some circumstances where you can be a legal SIC. In all cases, for part 135 flights, you'd need to do a 135 checkride.

I can help you better with more info.

 

[nosehair]

Two logbooks: Simple answer. Don't log this time in your official logbook, but keep a seperate logbook to log this aeronautical experience. It is valuable experience, and *may* make a difference in an interview. At least it will show you know the regulations concerning logbooks.

Write a statement in the front of the logbook that says somthing like "Unofficial aeronautical experience only. Not to be used for the purpose of obtaining FAA Certificates or ratings, or to document recency of experience."

 

[JohnnyP]

Thanks for all the info people.

English, I havent been asked to do anything yet, I just know of the operation and if i dont get the current job im interviewing for next week then my contact at this place said he would take me down to meet everyone, etc. I havent talked to anyone flying there, I was just curious as to how the right seaters are logging this time they are getting there. I would venture to say that the left seaters do have type ratings in the aircraft. And you know what I dont even know if it is a 91 or 135 operation, these are obviously details I am interested in but havent had a chance to find out without talking to someone there. I wish I had more info, would make it easier to find out all the details.

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

JohnnyP,


Are you being asked to fly right seat part 91 or 135? Does the PIC have a CE525 or CE525s type rating? (Big difference). If he/she has a CE525 type rating, then you are a required crew member (if part 91), and you can log the time legally. If he/she has a CE525s type rating, there are still some circumstances where you can be a legal SIC. In all cases, for part 135 flights, you'd need to do a 135 checkride.

I can help you better with more info.

English is correct, The main question involves which type rating the PIC is flying with. 525 only, requires a SIC, 525s is the single pilot version. Having said that though I doubt that many would question SIC in a Citation since most require a second pilot in many cases. The 550 series can be flown SP with the PIC holding an SP waiver, However the airplane its self requires two pilots. So even though I hold an SP waiver, anybody flying with me can log SIC provided that they have had the training outlined in part 61 of the FAR's since the waiver is mine and not the airplanes. The two differences would be the 501 sp and the 550 sp(I think designated the 551). In the case of the 550 sp (A Citation II with lowered gross weight) the airplane its self is documented as being single pilot.

The 525 is a little different, since it can be either single or two pilot depending on what type you hold, but as long as you have had the required training and have that training documented I wouldn't bust somebodys balls over it.

Of course that is just my opinion, There are a lot of CP's out there that might get all technical over which type the PIC held just to make your life miserable.

 

[viking737]

Not necessarily interested in logging any time, but what are the requirements under part 61 to fly SIC in a 2 pilot jet?

I have been flying part 121 for the last few years, but every now and
then someone is looking for a right seat guy in a corporate jet.
I know some training would be required, just don't have part 61 handy.
Anybody have the right answer?

 

[bobbysamd]

SIC requirements

Not necessarily interested in logging any time, but what are the requirements under part 61 to fly SIC in a 2 pilot jet?

I have been flying part 121 for the last few years, but every now and
then someone is looking for a right seat guy in a corporate jet.
I know some training would be required, just don't have part 61 handy.
Anybody have the right answer?

14 CFR 61.55 will tell you everything you need to know.

 

[Lead Sled]

I know some training would be required, just don't have part 61 handy. Anybody have the right answer?

Part 61 sets forth the minimum that you need; the right answer is to have a talk with their insurance agent - regardless of what the FARs say, it's the insurance carrier that sets the rules.

Lead Sled

 

[Flying Illini]

regardless of what the FARs say, it's the insurance carrier that sets the rules.

Lead Sled

Exactly... If the insurance says you need two pilots even though the aircraft isn't certificated as such, that airplane does NOT fly unless that right seat is filled. Seems wrong to prevent someone required for the flight to log the flight time. It seems open and shut to me: BE20 (king air 200) flies with two pilots, sits with one pilot. I think this reg needs to be reviewed by the FAA. What harm is done in allowing someone to log SIC in an aircraft rated for one pilot (as long as he/she is properly trained as an SIC in that aircraft) when the insurance co. requires two pilots for the aircraft to be dispatched?

 

[A Squared]

Seems wrong to prevent someone required for the flight to log the flight time. It seems open and shut to me: BE20 (king air 200) flies with two pilots, sits with one pilot. I think this reg needs to be reviewed by the FAA. What harm is done in allowing someone to log SIC in an aircraft rated for one pilot (as long as he/she is properly trained as an SIC in that aircraft) when the insurance co. requires two pilots for the aircraft to be dispatched?

DO you really want to know why? or do you just want to complain about how mean the regulations are?

If you allowed insurance policies to dictate the legitimacy of SIC time, as sure as god made little green apples, you'd have a bunch of places get insurance policies on thier C-150's which required an "SIC" and start selling timebuilding packages with 2 people in a 150 building time for thier CPLs and ATPs. Presumably you are astute enough to grasp that having ATP applicants with 300 hours of PIC and 1200 hours of C150 SIC time is an undesirable situation?

Look, drawing the line at SIC's who are required by the regulations is a reasonable, common sense place to draw the line. It may be currently inconvenient for you, but it makes a great deal of sense.

 

[wings421]

Exactly... If the insurance says you need two pilots even though the aircraft isn't certificated as such, that airplane does NOT fly unless that right seat is filled. Seems wrong to prevent someone required for the flight to log the flight time. It seems open and shut to me: BE20 (king air 200) flies with two pilots, sits with one pilot. I think this reg needs to be reviewed by the FAA. What harm is done in allowing someone to log SIC in an aircraft rated for one pilot (as long as he/she is properly trained as an SIC in that aircraft) when the insurance co. requires two pilots for the aircraft to be dispatched?

This is one of the more ignorant posts I've seen on flightinfo.com

Because - Flying Illini is serious.