Hours? Hard to Get?

[luck4unme]

Will pilots please comment on availability of hours in their various MWS.

I've heard there's a serious "over supply" of co-pilots and getting time in the cockpit is a real problem.

Has the USAF been training too many pilots? Will it get tougher to get into UPT?

How have the commercial fuloughs affected AD and specifically AETC?

Thanks,

Bean

 

[Toro]

Will pilots please comment on availability of hours in their various MWS.

The answer is always going to be 'it depends'. It depends on what aircraft you're flying, it depends on where you are stationed, it depends on how often you're deployed, depends on what your additional duties are. I've been flying the F-15E less than three years and have well over 500 hours. I generally fly a couple times a week and don't have a significant amount of additional duties. That might change for somebody assigned as an instructor the FTU in Seymour who flies a 1.2 hour BFM sortie, then debriefs for six hours and doesn't fly again for another couple days. It'll also be different for the O-4 or above flight/section commander who has additional tasks that don't allow him to fly as much.

I've heard there's a serious "over supply" of co-pilots and getting time in the cockpit is a real problem.

Not from what I've seen, but it goes in cycles. It's tough for AFPC to accurately forecast where the shortfalls will be. Many years back, there was a huge shortage and the floodgates opened for UPT applicants. From where I'm at, I don't see an over-supply of pilots, in fact we could use more. Again, that's going to vary depending on where you are and what you fly.

How have the commercial fuloughs affected AD and specifically AETC?

The furloughs aren't really going to directly affect AD - it's mostly reserve guys who are now falling back on alternate means. I don't know of any furloughed guys who came back to active duty, but that's not to say it can't happen. The only affect this might have on AETC would be a larger number of reserve guys available as instructors resulting in either less flying for everyone as a whole, or less AD guys being required as instructors.

 

[Skyrunner]

Hey Toro,

Do you know the Curl(?) family? I forgot the husband's first name but he is a E model pilot there. He and his wife just had quads about 3 months ago. They were all preemies. AD refused to fly the preemies from Hill to SJ. My squadron (WYANG) volunteered to picked up the mission. Flight turned out pretty good. AES folks did a good job and took goo care of them. Just wondering if you know them and how they are doing? I think they are PCSing to Edwards in June for TPS.

Adios,

SR

 

[Toro]

You sure they're at Lakenheath? I know for sure they're not in my squadron, and I don't know of anybody named Curl or anything close to that in the other squadron - much less somebody who just had quads.

 

[talondriver]

The furloughs aren't really going to directly affect AD - it's mostly reserve guys who are now falling back on alternate means. I don't know of any furloughed guys who came back to active duty, but that's not to say it can't happen. The only affect this might have on AETC would be a larger number of reserve guys available as instructors resulting in either less flying for everyone as a whole, or less AD guys being required as instructors.

There were three dudes in my reserve squadron who were furloughed and returned to active duty.

 

[HueyPilot]

MWS time

Co-pilots typically get less time than their AC/IP counterparts for one simple reason...they are the least flexible crew qual. Co-pilots are only good for students on training sorties or co-pilots on operational sorties.

As an AC/IP, you get used more, because your experience allows you to fly more demanding missions, you don't need another pilot with a higher qual to fly with you, and as an IP you can fly instructional sorties too.

C-21 copilots typically log about 200-300 hours their first year. After that, it picks up because most folks are upgraded to AC after a year to a year-and-a-half. AC's can typically fly about 400 hours a year, and IPs generally log about 500-600 hours a year.

In a 3-year tour, a C-21 pilot will generally log about 1,000 hours or so of C-21 time...about 300 of that will be as a copilot, the rest as an AC/IP.

Other Heavy MWS's are about the same, although most of those folks fly more because they are in more demand due to OIF and OEF. Some of those guys get 600-800 hours a year.

I'm an IP right now, and I've been averaging about 40-50 hours a month currently. Last month (October) I flew about 38 hours, but that was because I was at IP school, and half the month was spent flying local sorties, which are shorter (3-4 hours). This month I flew about 42, and again, that's because this last week I'm spending it TDY in Dallas for the simulator.

Fighters and bombers, expect to fly less...about 200-300 a year on average is what I typically hear. You'll probably fly a similar number of sorties compared to heavy pilots, but your sorties are typically much shorter. A C-21 mission can net you about 5-8 hours in a day, versus a couple hours in a fighter.

Of course, there's nothing like flying a 5-leg, 14 hour duty day and log only 3 hours of flying time....those days suck. Take off from Maxwell, get to Eglin in 0.6. Spend an hour on the ground. Take back off, fly to Macdill, log a 0.8. Spend another hour on the ground. Head out for Jacksonville FL, and log another 0.5. Spend another hour on the ground. Go to Atlanta, log about a 0.7, and spend 2 hours on the ground due to it being busy. Head out from Atlanta, fly back to Maxwell in 0.8 hours. Long day...and you only logged 3.4 hours, yet you spend about 5+ hours on the ground.

 

[Vinman]

With my kind of flight time and civilian qualifications, how long should I expect to sit as a right seater? I want to go the tanker/airlift route and would like the C-17s or to fly the C-21s and such. How hard is it to get into the C-21s or the Gulfstream a/c? Thanks

 

[Spur]

With my kind of flight time and civilian qualifications, how long should I expect to sit as a right seater? I want to go the tanker/airlift route and would like the C-17s or to fly the C-21s and such. How hard is it to get into the C-21s or the Gulfstream a/c? Thanks

Typically you will get 800 hrs in the right seat of a heavy MWS before you are eligible for AC upgrade. The C-21 is not an MWS and as mentioned before has different hour requirements for upgrade. I dont think the C-20s are given out in UPT.

 

[MarineGrunt]

I don't mean to hijack the thread, but does anyone know what an ANG KC-135 pilot will log per year?