help with radio calls

[hammer]

I recently passed my check ride for my private(January 23) and have a question about radio calls at non-towered airports. My instructor always taught me to make position reports when entering the downwind, turning base,and turning final. I have been flying to any airport within 150 miles on weekends to keep my new learned skills fresh in my mind. One thing I have noticed is alot of the pilots make very little or no postion reports before landing, and last weekend when I was landing at airport in virginia I was making my position reports to land and a pilot of a king air that was coming in, came on the radio and asked the fbo what was going on down there. Should I keep doing it the way I was taught or tone it down abit? I just want to do whats right and not offend anyone.
Thanks for any advice.

 

[pilotman2105]

IMHO, it depends on the traffic situation. If you're the only person in the traffic pattern, you *should* make position reports, but I would not get too hung up on them. If there are 5 other aircraft in the pattern, then you better be calling every leg (upwind, crosswind, downwind, base, final).

I currently fly out of an un-controlled airport that is busy as he!!. If you do not make a position report, you're either going to have to go around because someone will be sitting on the runway not moving their a$$ off or you'll end up smacking into someone on downwind. (Thankfully, we're getting a tower soon, so that should remedy the situation, but that's besides the point).

All in all, just make your reports. Think of the radio at uncontrolled airports as a tool and not a requirement. However, keep in mind that if the field is uncontrolled, not everyone is required to have an operable radio.

This is more my experience rather than the true rules. For the "technically correct" information, consult the regs and the AIM.

Hope that helps.

 

[Rick1128]

It really depends.

Personally, I make an initial call and request that any other traffic to please advise. The problem with making calls on every leg is that many airport unicoms are saturated by other traffic and other airports. One of the things that agravates me is a pilot who calls "turning crosswind", cross wind", "turning downwind", "midfield downwind", "turning Base", "base leg", "turning final' and "Short final" all he has managed to do is plug up the radio waves and let no one else get a word in. Sometimes it is much more important to listen.

 

[TEXAN AVIATOR]

Arrival:
1. I'd call 10 miles out and intentions.
2. 5 miles out.
3. Entering on a 45 to the downwind.
4. And Base.

In the pattern, use common sense; if calling every leg will cause you to possibly step on someone, make adjustments. If you can call every leg, Crosswind, downwind, base, & (Final if you choose).

Like the other fellas said, it just depends on the situation. I spent about 250 hours flying out of uncontrolled and those are the ways I did things and it always worked.

The main thing is make sure you have visual of other pilots, and try to keep others informed of your intentions. Do what you're comfortable with, don't let pilots who've developed bad habits bother you.

You can get some info from the FAR AIM "AIM 4-1-9.c." also

Fly safe,
TA

 

[tinman]

pilotman2105- Are you by chance flying out of Provo? If yes, I feel your pain!

 

[TEXAN AVIATOR]

pilotman2105- Are you by chance flying out of Provo? If yes, I feel your pain!

I used to fly out of Heber, I hated going to Provo!! That place is a mid-air waiting to happen.

 

[Jedi_Cheese]

Pilotman and I fly out of KSTC (St. Cloud Regional).

The traffic pattern can be bad (I was sharing an ILS with 2 other aircraft today) but it isn't usually that bad. Worse I ever seen it was 1 aircraft on the runway, 2 final, 1 base, ~7 downwind, 1 crosswind and 1 upwind (it was 50/50 for landings to go-arounds that day). Normal is 3-4 aircraft in the pattern, 1 leaving the pattern, 1 coming in from somewhere, and another guy or two doing instrament approaches.

I make initial takeoff, downwind, base, and final calls.

 

[pilotman2105]

It really depends.

Personally, I make an initial call and request that any other traffic to please advise.

Why should other traffic have to advise you? You should be listening to CTAF frequency far enough out to have a good idea of where all the traffic is BEFORE entering the area. It isn't the pilot's responsibility in the pattern to "advise" you of their position. It is your responsibility to determine where they are and fit into the flow.

I ignore requests to "advise" of my position. I've got other things going on. I've been making my calls, now you make yours. I'll start looking for you on your initial call.

The problem with making calls on every leg is that many airport unicoms are saturated by other traffic and other airports. One of the things that agravates me is a pilot who calls "turning crosswind", cross wind", "turning downwind", "midfield downwind", "turning Base", "base leg", "turning final' and "Short final" all he has managed to do is plug up the radio waves and let no one else get a word in. Sometimes it is much more important to listen.

Agreed. However, if you make the call short and quick, you can say each portion of the pattern without tying the radio up too much. It's the people that key the mike and say:

"xyz traffic....... AAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH................... Cessna 12345 is ah........ turning left-downwind............ ahhhhhh.......... runway 12....... aahhhhhhhhhhh....... xyz traffic."

Now that is a legitimate complaint. (Student pilots exempt obviously)

 

[TopGun-MAV]

its good to see you are trying to keep current by flying regularly.
Radio communications are often the most difficult part of being a new pilot. what i would do, give a call 10 miles out, then another when your joining the pattern, then another on each leg after that.. easy!
once you've become a seasoned vegeran like us that will be the least of your concerns. the faster the plane the faster you have to think. A be1900 doing 240kts will want to be on the ball, ahead of the game.

just my 2 cents

 

[TRLpilot]

i'm surprised TopGun-MAV has 2 cents with having to PFT and all.

like said before, read up in the FAR/AIM. i monitor the radio a little ways out to get an idea of the traffic (which negates having to ask if there's traffic), announce intentions 10 miles out, maybe again 4 or 5 miles if there is lots of traffic, then announce entering downwind, base, and final. if it's busy and you are staying in the pattern then maybe announce crosswind, downwind, base, and final. if there is no traffic and i'm staying in the pattern i just announce downwind and final.

 

[hammer]

Thanks for all your responses, I am enjoying this so much that I want to keep doing the right thing.

 

[350DRIVER]

The problem with a lot of the uncontrolled fields is that you have some pilots that are from the "old school" who are nothing more than weekend flyers who do not believe in talking on the radios for whatever reasons that I will never know. I don't care if one or twenty people are working the pattern, area, you still need to give the position reports and transmit continuously regardless of how many people are currently there or in the area.

Bad habits will form if you start to get lazy. There was nothing worse than flying a $$5+ million dollar aircraft into an uncontrolled field and having to continuously keep asking others "where they were" and "what their intentions were" due to the fact that they had p!ss poor radio techniques. . It is just as important to keep a watchful eye out the window and always anticipate what others might be going to do or not going to do for that matter.

3 5 0

 

[English]

I get a crack out of reading about "uncontrolled" airports. Hey guys, they are non-towered, not uncontrolled! Although, sometimes they do seem a little out of control...

 

[pilotman2105]

I get a crack out of reading about "uncontrolled" airports. Hey guys, they are non-towered, not uncontrolled! Although, sometimes they do seem a little out of control...

AIM 4-3-26 "Operations at Uncontrolled Airports..."
AIM 4-1-9 "Traffic Advisory Practices at Airports Without Operating Control Towers"
AC 90-42F "Traffic Advisory Practices at Airports without Operating Control Towers"

Nothing from the FAA about "non-towered" airports. Just airports without an operating control tower. Even one mention of "uncontrolled."