havoc @ pissmont

[jellynuts]

can we start this havoc stuff at pdt, it sounds like a great time!?! or at least a sick out or something......

 

[Sig]

First and insurmountably fixable step: Make PHL a primary hub for operations.

DONE!

Next?

 

[ex j-41]

At least you don't have managment taking 40 lines away for IOE.
Rather than pay protect people like real airlines, PSA decides that you have to bid extra lines because of the IOE. SO you might end up getting a reserve line. Works out great for the IOE captains cause they get 25% on top of their regular rate. What do the F/O's get? Nice month on reserve. Contract states only 5% of lines can be used for IOE but they decided to take 25%. I am sure there will be some loophole that ALPA will let them take...
Management agrees they were slow to hire and upgrade, hence the situation we are in now. So they $#^%#$ up and we suffer. Great Airline.

 

[airmonkey]

I'm sorry ex j-41, looks like I'll be one of the guys taking up a seat during IOE. Tell you what, its a small consolation but I'll grab you as many condiment packages as I can from the food court to ease the burden.

Seriously though I'm not making light of a bad situation. As a new hire there is a huge gap between what I think I know and what I know i have no clue about.

 

[wanabe_fo]

At least you don't have managment taking 40 lines away for IOE.
Rather than pay protect people like real airlines, PSA decides that you have to bid extra lines because of the IOE. SO you might end up getting a reserve line. Works out great for the IOE captains cause they get 25% on top of their regular rate. What do the F/O's get? Nice month on reserve. Contract states only 5% of lines can be used for IOE but they decided to take 25%. I am sure there will be some loophole that ALPA will let them take...
Management agrees they were slow to hire and upgrade, hence the situation we are in now. So they $#^%#$ up and we suffer. Great Airline.

LOA 6 (I think but do not want to take the time to verify) allows them to capture 100% of flying for IOE. Why our union did not put a time expiration on this LOA is beyond me. They needed 100 % during the jet transition but not now. Now we all just get hosed. I am in the group of FO's sitting on the bubble between round 1/2/reserve so I expect to get hosed for the next several months.

I almost expect reserve to not be such bad duty come about December (exept for the idea of hot reserve and talking to the fab 3 . They will not have enough captains to staff PSA anyway. How many are going back in December/ November and how many upgrades have they doen so far. Oh yea, 80 go back by March and they have done 16 upgrades in the last two months. I smell a lot of cancellations come December-March.

 

[nethan]

Like all wonderful LOAs over here, there are no sunset clauses so we are stuck with this. The one thing in LOA 6 which is actually good is the fact the company can make no fly lines which pay either guarantee or the amount of hours of the best line you could have held. The problem is LOA 6 states "AT THE COMPANY'S DISCRETION". You've got to wonder who the hell agrees to this crap... oh wait... I know. Never mind.

 

[Grey Ghost]

Can I get 25 percent extra to fly with Harry and PJ?

 

[Grey Ghost]

Can I get 25 percent extra to fly with Harry and Pammycakes?

 

[Sig]

Can I get 25 percent extra to fly with Harry and Pammycakes?

Much like your sister said while you kept grabbing her region, "Let it go."

Seriously.

 

[ex j-41]

I'm sorry ex j-41, looks like I'll be one of the guys taking up a seat during IOE. Tell you what, its a small consolation but I'll grab you as many condiment packages as I can from the food court to ease the burden.

Seriously though I'm not making light of a bad situation. As a new hire there is a huge gap between what I think I know and what I know i have no clue about.

Don't feel guilty for doing IOE, that is part of your job. The beef i have with the company is that they are taking more then they are supposed to for IOE lines, because THEY screwed up and didn't hire like they were supposed to back in late winter, early spring. Management screwed up. We suffer. So typical for this company. Couple of months ago management said there was not a pilot shortage. Now there is. Tomorrow No, Next day, Yes. They don't have a friggin clue.

 

[Grey Ghost]

Much like your sister said while you kept grabbing her region, "Let it go."

Seriously.

you must be one of those small town country boy fo's that pdt likes to hire. it usually takes you guys 3-4 years to finally realize that there are much better operations out there beyond the North Carolina countryside. when you do show up at your new airline's ground school, you are the one who always says "well at Piedmont, we did it this way"! nobody cares!!!!!!!

P.S. OK harry, I'll stop!uke:

 

[Sig]

you must be one of those small town country boy fo's that pdt likes to hire.

Sure.

**why did I even waste the calories typing this out**


I am not a yokel, but a bigger nerd you'll be hard pressed to find.

 

[Grey Ghost]

Sure.

**why did I even waste the calories typing this out**


.

Because you are probably stuck in DelMarVa with nothing better to do!

 

[hoover]

At least you don't have managment taking 40 lines away for IOE.
Rather than pay protect people like real airlines, PSA decides that you have to bid extra lines because of the IOE. SO you might end up getting a reserve line. Works out great for the IOE captains cause they get 25% on top of their regular rate. What do the F/O's get? Nice month on reserve. Contract states only 5% of lines can be used for IOE but they decided to take 25%. I am sure there will be some loophole that ALPA will let them take...
Management agrees they were slow to hire and upgrade, hence the situation we are in now. So they $#^%#$ up and we suffer. Great Airline.

You get pissed when the company screws up and you get pissed when the company tries to fix it. WTF do you want? The company has to train its pilots. Why should they pay you a full month's pay for sitting home doing nothing while at the same time paying the IOE guy?? From what you've said, the worst that happens to you is that you get to sit at home and wait for the phone to ring while collecting your minimum guarantee. If that is suffering, I'll take 12 months of it.

 

[quinnlake]

You get pissed when the company screws up and you get pissed when the company tries to fix it. WTF do you want? The company has to train its pilots. Why should they pay you a full month's pay for sitting home doing nothing while at the same time paying the IOE guy?? From what you've said, the worst that happens to you is that you get to sit at home and wait for the phone to ring while collecting your minimum guarantee. If that is suffering, I'll take 12 months of it.

Do you even fly the line? You would trade reserve for a hard line? Get a clue. Or just stay on of computor, and of flight info.

 

[ex j-41]

You get pissed when the company screws up and you get pissed when the company tries to fix it. WTF do you want? The company has to train its pilots. Why should they pay you a full month's pay for sitting home doing nothing while at the same time paying the IOE guy?? From what you've said, the worst that happens to you is that you get to sit at home and wait for the phone to ring while collecting your minimum guarantee. If that is suffering, I'll take 12 months of it.

Don't think the company is trying to make things right. They will do whatever they can to save $$$. And this is how it is done. Keep F/O's in their current position as long as possible. 2 or 3 year J4J's are cheaper then 5 or 6 year F/O's upgrading. So the company held off as long as they could, or at least they were dragging their feet. To save money.
It helps them and in turn hurts us. Don't think for a second that anyone is going to be sitting at home for a month and get paid for it. They will offer leave first. This company will not spend $3 more to get us better hotels. They will never ever pay us to sit at home.

 

[MEL'ed]

Back to topic

can we start this havoc stuff at pdt, it sounds like a great time!?! or at least a sick out or something......

I second this motion. Although, being just an FO I won't be able to do much. Good luck convincing some of the SYR CAs to slow the taxi down to a walking pace. Same with the sick out, most like to bank their time. Look at the 6 month no sick call lists, we have a ton of guys on there. Plus,we always fudge times for better pay. If we called it correctly to the minute every time, late departures would sky rocket due to late bags/pax. The ontime stats would plummet. 1/3 of the CAs don't even care about small maintenance items either. (before anyone yells, this is my fault too for not standing up more. it's just a light/bs item that is not safety related.) They would still take time to write up and bring mx to an outstation to sign off. I say all this about SYR, but it is my experience the CAs in the south are even more company boys that don't care and are in a hurry just to get the job done and go home. I don't see any of these happening at PDT anytime soon.

 

[jellynuts]

I second this motion. Although, being just an FO I won't be able to do much. Good luck convincing some of the SYR CAs to slow the taxi down to a walking pace. Same with the sick out, most like to bank their time. Look at the 6 month no sick call lists, we have a ton of guys on there. Plus,we always fudge times for better pay. If we called it correctly to the minute every time, late departures would sky rocket due to late bags/pax. The ontime stats would plummet. 1/3 of the CAs don't even care about small maintenance items either. (before anyone yells, this is my fault too for not standing up more. it's just a light/bs item that is not safety related.) They would still take time to write up and bring mx to an outstation to sign off. I say all this about SYR, but it is my experience the CAs in the south are even more company boys that don't care and are in a hurry just to get the job done and go home. I don't see any of these happening at PDT anytime soon.

son of a..... way to steal my thunder! ya i know what you're saying. a lot of old timers that just want to get home and get it over with. it'll all be over soon and we won't have to worry about it anymore....

 

[lear24]

... I don't see any of these happening at PDT anytime soon.

The only time most PDT pilots have any balls is behind their keyboard, just look at the lav wall. Now if the havoc program involved writing anonymous slurs towards people and saying things they'd never say to anyone in person, it would see great success at PDT!

 

[GlenQ]

to reignite this thread...
got word from one of our union reps that mainline just hired off the street yesterday, they're now officially filling a Nov. 5th class and putting guys off the street on their seniority list ahead of us wholly owned...I believe there will be some attempt at an organized slowdown or something in the near future over this...anyone heard anything else?