Getting Out Plans?

[HoursHore]

What are people doing?

I've dropped my letter, and comitted myself to taking the plunge to the dark side, getting out next June. Have apps at JB, SWA, UPS, FEDEX. and resumes at AirTran, Comair, ASA. Are there anyother options? Being Navy, staying in is not one of them, Haze gray and underway on the USS Neverhome shooting Pointy nose guys off the front doesn't apeal too much. Some Buds are getting hired by those guys which makes me optomistic, but the 4 guys in the SWA pool in my squadron alone is kind of a downer.

Are Mil guys going regionals?. Any body get on with NetJets? Air Tran?
Being new to this forum, it seems like most posts concerning those companies are from the guys who came up the civilian way with way more time than i have.

just wondering. May have to find a sugar mama and bartend til the picture looks up.

 

[Purple Haze]

Sounds like you are doing the right stuff. A good friend went to an Air Inc job fair and was offered a Com Air interview. He was in your situation, so he interviewed and got the job offer. I understand they have a pool of 5-8 months, but when bartending gets old...

#1: Get a reserve job. It will keep you current and it pays.
#2: If you can find any aviation "job fair type" events to attend (Air Inc, Women in Aviation, OBAP, etc), put on your interview suit, carry a handful of resumes, and meet every company rep you can. Make the most of your time by knowing the hiring outlook, so you know which lines to stand in.

Good luck. The job search is long and painful for most -- but worth it.

Purple

PS: CCDisco is right -- it is a huge friggin risk. Make sure before you cut the cord (another reason I like the reserve option). There is something to be said for having a full time job.

 

[CCDiscoB]

It's very, very ugly. You may want to reconsider. In fact, after you spend a few months reading this board you'll be running back to the Navy begging to take you back.

Basically, JetBlue is your only hope unless you know someone, and I mean someone big. JetBlue seems to be hiring Navy dudes.

All the companies you mentioned have thousands of resumes. Being military will not help anymore.

 

[HoursHore]

The reserve job is a no brainer, definately trying to line one of those up for the currency issue as well as pay. Talking to a couple of units.
Mainly wondering about those who are in the process.
Gone to the air inc confernce, going to another in Jan. Pretty helpful.
Mainly wondering what current AD guys are looking at.
Many active AF guys in my squadron are taking the bonus.
Any navy guys trying to go active AF? Know of a couple. What prompted that deciscion?
Being single makes the jump a lot easier, Ramen serves one perfectly.

 

[707 IP]

Gettin Out?

As an active AF guy, I've got all the same concerns as you. I too am planning to get out in June.

As for the sea tour option -- we've got a bunch (8-10) guys here @ Tinker that have come over to the AF. Helos, T-34's, E-6's too. They get a two year contract for the training (I think) and are eligible for the bonus. It's a good option if you want to stay away from the boat and still get a paycheck. AWACS is always hiring.

I'm going to the Air Inc fair in DCA on the 18th. Hope to get something from it. Let me know if you want some Navy contacts. Chi-Chi R. is in training right now if you know him.

See you

 

[holmie]

Dude,
I left the Navy in 93 during the drawdown. Situation was similar to the one now except this one is way worse. The only jobs then were at the regionals and a handfull of guys getting on at SWA and UPS. You should think twice in my opinion. There are thousands of swinging d's out of work now with big time hours all trying to get in the door somewhere. Unless you are well connected the competition is brutal.
One thing you have going for you is that you aren't furloughed and have no # yet. That seems to be a huge problem for all the dudes on the street including myself.
It looks like one of the best alternatives by far is a place like NetJets. Money is pretty good, schedules aren't anywhere near as bad as a regional and you are logging good time in a sector that is booming. While you stay current you can still work on the larger carriers.
I would do the Reserves for sure. It's the only way to survive on first year pay in the commuters if you go that route. Some ANG and AFReserve outfits are willing to take other service guys in so that could be something to consider.
If you do stay in the Navy I don't think you're going to miss much for the next 2-3 years. All the market forecasts are now saying the industry is going to be in the toilet until 04-05. Now that I've cheered you up, best of luck!

 

[FL510GV]

Easy for me to say

I separate in Nov. However, I was fortunate enough to get a reserve job and I head off to training in Dec. That will keep me on Active Pay until the spring and "as busy as I want" past then, while I wait for a civilian job. I have all the apps in, multiple resumes out and an ace in the hole (the G-V), but not a single nibble. The civilian job market is brutal, brutal, brutal right now. If I did not have the reserve job, I would probably change my plans and take another assignment. Look at the SWA Poolie Furloughed etc thread for good people who are getting kicked out of their house for how bad it can be!

Funny how the AF changes their tune on assignments when you put your papers in. Before the paper drop, I was told you'll get what we give you and that's the system, but after my papers, I have had three AF job offers good enough that it made me cringe to turn them down...

I got the Reserve job because:

1) Who I knew in the unit
2) I am living in the immediate area of the unit (will be).
3) Timing
4) Qualifications and AF Record

I am also getting out so that my kids can have stability and roots. Same schools/friends, close to family, etc. I like the AF, it has been VERY good to me and that's why I'm going to the Reserves, but I am at the point in my active career where squares have to be filled that I am not willing to fill. You have to take a deep breath and do what is right for you (and your family).

Good Luck to all. Times will change for the better, again.

 

[CCDiscoB]

HoursHore, you're probably reading these responses thinking to yourself, "yeah, yeah, I'll get a job, because ...." We've all had those thoughts. Heck you might consider yourself a minority, forget it. No type = no job in today's market. Unless you can get on with JetBlue or SWA and that won’t happen, you’re too late. If FL510GV can't get a job with a type rating, what's someone with no type rating going to look like? I’m not trying to sound like a dick, I’m just a little frustrated at the job market.

That's scary, a G-V type rating and no job offers. I would have sworn I saw a few G-V jobs advertised on the Internet. Is it because you are scheduled to go to training? Maybe I won't spend the $$ to buy a G-V type.

I think it's funny how all these Navy dudes are running to the AF. They're finally realizing that if you want to fly, join the service that does the most flying, not the most sailing.

 

[Michael Knight]

HoursHore,

It comes down to availability which is why doing a shooter tour followed by another, get current in the cockpit, tour is not the answer. I agree hiring will be slim for a while but nobody really knows when the next hiring wave will begin. My opinion, Get out of the Navy unless they offer you a flying tour. If they don't offer you a flying tour find a reserve / guard job. Being single gives you LOTS of options. Being a reserve bum should be pretty easy on your budget. Personally I'd try to find one near the ski slopes.

CC,

Are you grumpy?

 

[CCDiscoB]

Just grumpy...not enough coffee.

SWA won't call, I didn't apply. No, I won't be buying a 737 type rating.

I agree, being single will make things very easy.

 

[AlbieF15]

HH,

Easy for me to say...I'm working, but if you want to be an airline pilot you have got to be available when the hiring happens.

Will that be in 2 years...5 years....who knows?

I'd work as hard as I could to get a part time/full time ANG/Reserve job. C130 units historically need folks, as guys leave/quit once they are secure enough in the airline careers. Fighter units are tougher, but not impossible. There are also some non-flying ASOC type jobs out there...an option for money/security if you could find even a low paying flying job to keep you current while you wait for the next wave.

Good luck--it ain't easy right now...but eventually things will change.

 

[T1bubba]

I think it's funny how all these Navy dudes are running to the AF. They're finally realizing that if you want to fly, join the service that does the most flying, not the most sailing.

You're absolutely right. That's why I'm joining the ANG!



T1bubba

 

[BacktoAA]

HoursH,

I assume you're also at Enid, America. I know of at least one of your brethren that has come over to the Light side here on the Tweet side and is flying white jets for another 3 years vs. sailing. I know of a couple of others seriously considering it. Man, I would sure give that some thought. You can do that for 3 years, still sock away some $$$ (or fly for Comair????), and then come to AA and be only 110 #s junior to me (or wherever, I'm defenitly not saying AA is the place to be!!). Not having a full-time job sucks. Trying to find one now will even suck harder. The reserves worked good for a year, but now looking at 3-5 out, it's back to active duty for me.

Good Luck!

 

[FL510GV]

Type?

HH, Disco, et al,

Don't buy a G-V type... it'll cost you around $40K and there are less than 150 G-V's in the world that have civilian pilots. I have nearly 1000 hours in the G-V (C-37A) and a lot of contacts... but not being available has cost me some jobs (wasn't even interviewed because of availability date) with the G-V. I separate in Nov. and go to training in Dec for Barney, so I am still not really available. The G-V is a great type to have, but you have to be able to jump immediately... no one who needs a G-V or other business jet pilot can/wants to wait 90+ days for their pilot.

Get out so that you can jump!, or, stay in so that you can put food on the table? My Reserve job is a great way to keep serving (we are at war, right?), keep current and put food on the table... I just can't jump quite so high, but at least I can jump (like Larry Bird).

Check out www.pilots4rent.com, there is an American 777 Captain who's retiring who just bought a G-V type and wants a job. Who's going to compete with that?

 

[pony251]

Hourshore, I feel your pain. I finished a cruise on the TR in March and dropped my letter the next month. 159 days straight at sea absolutely blew. I got hired by Atlantic Coast(regional) and the ANG to fly a-10's. Haze grey and underway is no place to be. The money is horrendous the first year but I saved up for it. The ANG will help once my package makes it thru all the wickets. After you get over the pride thing, going to the AF is a pretty good deal. Everyone is right in that you need to know somebody to set you apart from the crowd. Air Inc conference sealed the deal for me to get an interview. Dude, it is a tough place to be. You have to be very humble with the civilians because all your military stuff doesn't mean jack sh!! to them. Good luck

we've got it suitcased,what could possibly go wrong

 

[Skyrunner]

Try not to chase the buck

I was AD for 11 years. All 130s. Going to an ANG 130 bum job. All my buds decided to stay in because of the money (mainly healthcare). I love these guys and respect them, but they are staying in for the money, which, IMO, should not be a strong reason to stay in. If you want to continue serving and fighting wars, great. I just don't want to hear these guys complaining when the airlines start hiring again and they are locked into an ADSC.

Stability of a guard job is my priority. Same place and steady work. My kids get to grow up with the same friends and attend good schools. Besides, Home Depot is hiring. Now I finally have an excuse for my wife of getting my dream job, working full-time with power tools and driving a forklift.

Regards,

SR

 

[CCDiscoB]

Pony251 Wrote:

After you get over the pride thing, going to the AF is a pretty good deal.

You Navy guys crack me up. You make it sound like you're stepping down from a Cadillac to a VW. Like I said earlier, "I think it's funny how all these Navy dudes are running to the AF and ANG." If the AF is so bad why don't you guys just go to the Naval Reserve?

 

[KC-10 Driver]

HoursHore,

If you can line up a guard/reserve flying job (even as a part timer), you should get out if that's what you want to do.

I've been a bum on two different occasions, and I've always made more than enough money to feed my wife and kids. The worst part of troughing is buying the major medical insurance for a family (and I live in NJ, among the highest insurance rates in the nation). If you are single, it's almost a no-brainer.

Of course, every unit is different as far as letting you work. But, whenever it became apparent that the squadron purse strings might be tight for a while, I would find work outside my unit. You can always freelance, so to speak.

In my case, I pulled shifts in the host unit's active duty command post as a duty officer (the active duty AF paid my mandays). On another occasion, I volunteered to do five weeks at Ramstein, Germany working at the AMC command post there (that was an awesome assignment -- Germany in the middle of the summer & my family with me).

What I'm trying to say is that if you are single, and find a guard/reserve job to pay the bills & stay current, you should get off active duty if that's what you want.

Take the leap, and don't look back. You want to be available when you win the airline-job lottery!

Good luck.

 

[KC-10 Driver]

Oh yeah, it wouldn't hurt to find that Sugar Mama too!

 

[orioncontract]

I couldn't resist!

CC
The Navy Reserve has standards--you guys get our rejects!

All seriousness now, we're joint down my way, and the differences come down to this (stand by for oversimplification):

Air Force has the money (no expensive ships to spend it all on), so you have a better lifestyle (build the golf course and Q, then beg for some more $$ to build the runway and ramp). Navy/Marines share the money (and the Marines definitely get the short end of that "deal"), but have the freedom to act (no Supervisor Of Flying looking over our shoulder) specifically in regards to regulations (if it does not specifically say we can't, then we can). The Air Force guys kind of find Navy flying liberating so to speak, but don't appreciate the amenities.

We've had a few go AD AF, but of the four going/gone, three are/were helo looking to build multi time via blue uniforms and O-4 pay rather than regionals. The three gone miss our flight regs.

Kew Gardens has hired lots of guys from our wing (I think about 10 in the last year and a half, probably about 80% of the guys getting out, in fact--half AF, half N) but the new computerized system has put a kybosh (sp?) on the mafia connections (just in time for me--yea!).

HH
As far as the boat goes, I am so with you on that shooter crap. My wife puts it this way--"If you're not flying, you're not happy, which I just don't feel like putting up with." Not to mention that the whole crappy senior Navy leadership culture is a complete turnoff to me--entirely different generation, with all the wrong priorities, both professionally (too much careerisim/bobbing head syndrome) and personally (hooray--six or more months away from the family hanging out with the fraternity brothers/fellow alcoholics. Jeez, don't you people have a WIFE and KIDS? Ohhhhh, you don't care; I get it now.).

I start Comair when they call and am sending out resumes with anyone local in case they don't. I'll get my flying fix either way because I was selected for the local reserve unit. Hopefully that will be better than the 18 hour days shooting someone else off the front end to go have fun sticking it to the intolerant zealots. I'm pretty sure it will be.