Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

First big int'l trip. Russia, France, etc. Any help?

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web

Bleeds On

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Posts
160
Leaving in June in a 560XL and planning CYYR-BIRK-EHAM-LFML-URKK-various Russia-EGSS and back through Iceland. Using Universal for handling. A few inquiries:
-We're negative HF and it's my understanding we don't need it with that routing, correct?
-Negative SMS program at the moment. Suggestions?
-For Russia, do we need a pilot-rated navigator or just someone fluent in English-Russian?
-Type-rated co-pilot may be on a temp cert due to separate type to be completed soon. Deal breaker?
-First class medical is past 6 months, do they care?
-Visas are being lined up for Russia. Anything else I should be concerned with?

Thanks
 
One recommendation that I would make is, if your stop in EHAM is nothing but a tech stop, that I would seriously consider EHRD instead. Schiphol's a very busy airport and can be a pain in the a$$. Rotterdam is much easier. No slots, no permits, no traffic, no problem.

Regarding the HF, if you stay on the blue spruce route, you shouldn't need an HF.

SMS is not required in Europe, as of yet. (In fact, I don't *think* it'll be mandatory even after the deadline)

The Russian navigator need not be rated. Also, you only need a Russian navigator if the airport(s) that you're flying in and out of, are not "international" airports. From my understanding, the controllers aren't obligated to speak english unless it's an international airport.

Temporary certificate should be just fine.

No worries on the first class medical being over 6 months. It is good to have a first class medical though. Technically, The US first and second class medical certificates correspond to ICAO Class 1 Medical Assessment. However, even though a US first and second class medical certificate is the equivalent of an ICAO class 1 assessment, in some ICAO countries it may be easier for you to carry a US first class medical certificate than to explain to an inspector (in a foreign language) that a US second class equals an ICAO Class 1 from the rest of the world.

Hope this helps.
 
Bleeds
I'm assuming you've completed an Int'l procedures course within the last 2 years. Get a hold of a SAFA checklist and make sure you've got all your doc's in hand.
If youre ramped in Amsterdam make sure you've used "some" O2. They have been known to check gauges. A friend was recently queried about his journey log and why he hadn't recorded his fuel at each waypoint. This was in a GIV. Guess they never heard of an FMS.
Have fun. Sounds like a good trip.

Does 850KOA have anything to do with APA or BJC?
 
Awesome, thanks guys. My initial reaction to EHAM was "how 'bout Rotterdam". One guy is riding the airlines into EHAM. Maybe we can get him to take a taxi to EHRD.
I completed the Int'l course with ATI just under 2 years ago so I'm planning to refresh. I have the SAFA check printed out as well as an int'l ops book with all the applicable doc's. I think I'm covered except the SMS. I just don't want to overlook anything.
We cross DEN a lot and 850 has great range. Good time killer.
 
I have actually had pretty quick turns at EHAM?....using runway 4/22 (?) and have done pretty good crew swaps easily as there is an OK hotel right across the street.

I dont know anything about your airplane, but can make Helsinki? Great tech stop.

Yes you will need a navigator depending where you go in Russia. Leave extra time ofr everything in Russia, especially once outside Moscow.

SMS wont likely be an issue, but I would get those medicals if you are over 40..yes I know about the FAA letter explaining validity, but why risk something so easy?

Make a SAFA book up, it will get all your docs in order and make it fast if anyone asks. Send your email if you want a copy of ours.

Sounds like a fun trip (minus Russia lol)
 
Universal won't contact Canpass for the tech stop in Goose. We stopped there the other night and they did a great job despite the arctic conditions. Canpass just wanted a phone call to verify all the pax but it was no big deal, just a surprise. (I've never had to do a tech stop there so it was news to me, too.)

We tried to talk the people into using EHRD but they insisted on AMS. Good handlers--LOTS of construction up around the G2 taxiway area. The controllers worked us to a better runway (18R will take you DAYS to taxi in--KLM departed on 36L yesterday and it was nearly a 40 min. taxi and this guy taxied like a SWA pilot with a hot date!)

What's up with a Russian navigatior? My former employer went there (to the hinterlands, too) and didn't need one. Brush up on your Russian procedures--meters and QFE.

Watch out for the beer over there. It's a whole lot weaker than ours--better drink extra. ;)

TC
 
Unless you're heading to the real backwater of Russia you won't need a Navigator/Translator. If you have Jepp charts for the airport it's considered an "international" airport and won't require the augmented crew.

Make damn sure you have a legible meters flight level chart and brush up on QFE operations. The advice given by most of the international procedures joints is correct. Use QFE below transition level, don't expect a reliable conversion to hPa - even if the charts say it's available. Brush up on your standard phraseology, too. Russian controllers know about 30 words in English - just aviation lingo - and will clam up if you use any American slang or abbreviate terms. Also, cleared to "xxx" means fly your flight plan route to the FIR exit fix (xxx), not fly direct.

Expect to be cleared for an approach while on a downwind vector without being turned for an intercept. You turn when you think it's appropriate and give yourself a 30° intercept to the final. Weird, I know.

Things might be changing with the advent of more western aircraft being used in Russia, but until recently all the ATC descent profiles were predicated on the brick-like flying qualities of old Soviet aircraft. They could perform five-to-one descents without issues, which the BBJ I was flying couldn't handle if it was shot out of the sky. You will have to pester the hell out of controllers going into large cities for lower altitudes in order to make crossing restrictions that the Tu-134's make easily.

Carry a bunch of extra gas going into Moscow. I was vectored for more than 40 minutes at FL1200 meters (about 3600ft AGL) going into Vnukovo one time just to get sequenced for the ILS24. Alternates need to be "International" airports and acceptable ones can be hundreds of miles away. If you need to divert, you WILL go to your filed alternate, not an acceptable one closer to your bosses car.
 
I just did a tech stop in Petro, and my comrade had a temp certificate. Moscow said temps are ok for tech stops ONLY. You might want to look into that. You may need to throw out a few $'s to make it happen. Oh yeah, that reminds me, bring a $h!tload of cash.
 
Few more ?'s:
Should a guy just have euros on hand?
Life raft....it'd be ideal to pick up in CYYR and drop in EHRD and vice versa. Any companies that do that or should we just keep it the whole trip?
Shots, etc. Where can we find the requirements?
 
Euros keep the Russians moving faster, if at all....but dollars also work anywhere, just dont think that $10 goes far anymore...you can use any currency in Europe for tips. Credit cards for everything else, including cabs etc.

There's just no need to carry around 10K in cash anymore like the old coots used to when flying their fancy G-II's around the world (they have these funny things called ATMs now)

Just be sure your handler secures credit etc for fuel/handling/landing fees/catering in out of way places. The only place in the world I ever had to pay anything in cash was Indonesia and Nigeria...and this was 5+ years ago.

Handler/CDC can likely advise on shots. ARINC has a decent summary on their site - but I would personally just call my own Doctor. If you have the standard Hepatitis etc shots you are likely all set.
 

Latest resources

Back
Top