Fast track, first officer programs PFT website

[lowtimeguy]

Okay, here is a site in the making giving some advice and info about these programs. I would love to get more input on what other things need to be asked, and other points to be brought up. Suggestions needed!

And may I ask Flight Info to allow me to use the link to these forums in the following page?

Beware the Fast Track to Airlines & First Officer Programs

Thanks.

 

[CDVdriver]

Very good...

Very good post, I think a lot of people have been waiting for something like this.
Getting access to good info can definitely be a problem in the aviation training world.
Moderators can this post be made a sticky (or whatever you call it so it stays on top of the list)?

 

[BankAccount=0$]

Lowtimeguy, you might want to post a link to www.redtrainer.org on that website as well.
It is the site put up by the many folks who were absolutly scammed by the Airline Training Academy
in Orlando, Fl. There is some really scary info on that site.
I don't want this to be misread, but one of the former management team at the above
mentioned flight school is also involved in a little PFT factory known as TAB Express. While
he wasn't an owner of ATA, I would be VERY cautious in dealing with anybody who was
associated with ATA in anyway.

 

[bobbysamd]

Anti-P-F-T website

I love it!! It needs an attention-grabbing URL, something like www.ihatepft.org. (This is a made-up URL; it won't link to anything, unless lowtimeguy registers it for his website.)

Along with the background-checking and other links, you might add links regarding consumer protection laws, legal resources, and links to media articles about these places. I believe a Florida newspaper and/or TV station reported on the ATA debacle.

Speaking from a legal standpoint, be careful that you post only factual information on the site. Posting accusations and slams without a factual basis could invite a defamation suit.

Go for it!! Aside from my fervent and unshakable belief that one does not buy a job, my second reaction to P-F-T years ago was fraud and conjob.

 

[lowtimeguy]

Great suggestions!

Thanks everyone, for the suggestions. Am working on them all!

I have configured the metatags on the page so that the page (hopefully) will come up in an internet search right amidst the shining beacons of expensive hope.

As much as I love ihatepft.com, that won't help anyone who has never even heard of PFT, and I suspect most who get into these programs have never even heard of PFT. They won't know they hate it til it's too late!
My goal is to provide a guide for the hopefuls to, at the very least, make an informed decision before they sign.
For those who don't use the internet much, heaven help them.

Any suggestions on questions that should be asked, and what answers should set off alarms?

 

[de727ups]

Anyplace that promises you a job should set off alarms. I'd want to see the fine print that backs up their promise.

Anyplace that discourages you from becoming a CFI should set off alarms. Building time as a CFI is a great way to learn and is the time honored way of working your way up. There are other ways to build time, too, but if the school says you won't need the CFI if you follow "our program", I'd worry.

My opinion, but 300 hour pilots don't belong in the right seat of a jet. Any school that promises that should be looked at very carefully. This isn't necessarily PFT, though, so it's a "grey area".

 

[standaman]

Good stuff. Very important to ask questions before you committ to anything.

 

[bobbysamd]

Adhesion contracts and P-F-T

Any suggestions on questions that should be asked . . . .

Nice link to the Contracts Law lesson.

You might add something about contracts of adhesion. A contract of adhesion is basically one where the terms are skewed toward one party with no meeting of the minds on the terms, i.e. take-it-or-leave-it, such as described on this link I found:

[font=arial, helvetica, swiss]adhesion contract
n.(contract of adhesion) a contract (often a signed form) so imbalanced in favor of one party over the other that there is a strong implication it was not freely bargained. Example: a rich landlord dealing with a poor tenant who has no choice and must accept all terms of a lease, no matter how restrictive or burdensome, since the tenant cannot afford to move. An adhesion contract can give the little guy the opportunity to claim in court that the contract with the big shot is invalid. This doctrine should be used and applied more often, but the same big guy-little guy inequity may apply in the ability to afford a trial or find and pay a resourceful lawyer.[/font]

Bear in mind that not all contracts of adhesion are illegal, such as ones for insurance, or simpler ones where by signing you state that you agree with all terms. I'm not an attorney, but I would submit that good contract attorneys could challenge many P-F-T contracts as contracts of adhesion.

Hope that helps your website some more.

 

[lowtimeguy]

Y'all are super! The page is getting bigger and better. Keep the suggestions coming!

Thanks! Hope it saves a few.

 

[TEXAN AVIATOR]

But all the coolest guys PFT, I wanna be cool too!

 

[halfmoon]

Just looked at the sight www.redtrainer.org . Too bad for all the students that lost upwards of 60K.

Couldn't you hire a PI or the like to track the CEO/Owners down, find their address and take them out?

 

[ch47fe]

TAB Express -Steve Drummond-

ALAS!! Someone throwing around the old ATA scam.

The person in reference is Steve Drummond that is a recruiter at TAB Express.

I would not listen to a word that spews out of his filthy sewer because he should be in jail for lying to students and being a fraud in business.

I called the school and asked where Steve came from and was told he "Helped save students from loosing their loan money before the school closed"

This guy had to be crappin' bricks about going to jail when all of this hit the fan. But guess what he never had to worry about it because the group never came up with enough money put him under oath.

He personally lied to me about his ratings when I visited the school. What a liar.

Good Luck in aviation...

 

[Timebuilder]

As amusing as I find it, I'd remove the contract made by "Idiot, The Village" becuase it can detract from the professionalism of the information you offer on the site.

Second, I would have a section that points out that there is never a shortage of pilots, and there will NEVER be a shortage of pilots. The only thing that changes is the level of experience that is acceptable to the airlines. Right now, the pool of available pilots is large and has vast experience.

Last, I'd point out that pilot wages, measured by purchasing power (real dollars) is in a decline due to market forces such as the glut of available pilots and the willingness of young people to take almost any flying job for next to nothing in the hope that it will somehow pay off in the long run. Unwittingly, they have created an industry-wide expectation of willingness to accept low pay for all but the top jobs, the jobs that most pilots will never attain.

There is a fast track. It leads straight to the poorhouse.