Endorsement on Student Pilot Certificate

[AJL5236]

Here is my situation. I have a student who I was flying with over the summer and I endorsed him (on the back of his medical/student pilot cert. and in his logbook) for a C-152 aircraft. I did presolo training with him in this aircraft and also xc training and gave him the proper endorsements. This Fall he went to a flight school in KDAB and was flying a C-172SP there. His instructor endorsed his logbook and the medical/student pilot certificate for a C-172SP. In his logbook the instructor put SP after all of the C172 endorsements.

My question is... Does this limit this student to only be able to fly a C172SP for his checkride. Can he use a C172R model? or is it because the endorsements specify a C172SP that he is limited to the C172? When I was flying with the student we never completed XC training in the C152. He did all of his solo XC in a C172SP.

Thanks for clearing this up for me. A link to where i can find this info would be greatly appreciated Thanksl.

 

[midlifeflyer]

My question is... Does this limit this student to only be able to fly a C172SP for his checkride.

It limits the student's ability to fly anything other than a 172S =solo=. It doesn't limit what he flies on the checkride.

There really isn't any official guidance on how model-specific the student endorsements have to be. I've never seen one, for example that limits a student to a "172N". But with the change in the R & S models to fuel injection, I've seen a lot of CFIs (me included) limit the endorsement to one group or the other by using "172N&P" or "172R&S". Although I haven't seen it done that much, I can see a CFI deciding to treat the 160 HP R and the 180 HP S differently because of different performance characteristics.

That kind of detail is definitely authorized by 61.87(l)(1) "An endorsement from an authorized instructor on his or her student pilot certificate for the =specific make and model= aircraft to be flown." The more common broader endorsement is implied by 61.87(1)(i) which authorizes CFIs to give endorsement of a make/model if the CFI has "Given that student pilot training in the make and model of aircraft =or a similar make and model= of aircraft in which the solo flight is to be flown"

But that's solo. The checkride is different. Remember that a certificate applicant is not soloing (neither technically or in reality - there's definitely someone else on board) . Although for unrelated reasons, remember that most applicants for a multi-engine rating have never soloed or received a solo endorsement. So restrictions and limitations on solo don't apply to the checkride (ever hear of a CFI making an entry removing a crosswind limitation for a checkride? It's just not needed).

The only real checkride issue is whether the CFI who hasn't seen a pilot fly a specific make/model is willing to attest to competence to pass the checkride in it.

 

[AJL5236]

The thing is that my student will be flying the C172SP solo to another airport to meet the DE.. I think I may just avoid the whole situation and have him fly our C172SP model over instead of the C172R. The reason for flying the R was to save him some money. He is pressed for time and trying to get his PPL before Jan. 5th. Thanks for the reply.

 

[AJL5236]

The thing is that my student will be flying the C172SP solo to another airport to meet the DE

CORRECTION: Student was planning on flying the C172 R for the checkride/DE.