Does ALPA speak for ASA pilots

[EMB to CRJ]

I know pilots don't buy airplanes, we don't care about who gets new airplanes or if we loose the ones we have, no pay cuts, we have to have the best contract as so on. That is what the Union is saying all ASA pilots want. Is that true? No pay cut for the 700 and instructors but what about all the people that fly the 200. If SKW gets 13 700 and all the 900 we will have to many pilots and every one will move back and some will probably go on the street. That is for those of you who only think in pay rates per hour a pay cut for most of the ASA pilots. Not getting an upgrade or having to come in to do a 4 day vs. a 3 day or no longer having weekend off wow that is so much better that is is now. I want to get my time and move on, I will never fly a 700 or 900 if all goes well. There is nothing stopping them from taking all of ASA 700 and moving them to SKY. For the pilots at SKW that gives them more upgrades, better schedules, more time at home. Does the top 20-30 of the pilots get a little more per hour on the 700-900 to do the same thing as a 200 pilot no, but a lot more pilots will move to the left seat, get better schedules, get the pic time and move on. Which way do you think is better, having growth where every one sees an improvement or going on strike loosing weeks of pay to get an industry leading contract only to have all our jobs slowly take away? You may say company Kool Aid but is there an example of recent events where unions have been able to hold on to the old way of thinking with out the people loosing there jobs(polar/atlas great contract after the strike but now a meager that will put people on the street, northwest MTX no jobs)? For those people who say they don't care if ASA goes away, or they don't want the job anyway please leave now don't make me give up what I have worked for just for the sake of stopping the "race to the bottom"

 

[SuperKooter]

ASAs MEC lives in its own world and doesn't a clue what the reality of the situation is. They will risk putting 300 people on the street if it means getting a few more bucks on an airplane that is less than 1/4 of the fleet. The only people drinking Koolaid is ALPA. Most people act pro-alpa because they think it makes them cool, but really all it does is just shows their ignorance.

 

[FishandFly]

ASAs MEC lives in its own world and doesn't a clue what the reality of the situation is. They will risk putting 300 people on the street if it means getting a few more bucks on an airplane that is less than 1/4 of the fleet. The only people drinking Koolaid is ALPA. Most people act pro-alpa because they think it makes them cool, but really all it does is just shows their ignorance.

Lebreque, You don't really have 5000 hours do you?

 

[Smacktard]

I know pilots don't buy airplanes, we don't care about who gets new airplanes or if we loose the ones we have, no pay cuts, we have to have the best contract as so on. That is what the Union is saying all ASA pilots want. Is that true? No pay cut for the 700 and instructors but what about all the people that fly the 200. If SKW gets 13 700 and all the 900 we will have to many pilots and every one will move back and some will probably go on the street. That is for those of you who only think in pay rates per hour a pay cut for most of the ASA pilots. Not getting an upgrade or having to come in to do a 4 day vs. a 3 day or no longer having weekend off wow that is so much better that is is now. I want to get my time and move on, I will never fly a 700 or 900 if all goes well. There is nothing stopping them from taking all of ASA 700 and moving them to SKY. For the pilots at SKW that gives them more upgrades, better schedules, more time at home. Does the top 20-30 of the pilots get a little more per hour on the 700-900 to do the same thing as a 200 pilot no, but a lot more pilots will move to the left seat, get better schedules, get the pic time and move on. Which way do you think is better, having growth where every one sees an improvement or going on strike loosing weeks of pay to get an industry leading contract only to have all our jobs slowly take away? You may say company Kool Aid but is there an example of recent events where unions have been able to hold on to the old way of thinking with out the people loosing there jobs(polar/atlas great contract after the strike but now a meager that will put people on the street, northwest MTX no jobs)? For those people who say they don't care if ASA goes away, or they don't want the job anyway please leave now don't make me give up what I have worked for just for the sake of stopping the "race to the bottom"

Fracture the group...pit the 200 majority against the 700 minority. The only thing I can offer is that with Delta's new TA opening up the number of 700's DCI can fly (an additional 130), what happens if you vote this reduction of 70 seat pay thru and the company starts swapping 50's for 70's? Where does that leave you? Making less than you are now and working for a company that didn't level with you during 'negotiations'. Don't throw it all away based on what one side claims. I'm not saying accept what the other side throws out. As always, it's something in between.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

ASAs MEC lives in its own world and doesn't a clue what the reality of the situation is. They will risk putting 300 people on the street if it means getting a few more bucks on an airplane that is less than 1/4 of the fleet. The only people drinking Koolaid is ALPA. Most people act pro-alpa because they think it makes them cool, but really all it does is just shows their ignorance.

Quick idiot, who is on the MEC?

Where do they get their direction?

How do they make their decisions?

You have probably never even MET a single member of the MEC or the CNC.

Yet you can come on here and flap your gums about the MEC living in their own little world.

You don't know jack.

 

[outtahere]

For all you MEC bashers you should understand that it is an all volunteer force and you have the oportunity at any time to throw your hat in the ring and further your agenda! Untill then shut up and repeat after me MY UNION SPEAKS FOR ME!!!!

 

[SuperKooter]

Untill then shut up and repeat after me MY UNION SPEAKS FOR ME!!!!

But it doesn't

 

[outtahere]

But it doesn't

You can leave ASA just as easy as you came here, I am sure no one would miss you.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

But it doesn't

Not you retard management lurker. But the majority of the people actually employed as pilots at ASA.

You are rediculous as D' Angelo and you are going on the IG LIST too.

Troll.

 

[EMB to CRJ]

Fracture the group...pit the 200 majority against the 700 minority. The only thing I can offer is that with Delta's new TA opening up the number of 700's DCI can fly (an additional 130), what happens if you vote this reduction of 70 seat pay thru and the company starts swapping 50's for 70's? Where does that leave you? Making less than you are now and working for a company that didn't level with you during 'negotiations'. Don't throw it all away based on what one side claims. I'm not saying accept what the other side throws out. As always, it's something in between.

Smackard
If we went to one rate and the 50s were changed for 70s how would that result in a reduction of pay for some one on the 50? Best case we would get more total airplanes worst we would stay the same. I don't want to put the 700 against the 200 but I do want what is best for me and my family and loosing airplanes for the sake of the 70 seat rate is not it. Maybe a grandfather clause for existing 700 pilots I don't know. It sucks that it has come to this but there nothing ALPA can do to get SkyWest INC to pay us more(and no way an addtional 10% more) to do the exact same thing SkyWest, Comair, Mesa, CHQ ect. will do for less .

 

[SuperKooter]

You can leave ASA just as easy as you came here, I am sure no one would miss you.

I shouldn't have to be a member of ALPA to be employed by ASA. What ever happened to that thing called "Free Association" Its a crime that 2% of my paycheck goes to them and I can't do a thing about it. They ARE like Mafia Kingpins

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Smackard
If we went to one rate and the 50s were changed for 70s how would that result in a reduction of pay for some one on the 50? Best case we would get more total airplanes worst we would stay the same. I don't want to put the 700 against the 200 but I do want what is best for me and my family and loosing airplanes for the sake of the 70 seat rate is not it. Maybe a grandfather clause for existing 700 pilots I don't know. It sucks that it has come to this but there nothing ALPA can do to get SkyWest INC to pay us more(and no way an addtional 10% more) to do the exact same thing SkyWest, Comair, Mesa, CHQ ect. will do for less .

Then give the aircraft to SkyWest. Reduce the ASA fleet thereby raising the casm thru the roof and make us MORE expensive. That makes lots of sense.

If ASA needs to go away then so be it.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I shouldn't have to be a member of ALPA to be employed by ASA. What ever happened to that thing called "Free Association" Its a crime that 2% of my paycheck goes to them and I can't do a thing about it. They ARE like Mafia Kingpins

Then quit *************************...

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Anybody starting to see the similarities between the postings of Duh Angelo and SuperKooter?

You blew your cover by completely going insane on these ASA threads.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Then give the aircraft to SkyWest. Reduce the ASA fleet thereby raising the casm thru the roof and make us MORE expensive. That makes lots of sense.

If ASA needs to go away then so be it.

True - and that is where I think things are headed.

 

[Tomct]

:angryfireFins if that is true, then so be it! I will NOT give them a paycut when they are rolling in the cash and yet WE NOT skywst are the MOST PROFITABLE!! By more than 13%.

EMB, you better look at the 50 payrates. We are LESS expensive and if we were to take a paycut on the70's, guess what.....all of our 50's will go away and there will be a LOAD of 70's brought on property and for what......50 seat pay. You have got to be sh@tting me!! That is NOT GOOD FOR ANYONE!!! Don't believe all that mgmnt has said, look at what BL told us about those 700's that went to skywst. They were already headed there over a year before, but BL was just trying to split up the pilot group and make them feel like we were losing them due to the LACK of progress on the contract. Yeeeeaaahhhhh RIIIIIGHT!!! MMMMMMKAY! Mgmnt has NEVER told us the TRUTH!!! Grow a PAIR and STAND WITH US on the STRIKE VOTE!!! YES FOR ME BABY!!

 

[pipejockey]

Please guys, stop the madness. Even if it means hardship for some of the folks at ASA. If you stand firm, you might give other pilot groups at other carriers the balls to stand up and say, "we're not gonna take it anymore!!" And sooner or later, we as pilots will have the upper hand, and they will run out of dirt cheap regionals to pick up the load. Lets start creating BETTER contracts instead of worse ones for a change. It's time to turn the tide and stuff it right down managements throats until they choke!! I wish I was there with you so I could at least do my share. I think Mesa's contract is up next year, give them the courage to stand strong, and every other regional with pending contract negotiations. Regional pilots were paid dirt wages to start with, and managemnt has the audacity to ask for cuts? Outrageous.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Pipejockey I'm with you, but we have been undermined at every turn by our own union.

The only reason why we have this "race for the bottom" is because ALPA National has not provided the same level of representation for "regional" pilots.

If the ASA pilots fall on their sword, it will be the right thing to do for our profession, but the wrong thing to do for the individual pilots. The flying will still be done at concessionary wages by Skywest, Mesa, or Chautauqua pilots. The net effect is nearly zilch.

If the pay rates were such a big issue Jerry Atkin could have folded ASA into Skywest and made Skywest's agreement stick. He probably could have gotten ALPA booted from th property as well by merging us and forcing a representational vote - BUT THAT WAS NEVER THE PLAN. Atkin wanted the SLC 700 operation and the ATL gates. He did not want ASA and doesn't want ASA now. If we surprised him with some super low pay rates then it might make a short term difference, but Skywest is Jerry's airline. ASA will be shrunk out of existence until the day when he pulls the plug there will not be many left to cry about it.

ASA is history. Our pilots could not save it if they wanted to.

Taking our airplanes was an offensive move - Jerry and the ASA management are now "the enemy." They are acting against the best interest of our employer. We should treat them accordingly.

STRIKE VOTE NOW!

 

[Texx]

I shouldn't have to be a member of ALPA to be employed by ASA. What ever happened to that thing called "Free Association" Its a crime that 2% of my paycheck goes to them and I can't do a thing about it. They ARE like Mafia Kingpins

The clause was here before you came. The ASA pilots did not force you to come work here. That was your choice.

 

[scarlet]

ALPA lost the fight long time ago---we should get the skywest contract and be done--

 

[USCtrojan]

Fins!!

Pipejockey I'm with you, but we have been undermined at every turn by our own union.

The only reason why we have this "race for the bottom" is because ALPA National has not provided the same level of representation for "regional" pilots.

If the ASA pilots fall on their sword, it will be the right thing to do for our profession, but the wrong thing to do for the individual pilots. The flying will still be done at concessionary wages by Skywest, Mesa, or Chautauqua pilots. The net effect is nearly zilch.

If the pay rates were such a big issue Jerry Atkin could have folded ASA into Skywest and made Skywest's agreement stick. He probably could have gotten ALPA booted from th property as well by merging us and forcing a representational vote - BUT THAT WAS NEVER THE PLAN. Atkin wanted the SLC 700 operation and the ATL gates. He did not want ASA and doesn't want ASA now. If we surprised him with some super low pay rates then it might make a short term difference, but Skywest is Jerry's airline. ASA will be shrunk out of existence until the day when he pulls the plug there will not be many left to cry about it.

ASA is history. Our pilots could not save it if they wanted to.

Taking our airplanes was an offensive move - Jerry and the ASA management are now "the enemy." They are acting against the best interest of our employer. We should treat them accordingly.

STRIKE VOTE NOW!

Fins you nailed it!! I believe if we take a concessionary contract ASA will slowly die over the next 8 years as assets are transferred to Skywest INC. Or we take a strike vote, get our cooling off period and see all the cards NOW!

Trojan

 

[scarlet]

ALPA does not speak for me!!--

 

[cushman_500]

I know pilots don't buy airplanes, we don't care about who gets new airplanes or if we loose the ones we have, no pay cuts, we have to have the best contract as so on. That is what the Union is saying all ASA pilots want. Is that true? No pay cut for the 700 and instructors but what about all the people that fly the 200. If SKW gets 13 700 and all the 900 we will have to many pilots and every one will move back and some will probably go on the street. That is for those of you who only think in pay rates per hour a pay cut for most of the ASA pilots. Not getting an upgrade or having to come in to do a 4 day vs. a 3 day or no longer having weekend off wow that is so much better that is is now. I want to get my time and move on, I will never fly a 700 or 900 if all goes well. There is nothing stopping them from taking all of ASA 700 and moving them to SKY. For the pilots at SKW that gives them more upgrades, better schedules, more time at home. Does the top 20-30 of the pilots get a little more per hour on the 700-900 to do the same thing as a 200 pilot no, but a lot more pilots will move to the left seat, get better schedules, get the pic time and move on. Which way do you think is better, having growth where every one sees an improvement or going on strike loosing weeks of pay to get an industry leading contract only to have all our jobs slowly take away? You may say company Kool Aid but is there an example of recent events where unions have been able to hold on to the old way of thinking with out the people loosing there jobs(polar/atlas great contract after the strike but now a meager that will put people on the street, northwest MTX no jobs)? For those people who say they don't care if ASA goes away, or they don't want the job anyway please leave now don't make me give up what I have worked for just for the sake of stopping the "race to the bottom"

you aren't going to go anywhere and if you are please leave now. all of you that think this magical 1000 hours of pic is going to come and then, poof, you will be somewhere else, are just simply dumb.

you are willing to sacrifice any amount just to make sure us junior guys are going to be around, for what, just so i can make less than a hamburger flipper. thanks for your help you moron.

we are in this situation because people like you are willing to do this job for peanuts thinking that you will upgrade and be gone after 1000 pic.

MY UNION SPEAKS FOR ME!

for all of you that think we make too much, please don't bother us, go to mesa and get treated and paid exactly what you want

 

[atlcrjdriver]

Cush, how long do thing we will stay in business with these industry leading wages the CNC has proposed. If passed, we will be the highest paid regional on all fleets in DCI. Our only feed is DL, they may love our product but that love only goes so far. The union may speak for us but left unchecked they can also drive us into the ground.

You must be competative to stay in business. If you are not competative those profit margins they boost about will go away faster than JA can shift more 70s to SKW.

 

[cushman_500]

our mec is not unchecked, do you think they just spent a bunch of money with the wilson polling center to see how many of our pilots they could annoy. and last i checked our union leaders are volunteer pilots, as well as elected individuals.

the union is not trying to drive us into the ground, if we are making money hand over fist in our current pay scale, why do we need a paycut anywhere in a new contract.

if skywest inc. transfers all of the 70s to skywest the so be it, but don't think that they are doing it because our prices are uncompetitive, it is because the skywest pilots have no one looking out for their best intrest.

 

[shamrock]

Cush, how long do thing we will stay in business with these industry leading wages the CNC has proposed.

How long can (should) we stay in business with an industry leading profit margin?

 

[MXAV8R]

ALPA lost the fight long time ago---we should get the skywest contract and be done--

We are not Skywest:
OPERATING COST PER BLOCK HOUR FOR 70

FLIGHT CREW COST ASA$322 SKY$327 CMR$338

We are already cheaper...
Make more profit...
AND we should get a PAY CUT?!?!?!

Come on people this had got to stop. What about scope? All this means $hit with out protection.

 

[Tomct]

atlcrj, STOP this "top pay" CRAP!! Horizon is the top pay and yet you seem to forget about that!! We will meet in the middle on the pay, but there is NO WAY I am taking a pay cut when we are already the "CHEAPEST" operator!! How DEAF are you...."THE CHEAPEST!!!"

 

[ASADriver]

atlcrj, STOP this "top pay" CRAP!! Horizon is the top pay and yet you seem to forget about that!! We will meet in the middle on the pay, but there is NO WAY I am taking a pay cut when we are already the "CHEAPEST" operator!! How DEAF are you...."THE CHEAPEST!!!"

Horizon isn't competing with us for flying.

ALPA isn't speaking for me right now.

 

[Tomct]

Okaaaaay, so what part of the DOT#41 filing did you NOT understand. We are already ....Now Listen Up...."THE CHEAPEST!!!" ALPA speaks for ME!