Correct Equipment Suffix

[starcheckdriver]

We have a Lear 60 with the old Collins FMS 850. We received the bulletin from Collins stating it is not approved for RNAV SIDs and STARs because you have no database for the SIDS/STARS. The only way to input them is to build them manually which is forbidden by FAA AC 90-100. My question is this:

What is the proper equipment suffix for us (we are RVSM capable)? /K? /W?

We filed /K (FMS and RVSM) the other day and were given the JAIKE STAR into TEB which is an RNAV STAR. We refused and the controller said we should be able to do it based on the /K suffix. He said if we can't we need to file /W next time which is basically /A with RVSM. Any insight would be appreciated!

 

[charter dog]

starcheckdriver:

I'd probably just file /K. No other suffix describes your navigational capabilities with any more fidelity. Maybe file non-RNAV SIDs and STARs and a note in the remarks. Yes, you'll still have to develop a succinct way to refuse these procedures when offered without eliciting a debate on the frequency. Maybe "Unable due to RNP" or something like that. Maybe that will be less of a hassle than flying /W. Shame they don't publish a suffix for equipment that can navigate to allmost any fix in the NAS, yet can't do "canned" terminal procedures. Oh well.

Best,

 

[starcheckdriver]

Why would you not file /W? According to the AC about equipment suffixes, /W still allows you fly direct to any fix.

 

[Headwind]

In my case (dual GNSxls & RVSM) we can do R-Nav sid's & stars, but not class A. We file /L.

 

[rickair7777]

I'm in the same situation with Collins, and we use /W. We can go direct to RNAV waypoints, but we don't have "official" RNP for RNAV DP/STARs

 

[starcheckdriver]

Thanks for the info.....anyone else have experience with the Collins and this issue?

 

[GravityHater]

I think you are /L (unless the Collins is an RNP navigation unit).... see below. We had a long discussion about this last year - I wonder if its in the archives. This is the same problem as the almost-orphaned GNS-xLS.

[SIZE=-1]Suffix[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]Equipment Capability[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]NO DME[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/X[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]No transponder[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/T[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]Transponder with no Mode C[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/U[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]Transponder with Mode C[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]DME[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/D[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]No transponder[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/B[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]Transponder with no Mode C[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/A[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]Transponder with Mode C[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]TACAN ONLY[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/M[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]No transponder[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/N[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]Transponder with no Mode C[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/P[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]Transponder with Mode C[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]AREA NAVIGATION (RNAV)[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/Y[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]LORAN, VOR/DME, or INS with no transponder[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/C[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]LORAN, VOR/DME, or INS, transponder with no Mode C[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/I[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]LORAN, VOR/DME, or INS, transponder with Mode C[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]ADVANCED RNAV WITH TRANSPONDER AND MODE C[/SIZE][SIZE=-1] (If an aircraft is unable to operate with a transponder and/or Mode C, it will revert to the appropriate code listed above under Area Navigation.)[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]/E[/SIZE] Flight Management System (FMS) with DME/DME and IRU position updating
[SIZE=-1]/F[/SIZE] FMS with DME/DME position updating [SIZE=-1]
/G[/SIZE] Global Navigation Satellite System (GNSS), including GPS or Wide Area Augmentation System (WAAS), with en route and terminal capability. [SIZE=-1]
/R[/SIZE] Required Navigational Performance (RNP). The aircraft meets the RNP type prescribed for the route segment(s), route(s) and/or area concerned.
Reduced Vertical Separation Minimum (RVSM). Prior to conducting RVSM operations within the U.S., the operator must obtain authorization from the FAA or from the responsible authority, as appropriate.
/J /E with RVSM
/K /F with RVSM
/L /G with RVSM
/Q /R with RVSM
/W RVSM​

 

[SabreFlyR]

In my case (dual GNSxls & RVSM) we can do R-Nav sid's & stars, but not class A. We file /L.

You better take another look at AC90-100, the GNSxls is not approved for type A or B sid's and stars. Fortunately Honeywell has published a S/B stating that a fix will be available by years end or early 2007.

This right off of the Honeywell website in reference to the AC.
GNS-XLS, GNS-XL, CDU-XLS, GNS-XES, KLN-900 Series FMS and KLN-89B, KLN-90B,
KLN-94 Series GPS Navigation systems approved to TSO C-129 and installed in compliance
with AC 20-130A or AC 20-138A are approved for RNAV “Q” routes and Obstacle Departure
Procedures. Eligibility is established under TSO C-129 or TSO C-129a, Class A1 per paragraph
7.c.(3). These systems are not compliant with RNAV Type A and Type B SID/STAR procedures
defined in AC 90-100. If your specific GNS FMS or KLN GPS is not listed above, please refer to
the AC 90-100 Compliance Table located on the FAA website for compliance status. The link to
this website is listed in section 4 of this document.

 

[GravityHater]

You better take another look at AC90-100, the GNSxls is not approved for type A or B sid's and stars. Fortunately Honeywell has published a S/B stating that a fix will be available by years end or early 2007.


He's filing the right thing (/L); but his description of his capability is incorrect I believe
/L is "/G with RVSM" so that sounds right
but I don't think he can accept an rnav sid/star

 

[starcheckdriver]

GPS units like the KLN and Garmins can't do RNAV SIDs and STARs? I thought these units had them programmed in their database?