Changing Frequency after clearing the Runway

[TheRaven]

Reading Aim 4-3-20, it doesn't say you should change to ground automatically if tower has said nothing....no "Join Bravo and contact ground, taxi to the gate this freq etc. Basically you roll out and clear the runway....what next.

I contend that the tower must switch you, or provide taxi instructions until they switch you, otherwise, you come to a stop once past the hold short/clear line and querry them....you can't switch to ground automatically.

The person I'm having the disagreement with seems to think that switching to the published ground frequency immediately is ok if you haven't heard from tower.

I was reprimanded about switching automatically years ago (I believe it was LGA ground), but it seems that the wording has changed to be a little more ambiguous.

Any controllers here want to reference 7110.65 and tell me what the official word on it is.

 

[kf4amu]

You have the AIM on your side. Why is there even an argument?

 

[atl pilot]

The AIM is correct. There's nothing that mandates what pilots should do in the 7110.65. The two documents (AIM & 7110.65) work inconjunction with one another. If you have cleared the runway and not been given any instructions by the local (Tower) controller....then ask! Do NOT just switch to GC.

The one and only exception I can think of is if local is having a stuck mike or some radio problem. Then I would make the change on my own.

 

[TheRaven]

Exactly what I thought, but I was told I was wrong in my interpretation of the AIM by my FO. Looks like he's buying the beer.

 

[pilot125]

Quoting the AIM is fine, I agree that it states that you should not switch over to ground unless directed to by tower (though, I don't have the AIM in front of me).

But it has been a generally accepted method to do so without being told by tower. Many of us do it this way, right or wrong.

The AIM also states that one should pronounce the number 3 as "tree", but I have rarely flown with anyone who says it that way. Maybe more controllers do say it the right way, but not all of them.

Not saying to ignore the AIM, just saying there is the AIM way of doing things, and there is the generally accepted way of doing things.

 

[BEfly]

Good to know. I've done that a number of times.

 

[atl pilot]

Don't do it in ATL. You'll find yourself a pilot deviation really quick!!

 

[Say Again Over]

But it has been a generally accepted method to do so without being told by tower. Many of us do it this way, right or wrong.

Yes but understanding what you are supposed do is the subject here and will keep you out of trouble when away from podunk airport.

 

[atl pilot]

Its in the AIM. Dont switch until instructed to do so by GC anywhere, espicailly in the era of runway safety awareness and focus. If the controllers get pissed when you ask if its time to switch, then thats their problem. Don't let some lazy controllers lure you into a possible certificate action. Do it right all the time and you won't have to worry. You never know when a new air traffic manager might take over who lowers the boom, or a FSDO guy sits nearby listening to the scanner to randomly catch y'all doing something wrong. Its all taped. They have no action to take against you for doing it right. Its your ticket, do you really want to be the one they decide to make an example of for something so small and menial?

 

[Rally]

Nothing ever happens until you are not doing what you are supposed to be doing. I love people that make up their own procedures. There is a reason the FEDs make up these rules, some of them dumb or silly in certain situations follow them and everyone is on the same page! Sometimes you will sit there for what seems to be a eternity waiting for tower to tell you to switch.

 

[Mr. Irrelevant]

Its in the AIM. Dont switch until instructed to do so by GC anywhere, espicailly in the era of runway safety awareness and focus. If the controllers get pissed when you ask if its time to switch, then thats their problem. Don't let some lazy controllers lure you into a possible certificate action. Do it right all the time and you won't have to worry. You never know when a new air traffic manager might take over who lowers the boom, or a FSDO guy sits nearby listening to the scanner to randomly catch y'all doing something wrong. Its all taped. They have no action to take against you for doing it right. Its your ticket, do you really want to be the one they decide to make an example of for something so small and menial?

Incorrect. It is in the AIM that you should contact tower once completing your taxi when reaching the runway or in the runup block. This is the only time I know of when you should switch frequencies without being instructed to do so.

Mr. I.

 

[Say Again Over]

Incorrect. It is in the AIM that you should contact tower once completing your taxi when reaching the runway or in the runup block. This is the only time I know of when you should switch frequencies without being instructed to do so

Good as a general rule but don't take to the bank (like LAX or SFO), never assume this recommendation out of the USA.

 

[atl pilot]

Mr. I,
That was a typo, it should read do not switch to GC until told to do so by LC. Sorry. You rae right in the context in which you offered it. Thanks.

 

[Erlanger]

Screw the controller. The AIM is not regulatory. Where does it say in the FARs that you can't switch freqs?

 

[Say Again Over]

The AIM is a good starting point, knowing local procedures and common sense go a long way.

 

[pilot125]

I'm guessing you guys (and girls) also drive exactly 45 MPH when the speed limit is posted 45! (not 1 MPH over or under). If your driving 46 MPH, your breaking the law.

I agree, one should take into consideration common sense and local procedures, very good point.

And yes, the AIM is NOT regulatory, though one can get "careless and reckless" if one completely ignores certain practices in the AIM. I'm just saying, contacting ground after clearing the runway without tower telling you to do so, will NOT get you violated......unless you screw something else up in doing so!

 

[135Drvr]

Screw the controller. The AIM is not regulatory. Where does it say in the FARs that you can't switch freqs?

Glad you wrote that. Too many folks see the AIM as regulatory - it's NOT. Read the title - it's recommended practices and procedures.

Most airports have their practices published in the jepps if it's out of the norm. They'll specifically say to/ or not to contact ground/tower whatever, if it makes it easier for them. (See AMS)

If you're not sure what to do - ASK. If you switch and they didn't what you to, they'll switch you back to where you came from. It's not rocket science ! .. and you can't get Violated for switching to ground/tower unless you were specifically told not to and then you do it anyway.

If you're "familiar" with an airport, you know what to expect. Sometimes the controller gets busy and forgets to switch you. There's no foul in changing freqs if you know it's coming anyway. If you want to get anal about it just say: " so and so to go to ground/tower? " and wait for him/her to specifically send you. Either way, you're OK to do it.

Common sense??

 

[sqwkvfr]

OK, how about the test question on the Private Pilot written that asks "When do you switch to ground control?"

The answer?: "When advised by the tower to do so."

It's been in the question bank since Christ was a Corporal.

 

[Lrjtcaptain]

DO NOT JUST SWITCH FREQUENCY ON YOUR OWN!!!!! Owe the problems. Just because its a published frequency doens't mean the controller is going to be on it. We have 2 grounds and about 5 different freq's we could use.

Rule of thumb....Controller tells you to turn off at M3 and head for delta then do it and wait until instructed to contact ground.

Controller tells you to turn off at M3 and head for delta and remain with them then do it.

If a controller tells you to turn off at M3 and that is the end of it, turn at M3, clear the runway and ask for further instructions, ie a taxi route or frequency change but if you just clear an active runway and then switch on your own then you are going to have some upset controllers becuase nothing is worse then blocking a highspeed, nothing is worse then having a plane wondering around not talking to anyone when we have 40 other planes moving out there.

DON'T JUST SWITCH FREQ'S. IF YOU DO, WELL THEN YOU ARE .....WELL, IM NOT GOING TO SAY IT.