CFI Re-instatement

[U-I pilot]

Ok...I've searched the board and read the posts and still find myself questioning this from both sides...Just need a simple answer:

If you have a CFI Airplane, and it is now expired, can you take a CFI-I practical to reinstate the entire Flight instructor certificate or is the original CFI still expired?

I realize if the CFI is NOT expired the new rating will renew the certificate but is it different once it is expired....

(BTW i have read the regs already...seems to me it can not count since it is not already on the expired certificate)
The simpler the response the better.....need clear understanding
Thank you

 

[nosehair]

Whoa-a-hh! The short answer is Yes, when you get an additional instructor rating, that renews or re-instates all of your instructor ratings. I like to reference an FAR when I give an answer, so I was looking at 61.199 and it says you can re-instate by passing a practical test for one of the ratings listed on that certificate.

Seems like a "catch-22". But I know it is done. I think maybe the examiner has to retest you for one of your expired ratings while testing for the additional rating.
I'm afraid you have opened up a can of worms here, like the "CFI checkride doesn't count as a Flight Review." It does if you get the specific flight review endorsement. I think it is just a paperwork song-and-dance on the expired CFI.
Just my 2 cents. I've not encountered this question before.

 

[U-I pilot]

thanks for the response......thats the dilema i ran into. It says to reinstate you must ride for something already on the expired certificate. So i guess unless you include the other check in the new practical it would not count....seems logical....anyone else?????

 

[midlifeflyer]

thanks for the response......thats the dilema I ran into. It says to reinstate you must ride for something already on the expired certificate. So I guess unless you include the other check in the new practical it would not count....seems logical....anyone else?????

According to a 2000 FAA Legal interpretation (pasted below - check the last large paragraph) that is quoted in the AFS-840 Part 61 FAQ, 61.199 only applies when someone wants to reinstate a CFI certificate with =only= the original set of ratings. If, on the other hand, someone with an expired CFI certificate takes a practical test for a new CFI certificate, it automatically reinstates all of the old ratings.

Note that the Legal opinion talks about general policy rather than analyzing the wording of the applicable sections. I think this is one of those areas where a technical legal reading of the FAR, which would lead to an unreasonable result, gave way to a more sensible FAA policy directive. There aren't too many examples of this.


==============================
July 14, 2000

Ms. Kathy Minner
Technical Specialist
Aviation Services Department
Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association
421 Aviation Way
Frederick, MD 21701-4798

Dear Ms. Minner:

This is in response to your letter dated February 4, 2000, to the Office of the Chief Counsel, Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), regarding section 61.199(a) (14 CFR section 61.199(a)). Specifically, you are concerned about the reinstatement of expired flight instructor certificates and ratings.

As you point out in your letter, section 61.199(a) provides, in pertinent part, that the holder of an expired flight instructor certificate may exchange that certificate for a new certificate with the same ratings by passing a practical test for one of the ratings listed on the expired flight instructor certificate. (Emphasis added)

You also point out in your letter that the General Aviation Inspector's Handbook provides, in pertinent part, that the holder of an expired flight instructor certificate may have all ratings on the certificate reinstated by satisfactorily completing a single practical test.

You think the General Aviation Inspector's Handbook indicates that “any” practical test for a flight instructor certificate or rating would reinstate the expired flight instructor certificate and all the ratings on it. Based on that, you don't think that the holder of an expired flight instructor certificate is limited to taking a practical for one of the ratings listed on the expired flight instructor certificate to reinstate it as provided for under section 61.199(a). Accordingly, you ask “may a flight instructor reinstate an expired flight instructor certificate by taking any practical test for a flight instructor certificate or rating, or must it be confined to one of those listed on the expired certificate as it seems to state in the regulation.” The answer to this question is discussed below.

Section 61.199(a) applies when the holder of an expired flight instructor certificate only seeks to have that certificate reinstated with the same ratings. It has been the policy of the Flight Standard Services (AFS-800), as articulated in the General Aviation Inspector's Handbook, to allow the holder of an expired flight instructor certificate who seeks an additional rating to one of those listed on the expired certificate, to reinstate the expired flight instructor certificate, and all the ratings on that expired certificate, by taking, and passing, a practical test for the additional rating sought. As a result, the holder of an expired flight instructor certificate may have that certificate and all of the ratings listed on it reinstated by taking, and passing, any practical test for a flight instructor certificate or rating.

I hope this satisfactorily answers your question.

Sincerely,

/s/ Donald P. Byrne
Assistant Chief Counsel
Regulations Division
==============================

 

[U-I pilot]

THANKS!

As long as everything in that letter is still interpreted as current, that makes it clear as day and makes perfect sense.

 

[bobbysamd]

All-in-one reinstatement

Good research and answer. This is one of those things that you just know but cannot find in the regs. AC 61-65D sometimes helps, but not in this case.

 

[jimtrustycfi]

CFI Reinstate

Might want to print that Reg out so that the examiner is as smart as you are.

When we get into defining what is being said, it is better to be armed with evidence. You might even talk with the examiner in advance to make sure that you both are on the same checkride. (Lrn2Fly)

 

[midlifeflyer]

When we get into defining what is being said, it is better to be armed with evidence. You might even talk with the examiner in advance to make sure that you both are on the same checkride.

Excellent suggestion. It's always a good idea to talk to the examiner in advance about any areas which might be a concern.